Meaning

[DogmaTriple6]

I have a feeling that this song is about a girl thats a virgin any one else follow me?

[Yondo]

ANAL SEX.

[Zarathustra]

this song is so obviously about sex and virginity >_>

It erks me when people come up with other theory's cause its just so goddamn obvious. It would be like saying sober isnt about alcohol >_>

[wearethestories]

this song is so obviously about sex and virginity >_>

It erks me when people come up with other theory's cause its just so goddamn obvious. It would be like saying sober isnt about alcohol >_>
it's not.

[paraflux]

this song is so obviously about sex and virginity >_>

It erks me when people come up with other theory's cause its just so goddamn obvious. It would be like saying sober isnt about alcohol >_>

It "irks" me when people are so adamant about things being a certain way that they close themselves off to everything else. Like Christians tend to do. Are you in the same boat as they?

[Zarathustra]

I'm in the boat of not looking for cryptic meanings where there arent any.

You all act as if the topic of sex isn't "deep".
Sex in my mind is a very meaningful topic and this song is in my mind an excellent example of illestrating that. So when the lyrics of a song are blatantly about sex I dont understand why that has to make it lose its value.

I mean you can say that its about something else and it could be to you , thats cool. To me it's a cleverly written song about a virgin. You can say it's about relgion or w/e but to me sex is a "deep" enough issue in a man's life to give the song meaning.

[Cha]

Exactly. Sex is the closest point where two can become one physically, mentally and spiritually.

[Melanos]

Exactly. Sex is the closest point where two can become one physically, mentally and spiritually.


spirtuallity isnt physical... in fact its the opposite.

i dont see how "mentally" falls into play with sex either...unless your "mindfucking" someone just to get a piece.

This song isnt about sex imho, do some research about 4 deg. You might find that while in a "blissful" state your body heat rises 4 degrees, i think its due to the fact that you're "driving" into yourself for the questions that matter.

Who am i? and Why am i?

not.... How will i pay these bills? or God why doesn't that guy/girl just shut her mouth?

[Melanos]

I'm in the boat of not looking for cryptic meanings where there arent any.

You all act as if the topic of sex isn't "deep".
Sex in my mind is a very meaningful topic and this song is in my mind an excellent example of illestrating that. So when the lyrics of a song are blatantly about sex I dont understand why that has to make it lose its value.

I mean you can say that its about something else and it could be to you , thats cool. To me it's a cleverly written song about a virgin. You can say it's about relgion or w/e but to me sex is a "deep" enough issue in a man's life to give the song meaning.


Millions of men have sex everyday, i dont see how thats a "deep" thing.

A handful of men actually step aside from thier point of view to look at things from a different perspective, Seeing 2 -200 different interpretations in one piece of art.....priceless. For everything else there is Mastercard (now accepted by hookers everywhere for that "deep" issue )

[Zarathustra]

^it's deep if you've ever been in love with somone.

[Melanos]

^it's deep if you've ever been in love with somone.

im sure its possible to love someone without the sex.... in fact i am willing to bet that sex is the LEAST valued thing in a loving relationship.

What about people that "cant get it up?" are they immune to loving someone?
What about people that are 30 years old, but have the mentality of a 5 year old are they incapable of knowing what love is?

If you basing your "facts of love" on material things, including sex of anykind, then you obviously dont know anything about love at its core.


oh yeah...and SOBER isnt about alcohol. "why can't we NOT be sober" double negative clearly illustrates that and right in the main line of the song too..... suprised you didnt catch it actually. When he mentions "drink forever" in the song he is talking about communion and how it was a ritual to "cleanse ones sins". and hence the
"I am just a worthless liar.
I am just an imbecile.
I will only complicate you.
Trust in me and fall as well.


I will find a center in you.
I will chew it up and leave,
I will work to elevate you
just enough to bring you down.

Trust me. "

cause we know "communion" doesnt do anything in reality, but rather its a faith based standard. Look what the christian church has done to people... brainwashed millions to think,act, and pay for faith.....kinda sad, but then again it might just work for some people. who am i to judge or strap you down?

[Zarathustra]

If you are the kind of person that has a grudge against christianity (miyself admittedly in that category) you're going to read anti christian themes into almost everything that can be taken that way. Alot of tool songs can go down that road, intolerence, opiate, sober, eulogy, the grudge, to name some.

most tool songs can be taken as love songs too, or at least songs about relationships.

So anyway back on 4 degrees. Modern society has in my mind, destroyed any real value in sex, when in fact it should be the ultimate act of love if you will.

granted erectile dysfunction comes into many mens lives and that changes that, but I dont have ED, so for now 4 degrees is about sex to me.

I hope thats ok.

[Jvx]

Zarathustra: I enjoyed tearing your book into many little pieces. It is much more interesting to read that way.

I hope that's ok.

[Zarathustra]

Your loss.

[Jvx]

Your loss.

"You say you believe in Zarathustra? But of what importance is Zarathustra?

You are my believers: but of what importance are all believers? You had not yet sought yourselves when you found me. Thus do all believers; therefore all belief is of so little account.

Now I bid you lose me and find yourselves; and only when you all have denied me will I return to you..."

-Friedrich Nietzsche

I couldn't resist posting my favorite quote. Food for thought, anyway.

[guttersnipe]

So anyway back on 4 degrees. Modern society has in my mind, destroyed any real value in sex, when in fact it should be the ultimate act of love if you will.

Just curious then how you interpret the lines:

"If you knock me down I'll come back running,
knock you down,
it won't be long now
All the way in."

Because within the context of sex and viginity that kind of implies rape to me.

Personally I think the song is about allowing a power greater than yourself into your life, which I interpret as a God or some other spitual force. Maybe its cloaked in an anal sex metaphor because a lot of people see anal sex as objectionable just like an atheist would find the idea of accepting God into their lives as objectionable. But after giving it a try you might find that you actually like it.

My $0.02

[Zarathustra]

I'd interpret that line as metaphorical for how people in relationships knock each other back and forth.

I'm not saying other interpretations don't work I just like this one >_>

As for Sober I never took it as being anti christian. More of not wanting to be reminded of every mistake one's ever made.

[ShadowSide]

I was REALLY hoping for some good interps on this song. lol. Damn!
My first thought was looking inward..I did not think about sex until the "You'll like this in..Don't pull it out" But. honestly..It all seems to be about Someone trying to help someone else FIND themselves. Maybe it's about helping someone learn to Masturbate. Ah ha ha ha. Of course digging into your self is Pure bliss.

Anyways..Coming from YEARS of therapy..my interpratation is leaning toward Someone that needs to release some pent up secrets and undo some PAIN.

[parables in the world]

I was REALLY hoping for some good interps on this song. lol. Damn!
My first thought was looking inward..I did not think about sex until the "You'll like this in..Don't pull it out" But. honestly..It all seems to be about Someone trying to help someone else FIND themselves. Maybe it's about helping someone learn to Masturbate. Ah ha ha ha. Of course digging into your self is Pure bliss.

Anyways..Coming from YEARS of therapy..my interpratation is leaning toward Someone that needs to release some pent up secrets and undo some PAIN.


yay some actual interpretations. I see it as one who is helping another to basically free himself, open his eyes, like a right of passage. This person knows that this other has some treasures burried deep within so they must go digging. He helps him find his soul, which brings us all closer together.

[JE Mack]

i feel weird writing about such an old song cuz there's no way i'll write something that's never been said but oh well, don't see it here anyway so might as well...

i feel like this song is a lot about being strong versus weak. in prison sex the main character feels weak (hands bound, raped, blah blah blah). so from that experience there's that fear and that feeling you have to be strong or else.

i like 4 degrees the best because it's kinda about the realization of that fact that if you are really strong and fearless, (and think of how many times maynards used the words fear and weakness in his lyrics of all the songs) -well, if you are really strong and fearless then you can allow yourself vulnerable ("you won't feel what you'd like to feel") and really let another person in (literally "in" as it is described in this song but it doesn't have to be literal). it's the realization that being strong isn't really about being able to keep people out ("let me in!") it's about being able to let people in. i guess he came to these realizations on his own, but that in the song he's trying to get someone else to understand it so that they'll let him in and stop living in fear and missing out on life. he seems to be talking to someone else in the song and not himself.

i think it's also about people wanting to try everything just for the experience, so they try anal sex or whatever physical experience they want to try ("lay back and let me show you another way"), but to me it sounds like he's saying you also have to open up/connect with others completely, if you want to experience as much as you can in life. "take all or nothing life's too short to push it away". i dunno though, just my thoughts.