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Old 08-07-2013, 05:12 AM   #1
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Confused about the occult.

Hey everyone I'd like to share my confusion with someone. First let me tell that I don't pretend to know any thrut better than anyone. I've just been asking questions to myself recently. This concern the occult aspect that seems to be important in tool art and a few other things related.

Ok I'll start here. Like a lot of you tool fans I've heard about Aleister Crowley. I haven't studied him yet but it seems like he is with helena Blavatsky one of the leaders of what we call the new age movement (and also considered the wickedest man in the world ... don't know about that ) . What's interesting is that Tool promotes new age philosophies too. (third eye, merkaba, kundalini rising ...) and Danny claims he reads a lot of Crowley's books ( might still be a joke , we never know ... ) .

Now the thing that I don't understand is that new age philosophies seems to become more and more popular nowadays. It is mixed with a lot of esoterism and beliefs that leads to think that humans were created by extraterrestrial beings and that we can become our own gods. My problem with this is that this belief ( be your own god ) is the main idea behind luciferianism and you can read here and there that high rank freemasons are into this too and that they are pushing this new age agenda. What a coincidence ...

What is interesting is that while meshuggah is very often compared to tool, They litteraly destroys the zen movement with their artwork for Obzen. It seems like they try to prevent from something with a new-age monk covered in blood. If you look closely to his arms and hands you'll see he is making the 666 sign with his hands
(confirmed by Thomas haake)


Plus in the lyrics for the song named "ObZen" they seems to be against some sort of "new-belief system"

"A new belief-system
Salvation found in vomit and blood
Where deprivation, lies
Corruption, war and pain is god".

Seems that new age might not be what it seems. Is there really anything to gain with the practice of occult art ? Someone knows more about this subject ?

Sorry if my summary is very easy and if there are grammar mistakes but english is not my native language.

Thanks for your time everyone, Love.
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Old 08-26-2013, 10:55 AM   #2
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Re: Confused about the occult.

Hello... Fratter Ogmios (Ordo vero dormiebat Dei)

At one time we as sentient beings understood our divine nature. But for the simple reason of exercising creativity we allowed our selves to be veiled from our divine knowledge. Creativity cant exist when the outcome of all actions is known, a sentient being will always reflect on the divine morality and awareness of causality, thus no creative choices are ever made, our creativity atrophies, and we become mimics of each other. to counter act this We incarnate into lives with veiled awareness, and this allows us to make decisions that will ultimately cause pain. pain that will be felt across the entire collective body of sentient beings in existence.. Why??? because we are all connected to the same source. if you stab your self in the hand the eyeball feels it also. but again as long as we refrain from painful experience our choices are limited.
so in the interest of growing creativity we forgot our divine nature. during this period of ignorance religion emerged as a valve to release psychic pressure. Religion was also a binding agent for civilization, it allowed collectivity to exist with our dim divine awareness thus society was resistant to crumbling.

The occult is about rediscovering our divine nature, but now with enhanced creativity. The entire point behind the occult is "Discover thy self" the divine self, This is called "The great work". The way to Self discovery is scientific observation of the self. This cant be done when one reflects and abstains from actions on the moral grounds of a religious body. There is a huge difference between knowledge and experience, with out experience wisdom is never gained. With wisdom comes self knowledge, and with self knowledge comes divine knowledge. so the occult tends to stray away from dogmatic organization in the interest of scientific self observation.

The first step in self discovery is destroying your heroes and Idles. These only serve to enslave, they also provides an excuse for evading ones own divine morality. "Jesus will save me" With the idles like Jesus it becomes easy for one to make excuses for breaking ones own divine law. They unsuccessfully removes us from responsibility for our own actions.

an important factor of the occult is not to disturb the ignorant until their time of seeking commences. Metaphore taken literally provides a nice deterrent for immature unprepared curiosity. it keeps the kids from messing around with things they are ignorant of and don't understand, dangerous things Like mental constructs. People can end up with a messiah complex, extreme addictions, bloated ego, entrenched into delusion or schizophrenia, or even worse Evangelical Christin. The great work Seeks to free people from these things, to enhance the realization of our divinity while maintaining our creative WILL.
All assertions to a phenomenon are projected, and are the result of the mind stream projecting them. All phenomenon are of a relative nature, there for all phenomenon are subjective. All phenomenon Inherently contain their own contradiction, therefore All phenomenon are Empty and void of inherent assertions.

Last edited by Sleeper0013; 08-26-2013 at 11:03 AM.. Reason: spelling
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Old 08-08-2014, 02:51 PM   #3
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Re: Confused about the occult.

I do not mean to be inflammatory Sleeper0013 but you are truly at sea if you believe man can create anything beyond the mind of the creator. When man creates something of transcendent beauty it has been inspired by the divine. Creation is a holy gift and holy experience we have been granted by the creator and first cause. It is even said in the hermetic teachings that a man who does not create is wasting life. Creation covers a wide array of areas i.e. any translation of thought to the matter of the earth.
We have forgotten our divine nature by virtue of incarnation into the earthly plane and its many illusions. That which will hold you back more than any other thing is the dichotomy of pain and pleasure. If you allow yourself and your emotions to be buffeted around by these opposites you are a truly earthly being. It is only you who hold yourself back for the evidence of the divine is all around if you know how to look.
I agree that the occult is the discovery of who we really are and everything truly is. It covers lifetimes worth of learning.
The first step is not destroying heroes and idles yet that would be incorporated i'm sure (destroying is perhaps a strong word though). However, do not discount Jesus for he was one of the wisest beings ever incarnated on this plane. While he should not be idolized his teachings are useful for the journey of every seeker. The first step is true peace. You must meditate on peace to truly find it and what it means.
Any finally, yes, I agree. Do not help those who do not want to be help. For they only will push further and further away. Please think deeply on what I have said and see it to be logical surface learnings of a truly deep and real subject.
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