xxlateralusxx that quote in your signature is not whatever you put, it's Lao Tse(Lao Tzu.) If you like the stolen version good for you, if not use the original one which shitkicks the newer one.
The version that I that is best goes-
Those that know do not speak and those that speak do not know.
"I had thought this impossible, but she was able to show a perspective of it that made some sense. Sure, she ignored a few of the lines that don't make sense/don't add much to the poem, but she was able to get something from it.
I still think it's a pretty poorly written poem, for reasons already stated, but I will admit that was I incorrect in saying that it was impossible to get anything from it, or to understand it."
I've been waiting for that pheeze, thats all I wanted to hear; I'll read back and see what I can do.
Pheeze what is your suggestion for the first 2 lines. "writing words that just may be wisdom, to isolate myself from the illusion." All you said was a question "Are you Maynard" or something like that.
Pheeze what is your suggestion for the first 2 lines. "writing words that just may be wisdom, to isolate myself from the illusion." All you said was a question "Are you Maynard" or something like that.
To me, that line just sounds very superficial and shallow. It sounds fake. It comes across as though you're trying to sound deep and spiritual, but I don't think it succeeds in that attempt. I think that, around here at least, talking about "the illusion" has become somewhat cliche and generic. It just feels like a pretty empty line. I can guess what it is your talking about, I just think it's a pretty weak start to a poem.
I'd recommend trying to find another word to use instead of "illusion". If you can't, then I'd recommend putting an adjective before. If you feel a need to describe it as an illusion, then at least attempt to describe the illusion in an interesting manner. Hell, something as simple as "comfortable illusion" would be better, I think. That's not all that good of a choice, but it was the first thing to come to mind. You get the point.
Also, I just want to mention that I think the "writing words" and "pool of my endless poetry" are parts of an underdeveloped idea. I'm still not exactly sure what this poem is supposed to be about, but how the idea of writingp oetry fits into it is very unclear. You just kinda make mention of it twice, and then it doesn't appear as though show its relevance.
First off, I disagree with Pheez that this is "garbage". It's kind of abstract. But that doesn't make it garbage. I'm also disagreeing with his stance that it's confusing. It's not. To me anyway. Well, at least, I got something out of it, I don't know if it was the writer's intended theme.
Lateralus: I took this to be a metaphorical discription of how you sit down and write poetry/lyric, was it not? The process of writing, for you. That was my interpretation anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by x7 Lateralus 7x
.If I pass you by, you won't know anything but my name,
A name so cleverly weaved into my flesh and bones for identity.
If you were to stare into my eyes, I would close them to blind you.
I would rip through your skin, and dig deep enough to find you.
When it's all over, I know that this is where you may find me...
I'm not a huge fan of the first two stanzas, but this last one has some nice tone in it, as well as a couple of nice metaphors. I liked the "rip through your skin........" line.
To Pheezy:
Man, I'm going to have to go against you here. I think you're criticism of people's work in this section is not only harsh, but I don't even think you take the time to know what you're criticising. The more I read your 'reviews' of people's work, the more I'm starting to realize that you think you know a whole lot more about creative writing than you think you do.
This piece, while not some awarding winning, mind-blowing, heart stopping literature, was not nearly as bad as you're labeling it. It was also not anywhere near as confusing or fucked up as you're trying to label it. What he was talking about hit me right away. I'm starting to doubt your creative comprehension more and more. You remind me of a sophmore english teacher I had, who thought the Scarlet Letter was the greatest novel ever, and had no tolerance or patience for something that he didn't understand. Not everyone writes like you. Nor does everyone want to. I'm starting to feel more and more, that you lack imagination. No amount of poetry guidlines and rules can make up for a lack of that.
I also think that there's a huge difference between critiquing someone's work, and just being an all out asshole. All you did was tell him how much it sucked, but you never pointed out why. I don't even think you know why. All those metaphors he used made sense in the context of being inside his head while he's writing. Most of them weren't my cup of tea either, but they made sense, and fit what he was trying to do.
Something else you might want to take into context: A lot of the people I see you blowing up on, are fucking kids man. 15, 16, and 17 years old. Like you didn't write some messy, angsty, off the wall shit when you were that age. As an older fuckhead who likes to write shit, I thinks it cool if people even try. Not everyone is Allan Poe, but everyone has thoughts to convey. I also think that it would mean more/accomplish more, if you'd actually try to help them correct/edit shit, or point out ideas to them, than just tear them down. I wouldn't be going off like this really, but that's all I ever see you do in this section.
That's just me though, I guess. I know I'm one of the biggest assholes on TDN, but when it comes to people's creativity, I guess I'd rather just A)be constructive and try to help them, B)tell them I don't like it, but at least explain why, maybe give some suggestions, or C)just ignore the really shitty poetry, and not post at all.
First off, I disagree with Pheez that this is "garbage". It's kind of abstract. But that doesn't make it garbage. I'm also disagreeing with his stance that it's confusing. It's not. To me anyway. Well, at least, I got something out of it
I can see the interpretation you made, but I'm wondering what you think of all the lines that don't appear to fit into that at all:
Quote:
It's not the texture of my skin that seems so pale,
The lack of oxegen mixed with nicotine aren't the pathways
Quote:
If I pass you by, you won't know anything but my name,
A name so cleverly weaved into my flesh and bones for identity.
If you were to stare into my eyes, I would close them to blind you.
I would rip through your skin, and dig deep enough to find you
While there are some lines that appear to give it the meaning you attributed to it, there are also a lot of lines that I can't find any way to fit in with that idea. Actually, the bulk of lines in this poem seem to not coincide with your interepretation of it. That at least makes it somewhat unclear, unless I'm missing something, in which case I'd appreciate someone pointing it out to me. Hogpile, you may have been able to get something from it, and that's great, but I still think there are a lot of excess lines, and for me, the confuse the whole piece quite a bit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hogpile
I think you're criticism of people's work in this section is not only harsh, but I don't even think you take the time to know what you're criticising.
Really? I think I've given some pretty in depth comments here. I think I've said enough to at least make it obvious thta I read the piece and thought about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hogpile
Not everyone writes like you. Nor does everyone want to.
I've never implied that anyone should.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hogpile
I'm starting to feel more and more, that you lack imagination. No amount of poetry guidlines and rules can make up for a lack of that.
Agreed, but no amount of imagination can make up a complete of understanding of poetry's rules and guidelines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hogpile
I also think that there's a huge difference between critiquing someone's work, and just being an all out asshole. All you did was tell him how much it sucked, but you never pointed out why.
Come on man, I thought at least you would have seen the points I was trying to make. All the "what the hell does this mean" could have been said "this part is a little unclear, you should revise it to make your point and purpose more apparent". I did point out a number of things that I thought hurt the poem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hogpile
All those metaphors he used
What metaphors?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hogpile
Something else you might want to take into context: A lot of the people I see you blowing up on, are fucking kids man. 15, 16, and 17 years old. Like you didn't write some messy, angsty, off the wall shit when you were that age. As an older fuckhead who likes to write shit, I thinks it cool if people even try.
Yeah, I'm aware of that, and I definitely wrote some complete crap when I was that age. Hell, I still do. I agree it's good of them to try at all.
Something I think you need to take into consideration, is the response they get from other members. I see all kinds of pretty bad poetry getting a lot of positive encouraging remarks. If something isn't very good (which you admitted earlier that this piece isn't), then someone needs to say that. Someone needs to point out the negative aspects of their work. They need to get used to the fact that a lot of what they write isn't all that good, or at least, could be much better. With all the pointless, empty, unfounded "omg i luv it" type comments that I see around here, I'd say that my harsh negativity actually serves a purpose.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hogpile
I also think that it would mean more/accomplish more, if you'd actually try to help them correct/edit shit, or point out ideas to them, than just tear them down. I wouldn't be going off like this really, but that's all I ever see you do in this section.
You'll see that I just recently offered some advice as to how he could improve this poem. He asked for it, I gave it to him. He showed that he was open to the idea of improving his work, and I attempted to help him. Why not do that from the start, you might ask? I've tried that too many times, almost always to get my thoughts and comments ignored due to their kindness. Like it or not, the way I approached this got my comments some attention. I definitely made people (the author included) think a bit more about this piece. I already went over all this in another post.
uhm...yeah it's just a poem; words. There are some weak lines and I'm going to fix them, at the same time I won't make it blunt.
There's no need to fight, I might be a hypocrit saying this but I'd rather not be scared of the fact that if I post, I might start a fight. I just want to share the writing just like everyone else; just to get it off of my chest.
There's no need to fight, I might be a hypocrit saying this but I'd rather not be scared of the fact that if I post, I might start a fight. I just want to share the writing just like everyone else; just to get it off of my chest.
The words I picture just may be wisdom;
An isolation from the artificial illusion; reality.
They may just be the words written below the surface.
I'm swimming in quicksand; This is where you may find me.
The texture of my skin is pale,
Don't blame the daylight that never coated me.
It's the silver walls of the cave I'm lost in;
This has been the pool of my endless poetry.
If I pass you by, you won't know anything but my name;
A name so cleverly weaved into my flesh and bones.
So take a step into my silver, search here and speak to my soul.
Cause if you were to stare into my eyes, I would close them to blind you.
I would rip through your skin, and dig deep enough to find you.
And when it's all over, this is where you may find me.
An isolation from the artificial illusion; reality.
I think "artificial illusion" is a little redundant.
Also, your use of the word "reality" makes that line way too blunt, which I thought was something you were trying to avoid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by x7 Lateralus 7x
I'm swimming in quicksand; This is where you may find me.
I like this much better than the metaphorical pile or whatever.
Quote:
Originally Posted by x7 Lateralus 7x
The texture of my skin is pale,
Again, the texture of one's skin cannot be pale.
Quote:
Originally Posted by x7 Lateralus 7x
Don't blame the daylight that never coated me.
This line seems a little unclear to me. I'm not sure why'd blame the sunlight, or what I'd blame it for. I'm not sure what the sunlight is supposed to represent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by x7 Lateralus 7x
It's the silver walls of the cave I'm lost in;
Again, I see a lack of clarity. What is the silvers walls of the cave the speaker is lost in?
I think this whole sectioncould be cleared up by fixing the line about the texture of your skin. I think these other two lines are supposed to relate to it, but since I don't know what that line means, it throws of these other two lines as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by x7 Lateralus 7x
This has been the pool of my endless poetry.
It's kind of interesting that you mention both quicksand and a cave, but use the word pool to describe the cave. You might want to consider changing that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by x7 Lateralus 7x
If I pass you by, you won't know anything but my name;
A name so cleverly weaved into my flesh and bones.
So take a step into my silver, search here and speak to my soul.
See, this part as it is now ties things together a bit. Before, I wasn't sure of the intent of those first two lines. Now you make it clearer what you're trying to do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by x7 Lateralus 7x
Cause if you were to stare into my eyes, I would close them to blind you.
I would rip through your skin, and dig deep enough to find you.
And when it's all over, this is where you may find me.
The only other thing I'll say is that I don't think the word "cause" really has a place in poetry.
Lateralus, perhaps the second line could sound better as "An isolation from this false illusion: reality"
Again, the word "false" doesn't add anything to illusion. If it's an illusion, it's obviously false.
What's needed, I think, is a word that adds something to the concept of "illusions".
"safe" or "comfortable" could work.
"dangerous" perhaps.
I don't know, it would depend on what his views of this "illusion" are, and how he wanted the reader to feel about it. I don't think the concept of "illusion" really needs to be reinforced by a word like "false" or "artificial" though.
Yeah, its an obviously abstract poem about a writer's quest to escape reality by getting into his work and bringing others to the experience. Yeah, its admittedly Tool-ish at times.
Its not bad though.
My one gripe besides being toolish (swimming in quicksand? c'mon) is the texture of the skin, it should be...tone. Or something.
Also, I can see what he means on most accounts, I'm pretty sure. I think what some people do when analyzing something such as this is taking each line seperately, which doesn't do this poem much justice, seeing that many a line won't mean much without its counterpart.
"The texture of my skin is pale,
Don't blame the daylight that never coated me.
It's the silver walls of the cave I'm lost in;
This has been the pool of my endless poetry."
That whole stanza compliments each other but each line means nil on its own. Its a matter of style; thats my point and this is my example!
__________________ "Computers are like women; they either work very well or not at all"
Yeah, its an obviously abstract poem about a writer's quest to escape reality by getting into his work
Duh, man.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wave.Existance.Tears
"The texture of my skin is pale,
Don't blame the daylight that never coated me.
It's the silver walls of the cave I'm lost in;
This has been the pool of my endless poetry."
That whole stanza compliments each other but each line means nil on its own. Its a matter of style; thats my point and this is my example!
lol. How does any one line in this poem add anything to any of the others?
I understand the point you're trying to make, but for any line to add anything to another, it must make some degree of sense on it's own.
