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Old 12-15-2006, 05:50 AM   #1
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UNDERTOW (iAMtheMA!'s take)

(please be unwilling to quote the following in it's entirety as it is the thread's main statement - and a lengthy one at that)


from a flood discussion:

Quote:
Originally Posted by HelenA View Post
What does this song mean? Is it about constantly coming to grips with new realities? Or being drowned in the crap that is the world? Or just growing up? Some reference to baptism?

and this:

"i was wrong this changes everything

the water is rising up on me

thought the sun would come deliver me
but the truth has come to punish me instead"

What does THAT mean? (Has this all been covered before in times past. Lol)

good question, and i am gonna try to answer it ...but since this requires a full album interpretation, i decided that it warranted an entirely new thread.

first off, consider the possibility that "sun" could be "son". (wink!)





this is how i've been able to piece this album together thus far.

i think that since we reflect and are yet still controlled by the belief structures we've fallen to (which certainly does not limited us to whatever religions), we just keep on weakening our abilities and natural desires to understand the grand scheme, to comprehend what's beyond the restrictions of the same belief structures. and after the misinterpreted lessons of "do unto others...", we've been left to resemble a somewhat precious being, a more somber image of death ("dead as dead can be" if you will), not unlike the image of christ upon the cross. i mean, if we don't all stand for love, then what are we doing here? and then "jesus won't you fuckin' whistle something 'bout what's past and done" as if to say "what the fuck?! they're all missing the point, man - they celebrate your death in a horrible light, and then completely ignore the many teachings of your life. maybe if you could only come around again - to fix this for us all (again)." alas...

so maynard speaks up against it, he wants the world to be as one. of course we recall that the guy cannot tolerate when we "lie, cheat, and steal"; in addition to this, he feels that through the increasing and now constant reliance of time and money we are destroying that very special bridge of pure understanding. he then explains his case in prison sex (how we all appear through HIS EYES <- *important!*), and then wonders "why?", and loud enough for all of us, in sober. maynard begs us, "say you won't go". "just listen to us (see: "opiate" lyrics), take it in for what it really is - and we'll be able to overcome what's about to occur on this "cold and fated anchor" (i realize i'm crossing albums, it's the same band with the same motives/messages). i mean, "if shit adds up in the bottom" and "no one even invited us in", then... couldn't it be just as easy to accept how stupid yet belligerent ("passive aggressive"?) we've become ...and then move on? undertow (the track) suggests that we shut our mouth, submit to our current and growing atrocities, decide to fix it (this reality), and lie beneath the undertow (pressumably through meditations, and drug use*). then he tells us in the very next track (once we're "there") to "get up now and free yourselves from yourselves". basically, discover what's in all of us, 'cause it is in this appreciation that our collective essence, our oneness, is so apparent. tool indeed feels that this is paramount, or imperative, especially since the flood is coming sooner than later. the last track is basically a summary of the entire album. "this ground is not the rock i thought it would be", we must "climb to a new place now" (another reference to the meditation, me thinks). to observe examples of our convictions from more than one angle, the bonus tracks merely extracts the ideas of flood (and therefor the entire album), and put it all into a new light, or new perspectives. (and i'm sure we've noticed that the number 69 shows a possible symbol for "life feeds on life", right? i mean, if you've ever wondered why they did it that way)...

* the drug use thing is important to understand. you'll find that tool feels it important to try certain psychedelics, not so much for the high, but to understand how to get there again in sobriety - to harness your mind, i suppose. because, well, "saturn comes back around to show you everything, let's you choose what you will or will not SEE (<- *important!*), and then drags you down like a stone or lifts you up again, spits you out like a child - light and innocent".

so, just "choose to let this go".




discuss?
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Last edited by iAMtheMA!; 12-15-2006 at 07:11 AM..
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Old 12-15-2006, 06:22 AM   #2
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Re: UNDERTOW (iAMtheMA!'s take)

why did i immediately go to "the grudge"? ...was not saturn the god of harvest? (psst, see: "disgustipated")

plus, all the other related stuffs.

-_-
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Old 12-16-2006, 12:58 AM   #3
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Re: UNDERTOW (iAMtheMA!'s take)

Mmm interesting. Thankyou. I am new to Tool (despite my custom title!) and I have only just begun to focus on this song so I may be a little slow.

I really like the way you see Tool as a whole - I would love a space to be able to discuss overall themes in Tool's music (and the evolution of their thoughts) but it I realise it is tricky.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iAMtheMA!
i realize i'm crossing albums, it's the same band with the same motives/messages
Absolutely. And I love the 69 metaphor - I had never considered that before. So clever. And it has that luscious sexiness that is so intoxicating in Undertow. This is by far their most sensual album IMO.

With regard to "Flood" specifically (but in context within the album) I do agree with you on this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by iAMtheMA!
the last track is basically a summary of the entire album. "this ground is not the rock i thought it would be", we must "climb to a new place now" (another reference to the meditation, me thinks). to observe examples of our convictions from more than one angle, the bonus tracks merely extracts the ideas of flood (and therefor the entire album), and put it all into a new light, or new perspectives.
Although I am not sure it is a reference to meditation (or drugs). I could be wrong, of course. I haven't had any experience with psychedelics (although I do smoke a bit of pot - so I get what you are saying).

This song reminds me of "46&2" in its references to growth and change. It also reminds me of "The Road Less Travelled" by Scott Peck (I realise it is crappy pop-psychology). In that book he talks about people who can take on board new information and deal with it. He defines these type of people as "mature". In contrast, immature people IGNORE new information and therefore cannot grow. You can only attain a higher consciousness through accepting new information (maybe drugs would help?). But anyway if you keep holding on to what is your reality you will drown.

Hey, I think it is coming together for me! (even as I type LOL).

If we think of water as "new information" (awful analogy on my part) or as perhaps a revelation?!? But certainly a challenge, then mature people realise that this rock is not the rock they thought it would be (this changes everything) and they will have to review the situation. (Other people just drown). You can't just run away and hold onto what you knew. You have to face the challenge otherwise the water will claim it anyway.

If you want to grow (and hold onto what you have) then you have to let go and climb to higher ground. You have to push through the shadow and evolve.

The music is so great - and reflects the lyrics. The drums are awesome. I just love the richness of undertow - it reminds me of dark chocolate icecream, or a mudbath. Such a turn-on. Lol.
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Old 12-17-2006, 02:58 AM   #4
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Re: UNDERTOW (iAMtheMA!'s take)

How fucking SEXY is Undertow?!? IMO - of course!
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Old 12-17-2006, 03:49 AM   #5
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Re: UNDERTOW (iAMtheMA!'s take)

doesn't it make you feel like there's a struggle whenever it slows down? like you're walking, and walking, normal, and then it happens, you slow down, and it becomes harder and harder to fight against it. "i'm back down i'm in the undertow!" such a magnificent visual! it's amazing what this band can pack into a track, they don't even need those music videos!
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Old 12-18-2006, 03:29 AM   #6
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Re: UNDERTOW (iAMtheMA!'s take)

Quote:
Originally Posted by iAMtheMA! View Post
doesn't it make you feel like there's a struggle whenever it slows down? like you're walking, and walking, normal, and then it happens, you slow down, and it becomes harder and harder to fight against it. "i'm back down i'm in the undertow!" such a magnificent visual! it's amazing what this band can pack into a track, they don't even need those music videos!
all I feel is the desire to grind into my chair - lol

BUT - I do know what you mean - there is a definite sense of the undertow in the music
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Old 01-04-2007, 04:35 AM   #7
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Re: UNDERTOW (iAMtheMA!'s take)

Sorry - why do I have this amazing capacity to end threads? How does this happen?
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Old 01-15-2007, 06:35 PM   #8
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Re: UNDERTOW (iAMtheMA!'s take)

i simply try to leave room for others to become more involved.
it ain't you, it's them.

i wonder how many people go track by track, and (within 'em) thread by thread. i often bring up ideas that were cited at launch and never heard of again. i am the bump master. also ...where the hell are the insightful and more original ideas? "this song is about drug abuse" is a huge fuckin' turn-off. and "no shit" to you. they're playing for YOU, and your life is the drug ... so "let go".

sorry for the rant...
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