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Old 02-29-2004, 07:20 PM   #1
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The music theory game!

Ok, lets see if anyone in here is theory adept.

The game goes: one person ask a theory related question, whoever answers gives the next question. Simple enough.

I'll start with an easy one: What chord is the second inversion of a major triad?
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Old 02-29-2004, 07:59 PM   #2
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by OftenLost
Ok, lets see if anyone in here is theory adept.

The game goes: one person ask a theory related question, whoever answers gives the next question. Simple enough.

I'll start with an easy one: What chord is the second inversion of a major triad?
Umm...... inverting a chord doesn't change the harmony, there guy. It's still a major triad. A second inversion tonic chord is often used as a decoration of the V chord (but this is true in major and minor keys). Is this what you're refering to? If not what are you refering to? Do you want the notation? If so then it would be an upper case Roman Numeral followed by a: 6
4

Maybe I should start this... Although I can't say that I really like this idea for a game.

Anyway, here's my trivia question. How does the seventh degree of a V7 chord typically resolve?
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Old 02-29-2004, 09:27 PM   #3
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Re: The music theory game!

Yeah, I meant the answer to be a 6/4 chord. I probably worded the question wrong.
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Old 03-01-2004, 04:47 AM   #4
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Re: The music theory game!

rofl, first post loses. Too funny.
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Old 03-01-2004, 05:13 AM   #5
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Naked_Stalk
Anyway, here's my trivia question. How does the seventh degree of a V7 chord typically resolve?

Down by half step.


If you are in the key of F major, and you are playing a major chord in first inversion with the lowest note being A#(Bflat), name that chord...

An easier one, same key, F major, name the chord you'd resolve to in a deceptive cadance.
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Old 03-01-2004, 07:05 AM   #6
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by reedc33
Down by half step.


If you are in the key of F major, and you are playing a major chord in first inversion with the lowest note being A#(Bflat), name that chord...

An easier one, same key, F major, name the chord you'd resolve to in a deceptive cadance.
1) ii6
2) anything other than V or I, but most likely the vi which would be D minor

Describe binary form.
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Old 03-01-2004, 05:19 PM   #7
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Naked_Stalk
1) ii6

Nope.

N6. F# major in first inversion.
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Old 03-01-2004, 07:16 PM   #8
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by reedc33
Nope.

N6. F# major in first inversion.
I thought you might have meant that. The Bb was what threw me. I thought you might have meant the minor 2 chord, but I'm re-reading now and I see, you said major chord. I totally glazed over that bit. Right you are. The good ole neopolitan 6th. Apologies. Does this mean I lose the game? Heheh...
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Old 03-01-2004, 07:47 PM   #9
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Re: The music theory game!

lets see, can anyone tell me the order of the #s ?
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Old 03-02-2004, 05:15 AM   #10
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 8
lets see, can anyone tell me the order of the #s ?
Uh...F,C,G,D,A,E,B...


Key signature of the every guitar players favorite key, E flat MINOR?
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Old 03-02-2004, 05:45 AM   #11
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by reedc33
Uh...F,C,G,D,A,E,B...


Key signature of the every guitar players favorite key, E flat MINOR?

...goes and plays it on the piano...


Starting on Eb; F; Gb; Ab; Bb; Cb/B; Db; Eb

or D natural for a harmonic minor.


Somebody already did the sharps. Circle of flats, anyone?
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Old 03-02-2004, 06:13 AM   #12
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Re: The music theory game!

C F Bb Eb Ab Db Gb Cb(B) E A D G C
a d g c f bb eb ab db gb b e a

major and minor bitch.




Tell me the notes of the B7alt scale:
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Old 03-02-2004, 12:39 PM   #13
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ihatemickjagger
C F Bb Eb Ab Db Gb Cb(B) E A D G C
a d g c f bb eb ab db gb b e a

major and minor bitch.




Tell me the notes of the B7alt scale:

Order of flats: B, E, A, D, G, C, F...

At least the way I read that question. Order of flat keys? Your answer, bitch.

B7 altered scale? Hmm. I'm not a guitar player and that seems like something a gutiar player would know. The B7 scale could be altered in many ways and still fit the B D# F# A chord structure. There is flat nine and sharp nine, etc,..I don't know what you are going for....?
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Old 03-02-2004, 05:00 PM   #14
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by reedc33
Order of flats: B, E, A, D, G, C, F...

At least the way I read that question. Order of flat keys? Your answer, bitch.

B7 altered scale? Hmm. I'm not a guitar player and that seems like something a gutiar player would know. The B7 scale could be altered in many ways and still fit the B D# F# A chord structure. There is flat nine and sharp nine, etc,..I don't know what you are going for....?

It's a circle...notice how I ended it and started it on C.

and you're on the right track for the altered scale

B (root) C (flat 9) D (sharp 9) Eb (third) F (sharp 11) G (flat 13) A (dom/flat 7)

it's actually the seventh mode of the C Melodic Minor scale
C D Eb F G A B

edit: oh, it said circle of FLATS. i read it as circle of fifths. sorry :)
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Old 03-02-2004, 09:03 PM   #15
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ihatemickjagger
It's a circle...notice how I ended it and started it on C.

and you're on the right track for the altered scale

B (root) C (flat 9) D (sharp 9) Eb (third) F (sharp 11) G (flat 13) A (dom/flat 7)

it's actually the seventh mode of the C Melodic Minor scale
C D Eb F G A B

edit: oh, it said circle of FLATS. i read it as circle of fifths. sorry :)
I think that scale can be called something else...I can't remember, and I don't feel like getting out an Abersold...
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Old 03-03-2004, 12:06 AM   #16
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Re: The music theory game!

Very cool thread.

The scale is called a Jazz minor or Locrian #2nd. It is the same as C Major but with an Eb or Locrian with a # second. Also the same as the ascending melodic minor, bet that was what you were thinkin of Reed.
p.s. go check the mail

Here's mine
If I play G Mixolydian against F, what scale am I actualy palying?
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Old 03-03-2004, 12:36 AM   #17
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Re: The music theory game!

It's times like these that I realise how much there is to learn.
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Old 03-03-2004, 12:51 AM   #18
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Re: The music theory game!

yeah. i like power chords.
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Old 03-03-2004, 07:14 AM   #19
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by smirk
Very cool thread.

The scale is called a Jazz minor or Locrian #2nd. It is the same as C Major but with an Eb or Locrian with a # second. Also the same as the ascending melodic minor, bet that was what you were thinkin of Reed.
p.s. go check the mail

Here's mine
If I play G Mixolydian against F, what scale am I actualy palying?
What do you mean by that? THe way I see it, you're either playing G Mixolydian or you're not. If you played the same notes of a G Mixolydian scale but you used F as the tonic, you would be actually playing in Lydian. Is this what you mean?

If I'm right then my question will be: Give the fixed chromatic solfege for a Bb Melodic Minor Scale.
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Old 03-03-2004, 10:40 AM   #20
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Re: The music theory game!

Whoa. Never heard of that one.
I did some research and found that solfege is the Do Re Mi Fa So La Ti Do thing we're all familliar with, just never heard the name before.
Natural minors are read like so
Do Re M Fa So L T Do

pronounced may, lay and tay. Most solfege use the 'moveable Do' system where the root note is always Do. If by fixed you mean C is always Do then I guess it would be

Te' Do Re Me' Fa So Le' Te'

Am I close?

You were right about the scale. I use the natural modes and thier relationships (C Major same as G Mixolydian etc.) to open up the fret board and play any key in any position.
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Old 03-03-2004, 03:53 PM   #21
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by smirk

The scale is called a Jazz minor or Locrian #2nd. It is the same as C Major but with an Eb or Locrian with a # second.
Wouldn't it be a D#? Technically, Eb would be the same tone, but if it's a sharp 2nd that would imply a natural 3rd. So, the best way to write it would be D#...then we can have an E natural more easily.


Ya?
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Old 03-03-2004, 03:57 PM   #22
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by reedc33
Order of flats: B, E, A, D, G, C, F...

At least the way I read that question. Order of flat keys? Your answer, bitch.

Well, it could go both ways. What I meant was the order of flat keys (F=1b, Bb=2b, Eb=3b, etc).

Fun way to remember it...a friend of mine came up with the acronym Faggy Boys Eat A Damn Good Cock (FBEADGC). Dumb, but I bet you'll never forget it.
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Old 03-03-2004, 05:46 PM   #23
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by smirk
Whoa. Never heard of that one.
I did some research and found that solfege is the Do Re Mi Fa So La Ti Do thing we're all familliar with, just never heard the name before.
Natural minors are read like so
Do Re M Fa So L T Do

pronounced may, lay and tay. Most solfege use the 'moveable Do' system where the root note is always Do. If by fixed you mean C is always Do then I guess it would be

Te' Do Re Me' Fa So Le' Te'

Am I close?

You were right about the scale. I use the natural modes and thier relationships (C Major same as G Mixolydian etc.) to open up the fret board and play any key in any position.
You're on the right track. First of all melodic minor is different ascending and descending. What you have isn't too far off for someone who's never used the system before

Let's start simple. We know that Bb minor is the relative minor od Db major which has 5 flats (Bb, C, DB, Eb, F, Gb, Ab). To make the scale melodic minor we must raise the 6th & 7th scale degrees by a half step. Let's start there:

Te, Do, Ra, Me, Fa, So, La

Now descending, we will have to lower these notes that we just raised which will give us this:

Te, Do, Ra, Me, Fa, Sa, Le

Clear?

P.S. About the scale thing, you might want to consider just considering the harmony of the chord your improvising over. Say you're playing in G Mixolydian, and you are playing over the IV7 chord (C-E-G-B). When you're improvising a melody it makes sense that you want to relate any non-harmonic tones to the harmonic tones (i.e. changing tones, an appogiature). I find it a bit pedantic to consider changing keys when changing harmony. I mean if I'm playing in D Major and I get to the V chord I'm not thinking about playing in A Mixolydian. That's too complicated to be useful.

I suppose I should throw out another question. How about this (I'm gonna make things a bit easier): What note value gets the beat in 6:4 (Hint, it's not the quarter note)?
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Old 03-03-2004, 06:33 PM   #24
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Naked_Stalk
I suppose I should throw out another question. How about this (I'm gonna make things a bit easier): What note value gets the beat in 6:4 (Hint, it's not the quarter note)?

Uh, yes it is. 6/4. Number on top is the number of beats, number on bottom is the note that gets the beat. 6 beats, 4(quarter) gets the beat.

You probably meant to say which note gets the accent, in which case it's the 1st and 4th beats (1-2-3-4-5-6) Or, perhaps a dotted half note.

Si, senior?
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Old 03-04-2004, 08:00 AM   #25
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Re: The music theory game!

About the scale thing: I dont think about it that much while playing. I just know the relationships and the patterns or boxes. For example I know A Major is the same as E MIxolydian so I'm not limited to staying in one place in any given key. You have to study the stuff enough for it to be second nature so while you're improvising you can only think in melodic terms not "What is the related mode to Bb minor" or whatever.
All the natural scales and modes form one big pattern that fits together, thats just my way of remembering it and it works for me.
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Old 03-04-2004, 08:49 AM   #26
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by smirk
You have to study the stuff enough for it to be second nature so while you're improvising you can only think in melodic terms not "What is the related mode to Bb minor" or whatever.
All the natural scales and modes form one big pattern that fits together, thats just my way of remembering it and it works for me.

Okay, I finally remembered the modes thing.

These are based around C major (that is, each mode is all natural keys played starting on the given note)

A - Aeolian (Minor)
B - Locrian
C - Ionian (Major)
D - Dorian
E - Phrygian
F - Lydian
G - Mixolydian

Simple enough. I can only remember Major, Minor, Dorian, and Mixolydian without having to look it up.


No one has tossed out a question recently...

Given the chord pattern: Fmaj - Fmaj - Emin7b5 - A7b9 - Dmin7 - G7

What would be the best scale for improvisation over this progression (given that you can only pick one)
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:45 PM   #27
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Divine_left
Okay, I finally remembered the modes thing.

These are based around C major (that is, each mode is all natural keys played starting on the given note)

A - Aeolian (Minor)
B - Locrian
C - Ionian (Major)
D - Dorian
E - Phrygian
F - Lydian
G - Mixolydian

Simple enough. I can only remember Major, Minor, Dorian, and Mixolydian without having to look it up.


No one has tossed out a question recently...

Given the chord pattern: Fmaj - Fmaj - Emin7b5 - A7b9 - Dmin7 - G7

What would be the best scale for improvisation over this progression (given that you can only pick one)
The Key of F Major would suit those chords just fine.

here's one...
Diminished Scales repeat at an interval of:
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Old 03-05-2004, 12:19 PM   #28
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ihatemickjagger
The Key of F Major would suit those chords just fine.

here's one...
Diminished Scales repeat at an interval of:
A minor third

Easy one

How does the major in a major 7th chord refer to
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Old 03-05-2004, 07:27 PM   #29
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by smirk
A minor third

Easy one

How does the major in a major 7th chord refer to

It refers to the 7th tone. In the case of a major 7th, the 7th tone is 1/2 step below the tonic. With a regular 7th, the tone is 1 step below, which is, oddly enough, a minor 7th.


Hmm....a question: Dmin followed by Gmaj(m7) would resolve to what chord?
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Old 08-23-2009, 12:10 AM   #30
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Re: The music theory game!

C(triangle shape-lol)Major7,
is the correct answer.
Its funny,
i only found this forum
because I typed the following into google;

If Tool's JAMBI focus' mostly on the DMajorFlat7 key,
then what is the I Chord for JAMBI?

Hint: It's been mentioned in this thread recently.

Um,
And if anyone disagrees that jambi is written using DMajorFlat7,
let me know! I havent really been learning it,
just jammed along after doing some basic modal/scale/chord progression study.
Thanks.

So, Again,
Supposing Jambi's main riff is likely performed in the key of DmajorFlat7,
What is the TONIC, or I, or Root, or 1st or Ionion Key of JAMBI: Meaning: What pure Major Scale may you use to solo atop it, or under it, or with it?
Hint #2: its not Dmajor! :)

:)

Supposin'.
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Old 08-23-2009, 12:23 AM   #31
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Re: The music theory game!

this thread fucks me up
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Old 08-23-2009, 12:43 AM   #32
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Re: The music theory game!

its G Major! :) What?!
but I play FMajor on it too,
and like these scales to work over JAMBI,
just to fuck it up a bit.
:)
CHROMATICAL

I. F Major 6,7,9,11,13 (Ionian of FMajor)
II. G Minor 6,7,9,11,13 (Dorian of FMajor)
III. A Minor 7, flat9 (Phrygian of FMajor)
IV. B flat Major 7#11 (Lydian of FMajor)
V. C Major Flat7 (Mixolydian of FMajor)
VI. D Minor flat 13 (Aeolian of FMajor)
VII. E minor 7 flat 5 (Locrian of FMajor)

or,
just plug in G as the Major,
and
its the same chords as i just listed,
but differnt keys!

I. G
II. Am
III. Bmin7flat9
IV. CflatMajor7#11
V. DMajorflat7 (!) :)
VI. Eminflat13
VII F#minor7flat5

Easy Peasy, right Hodge?!
;)
no further questions, your hieney's.

Last edited by Bawslev; 08-23-2009 at 12:47 AM..
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Old 09-03-2009, 12:18 AM   #33
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Re: The music theory game!

So,
Tell us what chord is created when you play
E on string 6 (fat one) of standard electric guitar
E on string 5,(A string with 'standard' tuning)
B on string 4
D on string 3
F# on string 2 and
B on string 1


Ill give you the answer now:

A BADASS CHORD.

:)
One I have utlized as a basis for a new song which is supreme in its doomy/floydian/jazzy/souloudness.
:)
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Old 09-03-2009, 04:38 AM   #34
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Re: The music theory game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bawslev View Post
So,
Tell us what chord is created when you play
E on string 6 (fat one) of standard electric guitar
E on string 5,(A string with 'standard' tuning)
B on string 4
D on string 3
F# on string 2 and
B on string 1
:)
Bm/E, meh.
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Old 09-04-2009, 02:23 AM   #35
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Re: The music theory game!

Yes,I think so too... It is a right answer,ye?
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Old 09-04-2009, 06:16 AM   #36
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Re: The music theory game!

I was simply thinking of E Major,
but It is actually true, with the low E, under the Octave higher E,
and the BD F#,
it can be written Bm/E

Bm Being
B
C#
D
E
F#
G
A
B
and E Major Being
E
F#
G#
A
B
C#
D#
E

DMajor is the relative key of Bminor, in that the same notes are used in Bminor as in DMajor, in the same sequential order,
but starting on B and D for each key.
E Major's respective minor key is? That's right Youngster's, its
C# Minor,
C#Minor including these notes:
C#
D#
E
F#
G#
A
B
C#
So,
its his turn to ask a question.
one thing I suggest, is that instead of simply sharing what we think we know,
we try to provide theory hints to prove our knowledge,
so that if there are members who are not theoretically inclined,
they might learn here! :)
I know that a year ago,
I would have been able to answer very few questions here,
but now feel I may be able to answer most!
:)
WWHWWWH
WHWWHWW
:)
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