__________________ Concerning Wings for Marie, I wouldn't lose any respect for Maynard if he became a Christian. I already lost all my respect for him when I found out an AC/DC album was in his top 5.
turning and turning in the widening gyre
the falcon cannot hear the falconer
things fall apart, the center cannot hold
mere anarchy is loosed upon the world
the blood-dimmed tide is loosed and everywhere
the ceremony of innocence is drowned
the best lack all conviction while the worst
are full of passionate intensity
surely some revelation is at hand
surely the second coming is at hand
the second coming, hardly are those words out
when a vast image out of spiritus mundi
troubles my site: somewhere in sands of the desert
a shape with lion body and the head of a man
a gaze blank and pitiless as the sun
is moving it's slow thighs while all about it
reel shadows of the indignant desert birds
the darkness drops again, but now i know
that 20 centuries of stony sleep
were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle.
and what rough beast, it's hour come round at last
slouches towards bethelhem to be born?
turning and turning in the widening gyre
the falcon cannot hear the falconer
things fall apart, the center cannot hold
mere anarchy is loosed upon the world
the blood-dimmed tide is loosed and everywhere
the ceremony of innocence is drowned
the best lack all conviction while the worst
are full of passionate intensity
surely some revelation is at hand
surely the second coming is at hand
the second coming, hardly are those words out
when a vast image out of spiritus mundi
troubles my site: somewhere in sands of the desert
a shape with lion body and the head of a man
a gaze blank and pitiless as the sun
is moving it's slow thighs while all about it
reel shadows of the indignant desert birds
the darkness drops again, but now i know
that 20 centuries of stony sleep
were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle.
and what rough beast, it's hour come round at last
slouches towards bethelhem to be born?
I'll have to go read it now. I only finished the fourth one, "Wizard and Glass", and it was a long time ago; he finished the last three really really fast. I hope the rush didn't inhibit quality.
I feel bad for the poor guy. He really wanted to write the great American novel, but Four Seasons just never quite cut it. And he was just too young to say no to his publicist. I think though, anymore, you could assume a lot with King. Like his next book will be trite with a predictable plot and boring characters.
1) You dont really know what needs to be done at the Tower like you know the ring has to be destroyed in the fires of Mordor.
2) Tolkein created his own world, King used dimensions of this one.
3) Roland is a complete badass in the beginning, and suffers horrible shit happening to him, one right after the other. How many authors will completely make their hero suffer like that? Two fucking fingers on his right hand were bitten off, and it happened so quickly that I had to pu tthe book down to absorb the fact that a gunslinger would not have the use of one of his hands for the remainder of the trip. This was at the beginning of the second book. The very beginning. Aragorn, Frodo, go through trials and shit but they come out on top and dont suffer nearly as much as Roland does.
4) LOTR was about one time, one dimension. The Dark Tower spans several time periods and several dimensions and dimensional jumps.
The goal isnt even the same. Dark Tower, there is no real "good" vs. "evil," even though the beams are breaking. Even the Breakers responsible for the damage to the beams arent really held responsible at the end.
The only connection is that King wanted the Dark Tower to be his 'Lord of the Rings'. An epic tale that would capture the imagination.
In that it succeeds.
__________________ If this grand panorama before me is what you call God....
1) You dont really know what needs to be done at the Tower like you know the ring has to be destroyed in the fires of Mordor.
2) Tolkein created his own world, King used dimensions of this one.
3) Roland is a complete badass in the beginning, and suffers horrible shit happening to him, one right after the other. How many authors will completely make their hero suffer like that? Two fucking fingers on his right hand were bitten off, and it happened so quickly that I had to pu tthe book down to absorb the fact that a gunslinger would not have the use of one of his hands for the remainder of the trip. This was at the beginning of the second book. The very beginning. Aragorn, Frodo, go through trials and shit but they come out on top and dont suffer nearly as much as Roland does.
4) LOTR was about one time, one dimension. The Dark Tower spans several time periods and several dimensions and dimensional jumps.
The goal isnt even the same. Dark Tower, there is no real "good" vs. "evil," even though the beams are breaking. Even the Breakers responsible for the damage to the beams arent really held responsible at the end.
If you don't see a correlation, then you obviously haven't read King's own explanation of where the whole theme and character plots come from. He even says in a "foreward by the author" that he started the Dark Tower when he was like 19 out of complete admiration for LOTR. He even admits that he had to put the project on hold, and go back and change a lot of where he was going with his story, because it was almost a direct rip-off.
Regardless of what he claims, I think he failed. I grew up with LOTR. I know those books backwards and forwards, and the similarities between those books and the Dark Tower series are almost infuriating to me. To each his own though. You like those books, that's fine. Personally, I prefer work inspired by originality.
I could go into all the similarities, etc between the two, but I don't feel like doing it again. Do a search on Dark Tower, or my username, and you'll see I already made a thread about this.
If you don't see a correlation, then you obviously haven't read King's own explanation of where the whole theme and character plots come from. He even says in a "foreward by the author" that he started the Dark Tower when he was like 19 out of complete admiration for LOTR. He even admits that he had to put the project on hold, and go back and change a lot of where he was going with his story, because it was almost a direct rip-off.
Regardless of what he claims, I think he failed. I grew up with LOTR. I know those books backwards and forwards, and the similarities between those books and the Dark Tower series are almost infuriating to me. To each his own though. You like those books, that's fine. Personally, I prefer work inspired by originality.
I could go into all the similarities, etc between the two, but I don't feel like doing it again. Do a search on Dark Tower, or my username, and you'll see I already made a thread about this.
Not that I appreciate your implications that I or others do not like work inspired by originality, but I can see your point.
Not that I appreciate your implications that I or others do not like work inspired by originality, but I can see your point.
I wasn't making implications. I was flat out saying it. King himself admits that the work doesn't spring from originality. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of King. Just not the Dark Tower. I think The Stand is much better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstajduh
Hogpile, you like LOTR? You do realize it was written by a Catholic, don't you?
That doesn't matter to me. Tolkien was a genius. He didnt' just write those books. He invented a whole world. Cultures, races, history, languages, and in depth characters. I mean hell, he invented working languages for the shit. That's pretty admirable.
Hoagy, I agree on few points and disagree on others.
Yes, Tolkien was a genius. He created an immense world that has not been rivalled by thousands of wannabe authors over the last 50 odd years. He has no parallel or peer in this field.
There are many similarities between the two stories; The idea of the quest, the close teams, the development of relationships, the ultimate goal etc. The one and most important distinction (mentioned by paraflux above) is that LOTR is ultimately a story of 'good vs evil' while DT is not.
King was inspired by JRR and LOTR in many ways and he says so in the preface to all of the novels. He wanted to create his own LOTR or War and Peace. Essentially a long tale that would enthrall audiences and capture the imagination of a generation.
His inspiration for the tale itself though is (as he also states) the poem, 'Childe Roland to the Dark Tower Came'. If you haven't read it, do so. It appears in the final volume of DT.
There is nothing wrong with inspiration and although there may be a few rather vague similarities (on a conceptual level. If there are other significant issues please detail them) the two stories stand alone. One as the greatest story of fantasy/fiction ever written (only selling less copies than the bible) and the other as a very substantial novel in contemporary literature, and in my opinion one of the best I have read in the last ten years. . .
__________________ If this grand panorama before me is what you call God....
Hoagy, I agree on few points and disagree on others.
Yes, Tolkien was a genius. He created an immense world that has not been rivalled by thousands of wannabe authors over the last 50 odd years. He has no parallel or peer in this field.
There are many similarities between the two stories; The idea of the quest, the close teams, the development of relationships, the ultimate goal etc. The one and most important distinction (mentioned by paraflux above) is that LOTR is ultimately a story of 'good vs evil' while DT is not.
King was inspired by JRR and LOTR in many ways and he says so in the preface to all of the novels. He wanted to create his own LOTR or War and Peace. Essentially a long tale that would enthrall audiences and capture the imagination of a generation.
His inspiration for the tale itself though is (as he also states) the poem, 'Childe Roland to the Dark Tower Came'. If you haven't read it, do so. It appears in the final volume of DT.
There is nothing wrong with inspiration and although there may be a few rather vague similarities (on a conceptual level. If there are other significant issues please detail them) the two stories stand alone. One as the greatest story of fantasy/fiction ever written (only selling less copies than the bible) and the other as a very substantial novel in contemporary literature, and in my opinion one of the best I have read in the last ten years. . .
I agree, that inspiration isn't a bad quality. However, to me, the Dark Tower is just too similar to LOTR and more so than most fans of that series would like to admit. I list quite a few of those similarities in this thread, if your interested:
I think King is a genius. I actually like him more than Tolkien at some level. The LOTR trilogy, and The Hobbit, are really the only works by Tolkien that I love. King however, has many books that I would call works of genius, especially his short stories. The Dark Tower series is just not one of those works of genius, in my opinion.
I read the link and I do see your point. Its is not enough for me to rag on DT though as I think it is an excellent story albeit with similarities to LOTR.
We'll just say that both King and Tolkien are geniuses in their own fields :)
__________________ If this grand panorama before me is what you call God....
