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fabriano
10-11-2006, 09:16 PM
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I feel that 10k days' main "secret/puzzle" concept is dualism. My thoughts:

The stereoscopic artwork of two images seen as one more round/focused complete whole.

The big idea that struck me is that some of the songs (that i have figured out so far) can be seen this same way in dealing with previous tool songs.

The ones that stick out for me so far:

jambi--------the grudge

they both seem to be about him and his relationship with his mother. The grudge is more negative while Jambi is heading more towards the positive. I think 'saturn' in these songs is an astrological reference to his mother. An example from an astrologers advice:
"Saturn's opposition to your Moon speaks to a difficult relationship with your mother. Saturn, while serious and sober, easily sees the flaws and doesn't mind pointing out what needs to be fixed. This opposition indicates a highly judgmental mother, whose criticism, overt or covert, undermined your emotional confidence. Her strong opinions may have overwhelmed you."

Rosetta Stoned-------Third Eye

Where 'third eye' is a more positive reflection on the use of LSD for enlightenment, Rosetta Stoned is the negative version of the effects of LSD...like shitting the bead and forgetting one's pen. We also have the music harken back in 'rosetta' to third eye.....maybe as a clue?

Right in Two--------46&2

Just as in 'Rosetta Stoned' harkening back, 'right in two' calls back musically at the end to '46&2'. 'right in two' is a more negative reflection towards the evolution of men, whereas '46&2' is the more positvie outlook.


The songs themselves also mention being split in two all over the place, as well as the centerpiece of the album being split in two for no good reason.

I also remember hearing about how this album is "not lateralus II". Maybe it is a sequel to the rest of the catalog.

Now that leaves several of the songs with duality link of new to old songs yet be found . I think there is some much more to be found around this concept. So does anyone have any ideas about these or any other songs on the album? If this has been discussed elsewhere i would take redirecting kindly.
Old 10-11-2006, 09:16 PM   #1
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10k days concept of dualism

I feel that 10k days' main "secret/puzzle" concept is dualism. My thoughts:

The stereoscopic artwork of two images seen as one more round/focused complete whole.

The big idea that struck me is that some of the songs (that i have figured out so far) can be seen this same way in dealing with previous tool songs.

The ones that stick out for me so far:

jambi--------the grudge

they both seem to be about him and his relationship with his mother. The grudge is more negative while Jambi is heading more towards the positive. I think 'saturn' in these songs is an astrological reference to his mother. An example from an astrologers advice:
"Saturn's opposition to your Moon speaks to a difficult relationship with your mother. Saturn, while serious and sober, easily sees the flaws and doesn't mind pointing out what needs to be fixed. This opposition indicates a highly judgmental mother, whose criticism, overt or covert, undermined your emotional confidence. Her strong opinions may have overwhelmed you."

Rosetta Stoned-------Third Eye

Where 'third eye' is a more positive reflection on the use of LSD for enlightenment, Rosetta Stoned is the negative version of the effects of LSD...like shitting the bead and forgetting one's pen. We also have the music harken back in 'rosetta' to third eye.....maybe as a clue?

Right in Two--------46&2

Just as in 'Rosetta Stoned' harkening back, 'right in two' calls back musically at the end to '46&2'. 'right in two' is a more negative reflection towards the evolution of men, whereas '46&2' is the more positvie outlook.


The songs themselves also mention being split in two all over the place, as well as the centerpiece of the album being split in two for no good reason.

I also remember hearing about how this album is "not lateralus II". Maybe it is a sequel to the rest of the catalog.

Now that leaves several of the songs with duality link of new to old songs yet be found . I think there is some much more to be found around this concept. So does anyone have any ideas about these or any other songs on the album? If this has been discussed elsewhere i would take redirecting kindly.
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parables in the world's Avatar parables in the world
10-11-2006, 09:43 PM
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i like what you've said. i just need to take out all my tool cds now.
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Old 10-11-2006, 09:43 PM   #2
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Re: 10k days concept of dualism

i like what you've said. i just need to take out all my tool cds now.
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ktdude's Avatar ktdude
10-12-2006, 01:45 AM
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your ideas are interesting but you should develop them - read paraflux's interpretation also (stickied) if you haven't already as I think a couple of your thoughts are developed a little more in there. I think dualism vs unity is a very common theme running throughout Tool's career, it seems to be a particular preoccupation of Maynard's.
Old 10-12-2006, 01:45 AM   #3
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Re: 10k days concept of dualism

your ideas are interesting but you should develop them - read paraflux's interpretation also (stickied) if you haven't already as I think a couple of your thoughts are developed a little more in there. I think dualism vs unity is a very common theme running throughout Tool's career, it seems to be a particular preoccupation of Maynard's.
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mike09's Avatar mike09
10-13-2006, 07:16 AM
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I don't consider The Grudge to be a negative song at all. I do like your ideas, though. And I agree with ktdude in that I think you should expand them and see if you can find any other connections like these.
Old 10-13-2006, 07:16 AM   #4
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Re: 10k days concept of dualism

I don't consider The Grudge to be a negative song at all. I do like your ideas, though. And I agree with ktdude in that I think you should expand them and see if you can find any other connections like these.
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ktdude's Avatar ktdude
10-16-2006, 12:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leefnaspleaf View Post
I think it's interesting that you term it "dualism vs unity." To me, this is a perfect analogy for "Western vs Eastern" thought, and to me, one of the coolest things about Tool is that they mix western and eastern music.
yeah I never thought about it like that... guess this could also loosely apply to western vs eastern religions, although obviously not all of them... just religion in general... opening up a whole new can of worms here though and it's too early to follow through so I'll just be quiet for now.
Old 10-16-2006, 12:51 AM   #5
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Re: 10k days concept of dualism

Quote:
Originally Posted by leefnaspleaf View Post
I think it's interesting that you term it "dualism vs unity." To me, this is a perfect analogy for "Western vs Eastern" thought, and to me, one of the coolest things about Tool is that they mix western and eastern music.
yeah I never thought about it like that... guess this could also loosely apply to western vs eastern religions, although obviously not all of them... just religion in general... opening up a whole new can of worms here though and it's too early to follow through so I'll just be quiet for now.
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987
10-16-2006, 08:46 AM
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Follow through! Even if we're not on the right track, it's and interesting read and we're learning stuff.
Old 10-16-2006, 08:46 AM   #6
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Re: 10k days concept of dualism

Follow through! Even if we're not on the right track, it's and interesting read and we're learning stuff.
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duncang's Avatar duncang
10-16-2006, 09:10 AM
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Schism - Intension

Intension could be about the way the relationship SHOULD be, or was before the Schism developed and left them apart.
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Old 10-16-2006, 09:10 AM   #7
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Re: 10k days concept of dualism

Schism - Intension

Intension could be about the way the relationship SHOULD be, or was before the Schism developed and left them apart.
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Sleeper0013's Avatar Sleeper0013
10-18-2006, 09:38 PM
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I have to agree with fab in some part, I have noticed that some Riffs and tricks on 10,000 are taken from other songs and altered just a bit, almost refering to older songs in a way. However i think Fab may be wrong about a couple of the pairs. I think jambi and Schism are ment to be paired, they boath speak of relation ships. One falling apart, and one coming together.

I deffinitly think that Duality is a piece of the puzzle that Blair mentioned earlier. In an interview i saw with maynard way back in the day, he had mentioned, that it is important to view the negatives of life also. I think what this album is sugesting, is to try to find a way to put boath views negative and positive into perspective. If you ignore one side it usualy comes back to bite you in the ass later.

A simpler way of looking at this is ballance.
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Old 10-18-2006, 09:38 PM   #8
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Re: 10k days concept of dualism

I have to agree with fab in some part, I have noticed that some Riffs and tricks on 10,000 are taken from other songs and altered just a bit, almost refering to older songs in a way. However i think Fab may be wrong about a couple of the pairs. I think jambi and Schism are ment to be paired, they boath speak of relation ships. One falling apart, and one coming together.

I deffinitly think that Duality is a piece of the puzzle that Blair mentioned earlier. In an interview i saw with maynard way back in the day, he had mentioned, that it is important to view the negatives of life also. I think what this album is sugesting, is to try to find a way to put boath views negative and positive into perspective. If you ignore one side it usualy comes back to bite you in the ass later.

A simpler way of looking at this is ballance.
__________________
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