I started listening to Tool because of the aggressiveness of the music, but though it was aggressive it still conflicted other emotions inside of you, like depression, and the music could take you to places you normally didn't want to go, but this was a good thing because the music was there to share with you those experiences, so that you felt comforted, and not alone when it took you there, rather than the music just being some cracker-jack box song.

Unfortunate to say, Tool now has a template as far as lyrics and vocal melody go... This album would be beautiful if Maynard didn't write the lyrics and melody himself... The heart and soul of Tool used to be Maynard, but since he has changed his style of delivery, Tool has kind of lost it's soul. Maynard joined A Perfect Circle and I think that has caused his style of melody writing, and lyrical writing to fit a more mild, and socially exceptable style of music.

Though Adam's guitar style, Danny's drums, and Justin's bass styles haven't changed at all, Maynard is now mutating Tool songs by laying down his vocals. To put it bluntly, there is no heat, or intensity in his voice, and he's really trying to adapt A Perfect Circle melodies into Tool songs. I think Maynard is an amazing lyrical writer, but the majority of these songs don't merit the quality of a Tool song. If any of these songs sound like Tool songs, they definately sound like they belong on Lateralus (which is the album where this began because of Maynard's side project.)

The only song on the album that sounds like it belonged on an old Tool album was The Pot, and even at that, it wasn't evolved to the extent of an Aenema track, but more like an Undertow track. I feel as though Maynard has lost his sense of passion in music, and this happens to most great song writers, whether he has or not, it's evident that he isn't interested with everything that Tool once was.

I would never accuse Maynard as selling out, because odds are this song isn't going to sell very well at all, but I would definately say that he has inadvertedly adopted the commercial process of writing songs. It is also possible that he has lost his motives for writing songs... He now does it as a profession, I think.

And most importantly, he's doing what so many bands are doing now, complaining about things that they truely don't care about. I don't want to listen to an hour of a band complaining about government decisions, I want to hear a band singing about what they feel inside themselves, what truely means something to them, what makes THEM cry, what makes THEM happy. Music isn't about stirring up controversy, it's about expression.

They have lost their aggression, and you can tell, and the reason why is because Maynard isn't writing about things that really consern him. Whatever happened to a 6:30 rant about Los Angeles? This song you could feel, because you know for a fact that Maynard has seen Los Angeles, and he has strong emotions about Los Angeles, as for hating the Iraq war? And obsession with violence on TV? These are things I hear on the radio, and on TV all the time, and I am a very strong liberal democrate, needless to say singing about a topic which is relavent to the world isn't a good song, because if you truely don't care, there is no emotion.

This is a mess.

I'm figuring most people aren't gonna want to agree with this,

The lack of screaming, or what you call "aggressiveness" is something I like about Tool's newer works. Yeah, on some songs the "aggressiveness" is there, and it's awesome and totally appropriate. However, I do like the chill, calm, powerful nature of most of the stuff on 10,000 Days and Lateralus.


And jesus christ...my previously reply was just to skimming your post...The latter half of your post is completely BS

"but I would definately say that he has inadvertedly adopted the commercial process of writing songs. It is also possible that he has lost his motives for writing songs... He now does it as a profession, I think."

Have you even listened to 10,000 Days? Rosetta Stoned, Intension, ANY of it?

My advice to you, Dave: buy a good pair of headphones, maybe smoke some weed, and listen to this album lying down in the dark. It might help you to appreciate the less aggressive parts of the album, and to realize that there is a whole spectrum of emotions out there, of which is anger is but one.

Your opinion is yours to have, but I personally think these songs are coming from a very sincere and heartfelt sense of distress and frustration. I think this album (and lateralus) are extremely aggressive, they are just less manifestly ANGRY than before. The aggressiveness is coming out in different ways because everyone and their mother is screaming their balls off in heavy music these days.

Look at the modern rock scene, and then tell me that maynard is going 'commercial' by not screaming- that's nonsense. Kids are eating the screamy bands up right now. Maybe that's what you should listen to (or maybe that's what you have been listening to, and now you expect tool to sink to that level)

Of course maynard was going to take something from his experiences with a perfect circle, but so what? That's how people grow as artists- by exploring their creative dimensions and stretching them. Not by saying "hmmm people like what I did before, I'll just stick to that" which is exacly what you seem to want out of Maynard.

Then there's the nonsense about themes- how the hell do you know what does and doesn't concern maynard? Since when are people limited to emotions that are only about themselves?

David, you must live in a very small world if this is your outlook, and your words suggest it.

On lateralus, the lyrics were all overtly linked to their occult and spiritual interests, and communicated huge internal emotional struggles. On this album it seems much more personal.

How can you say that Maynard's emotions about his mother aren't drawn from his own experience? Or that his disdain of television and people's bloodlust taking over activity and human compassion isn't something that he actually feels?

Anyway, tool's music has many levels to explore, and what your post suggests is that you want them to remain a one-dimensional aggressive/angry band, and the only way not to be mainstream is to keep screaming.

I mean, come on man, even you must know that your post just doesn't make any sense.

Go listen to Cryptopsy then.

because metal is the only acceptable genre, right?

Tool makes 'Tool Music'. They don't make 'Metal' music or 'Pop Rock' music. DAVE, you need to chill out on the aggressive shit. Go shoot some more 'riods up your ass. Its been over a decade since undertow/opiate. Have you ever stopped to think that Tool as grown up. If you're not growing and evolving then you're just stuck in a rut. Just like crap bands like Seether and shit that are always on the Clear Channel Radio.

DAVIDG36: aight I didn't mean to bash you that hard. BUT if you want some good agressive music. Go to the store and buy some MESHUGGAH. I recommend "Catch 33" and "Destroy, Erase, Improve".

...or Chaosphere or I...

StereoScopicLenses is right. Tool makes "Tool" music. We have to remember Tool is progressive. Why the hell would they put out another Aenima or Lateralus? This is just another shade of the overall entity that Tool is. 10,000 Days isn't agressive? Jambi?(That one part where Adam plays alone and everyone comes in, that is some heavy shit) Wings for Marie/10,000 Days is completley unnverving, Rossetta Stoned is just a crazy mess. Some of these songs I believe are some of the hardest Tool has ever done. They are just so frantic and relentless. Seriously...that part in Jambi makes me want to mosh. This album is very experimental and Maynard, along with everybody else is the band, is just doing what Tool does; trying things "From a different angle, under a different light." That is the beauty of Tool.

Nevermind, agression sucks ass.

I think Tool is no longer awesome enough.

i love the calmed down parts. the mood it sets and the ambience. i love it. to each his own i guess. some people need the aggression but i like tools balance so it dosent sound so angry and stupid.

I'm not talking about him not screaming in particular it's more his lyrical content. I never enjoyed any of their screaming songs like Ticks and Leeches (excluding Third Eye.) The only songs on their that I believed were Wings for Marie, 10,000 days, and Rosetta Stoned.

I think fans get so dependent on a band's music that they try to cut them slack, so they can continue to enjoy their music, but unfortunately usually after a bands 3rd-4th album they no longer sound the same, or have the same views as they did before. The only band I've ever really liked that broke this loop was Rage Against the Machine, until they broke up they maintained the same views, and the music style never adapted.

I can see why no one agrees with me, it really is just a matter of taste. But I'm sorry that -I personally- can't listen to 10,000 days for hours in the way that I can listen to Undertow or Aenema for hours. And I don't get dedicated to bands in the way that you other fans do, I know when it's over, and when to let go of what the band once was. But just because I don't like their new music doesn't mean I don't respect them anymore, Tool will always probably be my second or first favorite band, but I'm not going to force myself to enjoy music I don't like.

As far as me liking screaming music, the only band that I can listen to that "screams" is Deftones, and I generally like calm music as much as aggressive music, such as Massive Attack.

This thread is classic. The OP came into this album EXPECTING it to sound like their previous aggressive works. Thats possibly the worst way to view any artwork form is to go in expecting anything.

If you read any interviews or even had a clue you would notice Tool is DONE doing the "dark aggressive mysterious" bullshit that worked for other albums.

So Maynard sold out because hes making different, BETTER music then before? Maynard is selling out because he didnt make Aenima 2?

Again, they seemed to have grown out of the "WAAA FUCK THE WORLD IT SUX" attitude and are approaching it differently. The best is when you say "Maynard is writing about things that dont really concern him" Good point, I guess the death of his MOTHER doesnt concern him at all.

I could go further but your post is so bad that I'm questioning wether or not its real or a joke.

Yeah, a song about his mothers death. I bet he doesnt really care about that.

The post is real, and I said in a previous post that the Wings series were the only songs that had a personal meaning to them.

And I never said Maynard sold out, I said he's changed his style of writing music. You can tell that Vicarious was engineered to be played on the radio, and it will be played on the radio... over and over again. That doesn't mean he's a sell out, that means he has an occupation.

And yes I am mad that Tool isn't going to write Aenima like songs anymore, because Aenima was a great album, and it was the center and foundation of what Tool was all about. When bands start tweaking what they write and sing about they eventually break up.

None of you thought this album sounded like A Perfect Circle..?

"None of you thought this album sounded like A Perfect Circle..?"

No.

And Maynard sounds as angry as I've ever heard him on Vicarious and The Pot.

+20

So what you're saying is you like bands to stick with just one sound?

I gotta tell ya, man...Tool is probably not the band for you, then...

Well...

1. I found 10,000 Days to be more aggressive than Lateralus.

2. I don't listen to Tool for their aggressiveness. I was a fan ever since I watched the Schism music video. I like the more ethereal sounding songs that Tool does most.


I've got a fuck ton of aggressive CDs. I've only got 4 CDs, and only 2 of them that really, really, really have that really great ethereal sound that I like so much in Tool (Lateralus, 10,000 Days).

I understand what david is saying. let me give you an example. on push it, You can almost feel the pain as maynard is singing, you can feel it ripping at you soul, and Maybe 10,000 days does not touch him the same way. It touches me, i love the album. but it doesn't touch him as much as the other albums did....


and I can appreciate that. I didnt truely appreciate AENIMA until i was 17, I got the album when I was 14, I thought it was an awesome cd, but it didn't move me, until 2 or 3 years ago. It takes time to really let an album touch you, its like a fine wine, it takes time...

+25


I hope the new album ages well, but I have a sinking feeling it will not. Perhaps it is me that has changed, but Tool indeed do not seem as awesome any longer.

of course they R not as aggressive as before, they are older, wiser. They have a broader perspective on things, they use music as an instrument, a tool, to help cure themseves...every human being has the ability to cure himself...to heal. Can't anyone see that they are healing? Emotional healing is a very complex process i can't even begin to explain it...it's all about us, it's all inside of us...if people don't understand this album it is simply because they are not at the emotional level that this music expresses...after all this album (music) is not about any of you (us), so why would i judge it? how could i understand what it means to MJK? but if this healed him then it is the best music he ever wrote...remember this music is about him and him only...well the 4 of them...i hope no one is offended...

P.S.
english is not my primary language, forgive the lack of knowledge in it...

i think that their is a broad consensus that this album is not as sonically aggressive as previous albums and that mjk holds back on his vocal range to the detriment of the album IMO. When performing tracks live from previous albums, mjk had difficulty in hitting the high notes himself, i've seen a few shows and heard a couple of bootlegs, where as 10000 days, maybe other than the end of vicarious, he doesn't really scale the same great heights and most average singers can make the range.

I'm not sure what people mean when they say tool are doing new things and that this is a sign of maturity, development etc. yes, it is not as aggressive as previous albums, thats different but not necessarily developmental. i agree that too, shouldn't have to be as angry, but o don't believe that less anger equals more maturity. matchbox 20 isn't as aggressive either, doesn't equate with maturity.

i think this albums borrows most from past work and more so than lateralus and aenima borrowed from their predecessors. aenima was a huge quantuim and evolutionary leap at every level from undertow whereas most people can hear alot of previous albums 10000days.

My issues with the album is that it is not as aggressive and moving as previous albums, borrows alot from previous albums, and the new elements - mjk subdued vocals and vocal range, less aggression, increased harmonies, throwback to 70s rock, sounds like apc, is not particularly original and groundbreaking.

would be interested in feedback

Who gives a fuck. They're progressive, and that's all that matters.

Tool is progressive compared to the rest of the music world, of course, but have they really progressed from previous albums in light of my above points? im not sure they have...

this came to mind reading the OP

haha, what is this 1993? Did I miss something? Here Dave, grap onto the rope.......there's still a chance we might be able to save you.

On second thought, maybe we should just let this one go.

this paragraph:

"And most importantly, he's doing what so many bands are doing now, complaining about things that they truely don't care about. I don't want to listen to an hour of a band complaining about government decisions, I want to hear a band singing about what they feel inside themselves, what truely means something to them, what makes THEM cry, what makes THEM happy. Music isn't about stirring up controversy, it's about expression."

Has to be the silliest thing I've ever read anyone say about Maynard or Tool's music.

You musta been soooooo high.

I feel a bit confused as to why the person who started this thread believes they should continue to sound the same, I'm guessing he's meaning from Undertow and Aenima (sorry browser won't let me type it right). Looks like this man (or boy probably) doesn't feel the need to grow. We must accept the fact that we change. Nothing to do about it, it happens unconcsiously. Refer to the beginning lyrics of "Jambi" and how he talks about the "tempting the devil" He's using the past tense. He has changed. You can have your opinion about aggression, but being some angst-ridden alpha male punk just won't cut it when you get older.

By the way, the song is absolutely beautiful.

I really hate you saying 'socially exceptable' you really can't play it on a party. try me.

can I ask the reason You started to listen to their music? I mean, there are 10k aggresive groups. most are crap, though. some aren't.
I began to like them when i read some of the lyrics (english is not my first language) and they captivated something of me...
it wasn't their aggressiveness, it was the insight.
was it aggressive or disposition, it COULD touch somethning within.
.....................
in '93 i was only nine, I knew them only after Ænima, and began to listen far after lateralus. I still enjoy most of the old songs.
But to everyine his own - 10k days just couldn't contain jerk off... it didn't fit.
I would bet ten bucks some future albums will, though :)
not as much as before, maybe... (?)
Oh, and remember that not all the things an atrist makes gots its way to the public and some of the work that does, isn't 'new'. who knows, maybe lateralus was concieved back in the early '90?
who knows :)

cheers

A lot of hate here for someone in my mind who makes a valid point. I'm surprised myself that even after 6 rampaging years of a GW whitehouse the new album is as mellow as it is. Make no mistakes, TOOL has always been at their highest when they were aggressive as Ænima is still the pinnacle of their 'sound' for me.

That isn't to say I don't love the new stuff (moreso than most of Lateralus). Then again MJK is getting older and in the rock world they don't have much more longevity than the average baseball player.

I would like to give a big FU to all the people who would write off the love of aggressive music as stupid 'alpha-male' ragers. Aggressive/metal genre isn't something that you just 'grow out of'...I think you have it confused with nu-metal which is guilty of such charges.

Rosetta Stoned?

Man i was about to cry after reading you.

i think they will live loooong after their death.

that said, i'm gettin out of this fucked up place. and i mean really fucked up.
:,(

I apologize for the aggressive tone (how ironic) of my last reply. I just feel with their first Opiate and Undertow, yes very aggressive and I still like to listen to it, (been a fan since Aenima) they were young and for the first time they were voicing their own opinion to a mass audience. Of course your going to brash, pissed off, and saying whatever the hell they pleased. But you begin to see the change and growth with Aenima. Then the spiritualized enlightenment of Lateralus. And now (possibly too early to tell, yet what the hell) 10,000 days realizing that life moves on, death is always around the corner, have some fun while your here (I just love to laugh and enjoy Rosetta Stoned, I think it's more of a light hearted song), and ending on a note of looking back and seeing what we've done to each other and this spinning ball we live on. In the end, just adding the word "enough" to the title of this thread is the key. Maybe no longer as aggressive as they once were, but "enough" is only in the eye of the beholder.

i agree with some things... while others seem way off base