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Old 04-18-2004, 04:22 PM   #1
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Closed-Minded Christians

At age seven, I had a habit of never paying attention during church. Most of the time I fiddled with small pencils, doodled on information packets, or on the rare occasion, stared at the shot glasses just in front of me, wondering what Jesus-blood tasted like. This morning I had just learned how to write “Greg." The capital “G” intrigued me with its loops and intricate design. Well into my cursive practice on the red cushioned pews, I got restless. I found repetition grueling after the Children’s Sermon. The pastor often gave us lollypops as a token of good faith for coming up to the front of the church.

Now came the sharing of joys and sorrows. My young ears perked up, for this marked the only time in the service that members of the church spoke out. I wanted to be a part of this interesting ritual, just like I wanted to taste the blood once a month. I stood up, bracing my ink-black hands on my mom’s shoulder, and called out “Pastor Callaway!” He recognized me and gave a broad acknowledgement towards my direction. Pure bliss. Most people gave out a reverent laugh, except for my dad, who dunked me below the pew’s horizon line, barely muffling my “HI!”

I also recall a more serious time at a different church, sitting in the balcony watching the pastor below speak about God and his son. This was a different pastor, in fact I wasn’t supposed to call him pastor at all, but instead, “Reverend Bickle.” My dad didn’t like the new reverend. Instead of doodling, I often played with the children’s pamphlet, adorned with outlines of white lambs and candles. Without those paper distractions, I imagine God’s children would commit “blasphemy” and play Cops and Robbers using bible pages for paper-airplane bullets. This time in the balcony was different; I was no longer taken in by the words jumbles of “Genesis, Eve, and the Tree of Knowledge.” My chin rested on the pew in front of me, hands to the side of my head. Now all I needed was a two-by-four with semi-circle cutouts for my head and hands to make the stocks complete. My eyes floated around the blurry image of pious church-goers lost in prayer, convinced that God was actually here in Dubuque, Iowa. I had seen liars before. Who says the man with the white lace sash wasn’t lying?

“He couldn’t be lying could he?”

“Of course not, that’s ridiculous!”

He wasn’t lying. That would make my parents liars too. We agreed on most everything.

That Sunday service marked the day of my initial doubt. A hanging baby tooth named Curiosity. As a human, I had no choice but to pick at it until it fell out. God, Jesus and sermons were as real as Where the Wild Things Are. What open-mindedness! What a thoughtful young boy!

I began thinking more about the philosophical aspect of religion. Religion controlled me for so many years; its main purpose was control. Now I would control it.

My friends and I often sat down in a basement and shot pool instead of attending Varsity basketball games. We’d get into arguments about religion, politics and our general philosophy on life.

“I don’t understand it, how can there be an afterlife with no oxygen in the brain? It’s over; It’s done after that.”

“There is no truth.”

“God is a crutch.”

“Yea, yea… YEA!”

Eureka, we had it all figured out. We knew everything. We were so damn open-minded no one could argue with us. We knew we were right. I mean who honestly thinks there is a little red guy with horns and goat legs waiting in a sea of fire and brimstone to damn every evil soul to an eternity of pain and suffering?
We had our share of opposition. Pleasant Valley High School funded the notorious Young Life Christian student group. On the lunch tables we referred to them as “Xtians.” We got an occasional piece of inside info from a few members who didn’t take God as seriously as they took partying. Apparently they met at the Buffalo Bill Lodge near I-80 and their favorite activities included singing along to pop songs while sitting in a circle, and smearing peanut butter over each other’s faces. It was a cult. It was everything we hated. Childish games, popular culture and peanut butter.

“Why can’t you just be more open-minded?”

That was our defense for the Young Lifers to see it our way, to open up their mind and look at things from a different perspective; our perspective. It was perfectly logical. They would argue evolution with us, which didn’t seem to make much sense; a bunch of quacks talking about the inaccuracy of carbon dating, and loose analogies involving dinosaur bones and the scientific method. When Carrie Mappin quoted the bible in class we had a field day at lunch talking about how all the “bible thumpers” must have been brain-washed with some sort of technological holy water. Nothing could be proven.

“There is no truth.”

Of course we had to retaliate against the resistance to freeing our minds. The Man was trying to clamp our mouths shut. A few of my friends put up Fellowship of Satanic Athletes posters up in response to the FCA, Fellowship of Christian Athletes. After second period most of them were torn down by faculty or appalled students. We went on about how we should protest, but never did.
We devised a club, called The Young Gentlemen’s Club. We had sponsorship from a teacher and everything.

“This time we’re gonna fuck ‘em up from the inside.”

I went to the first meeting and then decided it was bullshit. I walked out with my friends. We all agreed it was a puppet show. We agreed on most everything.
High school went on and we continued to bicker, drowning out our own arguments with the word “yea.” Occasionally a friend would bring up a point about “Xtians.”

“I saw this guy who was a hard-core atheist on one of those evangelism channels. He studied and studied the scripture looking for a way to refute the bible and he turned out a born-again.”

We squawked about how he “probably got married” for a little while, then slowly sank back into the unanimous and unenthusiastic “yeah.”

We all loved to hate the mainstream. MTV, The Fast and the Furious, dieting, and above all, IGNORANCE. Lunch always brought about a certain quality of hateful laughter. We sat near those who we hated, girls in cheerleading outfits with an inch of makeup between their cheeks and our eyes. We all agreed they were stupid. We agreed on most everything.

Senior year came around. We were well past retainers, crater-acne and of course stupid teenage romance. Now, mere months separated us from eternal freedom; college. Girls started to become a factor. They always had been for me, but the others never led on to any sort of interest in the opposite sex. We agreed that girls were not the most important thing in the world. They were stupid, well most of them. All of them except the ones that talked to us…
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Old 04-18-2004, 04:24 PM   #2
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Page Two

“How are you Wu?”

She talked and looked at everyone with guarded euphoria. When she greeted me, each syllable shrank into a deeper inflection. She diagnosed and treated my entire mood with a simple hello.

I couldn’t believe she even talked to me. It was probably the fiftieth time we had exchanged greetings, yet every time it was a wonder that she felt I was important enough to receive her attention. She had everyone’s attention. Maybe she liked me, maybe she didn’t. I felt like a lucky grain of sand for those moments when we made eye contact. Who knew with this loose cannon? She dated some U of A sophomore, who would probably drink and laugh me under the table. She talked to my friends, my enemies, even Brian Campagna, the dorkiest and smartest guy in school who always seemed to be plotting a world takeover behind his empty coal irises. When they talked after class, he forgot all about the economic problems in Yugoslavia, instead, he grinned uncontrollably revealing his splotchy grayish teeth.

…Later that semester I walked into the lunchroom. I could “speed-walk” faster than anyone. I enjoyed it and no one could beat me to the food without breaking into a run. Two of my friends stopped me as I bolted. They agreed that running for Uncrustables and Pringles looked stupid, but walking was mildly humorous.

“Dude, Sheri has a huge crush on you. She thinks you are the cutest guy in school.”

At the speed of sound, my heart began beating towards cardiac arrest. No comparison to sprinting the 400 on resin filled lungs in under 1:10. My nostrils went numb and all sense became silent.

The next moment I had gathered myself.

“Yeah right.” I said.

She goes to Young Life, dates jocks, and I’m 5’7”. Her image emblazoned in the foreground of the hospital colored cafeteria. We all hated everything she stood for. It was a good thing I knew all of this. I stood my ground…

…until the next morning. I decided to take some initiative and talk to Sheri myself.

“Hey Sheri.”

She must not have heard me. She was too busy looking over next week’s assignments.

“HEY!”

Still nothing. She probably had a test next period. I saw her later in the halls.

“Hi.”

She must not have heard me.

“Sheri!”

She had already turned the corner.

What a bitch. I hear these things about her feelings and then suddenly all social contact is null and void? The next morning I see her talking to Dana, one of my best friends. We agree on most everything. She was wearing black high heels and nude-colored panty hose under a black skirt with beige pin stripes. Her camel colored top gently draped to the forearm; a t-shirt, mock turtleneck hybrid. Apparently she missed the memo a couple hundred years ago about the separation of Church and State. Just another prissy tease like the rest of them. Worthless, stupid, playing the game the others want her to. Dressing up like it’s Sunday.

A product of their closed mind.

Why can’t they just question authority for one second? Maybe Mr. Phillips doesn’t know the whole story about the Colonization of America. What if Pocahontas didn’t live happily ever after? How will they react when they die and slowly fade to nothing? Why can’t these people understand? Don’t they know that finding the truth will make you happy?

They are acting like a bunch of stupid seven year olds.
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Old 04-18-2004, 04:59 PM   #3
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

pretty good. ill continue to say that teenagers are stupid. all of them.
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Old 04-18-2004, 07:18 PM   #4
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpmanson
ill continue to say that teenagers are stupid. all of them.
agreed
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Old 04-18-2004, 07:29 PM   #5
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

is there more? It's good, but it left me hanging.
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Old 04-18-2004, 08:36 PM   #6
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

All teenagers a stupid... you my friend are closed-minded as well
I can say that I feel alot are stupid but so are alot of adults....but to say all are is a gross over-statement.
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Old 04-18-2004, 08:41 PM   #7
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Kind of like saying all ******s like chicken and watermelon.
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Old 04-18-2004, 09:29 PM   #8
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

I really like the story... I'd love to read more.
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Old 04-18-2004, 09:34 PM   #9
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

I agree with you but except for the truth part; and rebellion is not the way to go IMHO. It's possible that you have not found the truth yourself; its great that you're looking but I assure you that once you get rid of your negativity you will get a lot more closer to it. Try to be objective about the whole thing; its difficult but you have to try. I also advise you to look for a tolerant christian (yes, they exist) and discuss things in a civilized manner; it's not good to be pissed; it clouds judgement. But I salute you for seeing through the bullshit of high school.
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Old 04-18-2004, 10:24 PM   #10
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

no more?
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Old 04-18-2004, 11:46 PM   #11
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
Originally Posted by iknowmaynard
I agree with you but except for the truth part; and rebellion is not the way to go IMHO. It's possible that you have not found the truth yourself; its great that you're looking but I assure you that once you get rid of your negativity you will get a lot more closer to it. Try to be objective about the whole thing; its difficult but you have to try. I also advise you to look for a tolerant christian (yes, they exist) and discuss things in a civilized manner; it's not good to be pissed; it clouds judgement. But I salute you for seeing through the bullshit of high school.
your signature says it all. i think you may have missed the entire point.

as for the others...
i'm really not sure what to add. any suggestions? what do you feel is missing? right now i think the story is in a delicate balance with itself. perhaps you missed the ending's meaning. but maybe i should make that more clear, but i guess it's subtlty works to its advantage.

a-phex and friends...
my gross generalization was gross, you are right, and i apologize. but i do think that there is a stage everyone goes through similar to the common theme of 'teenage rebellion.' as for me being closed-minded... the point may have flew over your head as well. something i need to work on obviously.
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Last edited by GregoryWohlwend; 04-18-2004 at 11:50 PM..
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Old 04-19-2004, 04:46 AM   #12
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpmanson
pretty good. ill continue to say that teenagers are stupid. all of them.

Just like liberals?

Greg...good story. It was well written, even though I really don't agree with everything you said in it, it was very well written and fun to read. So, that's good.
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Old 04-19-2004, 09:34 AM   #13
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Fantastic story. Oh what the world could do with a little humility...
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Old 04-19-2004, 11:20 AM   #14
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

what is it that you guys don't agree with?
and...
what did you see as the deeper meaning in the story?
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Old 04-20-2004, 05:55 AM   #15
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Am I "And friends"?

I didn't read your story, and apologize for not doing so, but A-Phex IMed me talking about how it was a stupid statement and I felt obligated to reply because, while I hate most people my age, I still am that age, and even though everyone I know has at one point or another told me that I'm the definition of "The Exception", I STILL AM a teenager. I'll read it, possibly after I smoke a lot more weed (....It is 420 afterall, cliche or not it's time to celebrate) and get into more of a reading state. After all, it did seem to get raving reviews from the replies here. I'll try to give it my full critique.
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Old 05-31-2004, 11:23 PM   #16
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

it's good... but... i think i'm missing something here...


greg, care to elaborate?
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Old 05-31-2004, 11:33 PM   #17
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdseason17
it's good... but... i think i'm missing something here...


greg, care to elaborate?
what do you think you're missing?
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Old 05-31-2004, 11:53 PM   #18
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Too tired to read it all right now, but I will say that from what I can tell it seems pretty interesting hopefully it proves a good read for later. I liked the part about people arguing about the "innaccuracy of carbon dating".

It hits home, my brothers first (who is a foot taller than me and quit imposing when arguing with him on touchy subjects such as this) started talking about how scientists carbon dated the moon as 10,000 years old. I know, you can't carbon date the moon, and if you could you wouldn't be able to because when it was dated with diffent compound it was found to be about as old as the earth, but none the less he claimed they did. Then he said something about 6,000 year old slugs. I bled from my brain that night.

It hurts me in many fashions the lies that people make up to try to prove their inviable points. Especially when I know and befriend these people, no matter how big and malicious they are.
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Old 06-01-2004, 09:47 AM   #19
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregoryWohlwend
what do you think you're missing?

Um... well, what's the overrall message/theme?
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Old 06-01-2004, 10:51 AM   #20
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

I get the whole holier-than-thou, conflicting points of view thing, and the hypocrisy idea but I feel I may have missed...

No wait, I just re-read it. Vey clever, I like.


*Edit: That was a really good story, by the way. I enjoyed reading it.*
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Old 06-01-2004, 11:16 AM   #21
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amethyst Believer
I get the whole holier-than-thou, conflicting points of view thing, and the hypocrisy idea but I feel I may have missed...

No wait, I just re-read it. Vey clever, I like.


*Edit: That was a really good story, by the way. I enjoyed reading it.*
don't be shy, what did you catch? you can pm me if you'd like...


third...
i can't tell you, it violates the whole principle behind writing, just tell me what you thought it was about, that's all.
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Old 06-01-2004, 01:05 PM   #22
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Well... I'm guessing the point was that your group of friends was being just as close minded as the Young Lifers.... and in turn, everyone was being a dumbass...
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Old 06-01-2004, 04:34 PM   #23
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

I just meant the way the end showed how far the character had come from truly understanding what it meant to question, even though throughout the story he is equally convinced of his 'open-mindedness'. The focus changes from a fascination with possibilities, to condemnation of those who do not think likewise. Or that's how it came across to me.

I didn't understand the end until I went back and read the beginning. My short-term memory isn't holding up too well at the moment.
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Old 06-01-2004, 04:53 PM   #24
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Man that's a wicked story. Kinda like my life actually except I'm a "stupid teenager" but nah the first bit about the breaking free from church is exactly what i went through when I became a "stupid teenager". The end of it I didn't really understand though... Then again I am just a "stupid teenager"
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Old 06-01-2004, 05:15 PM   #25
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Wow man, that's all I have to say. I loved this story, I love how it was written with the overall... I'm not sure what word to use... satire/sacrasm I guess. I'm saving this to my computer.

Anyways, the way I see this story is the way I have been perceiving the world/my friends/myself (only recently myself) and it's hypocrisy, I'll see if I can narrow down specifics.

-The way you guys always agreed on everything, almost creating this little bubble to make you all feel so smart. When in reality you're just getting opinions from those who agree with you to increase your "intelligence" instead of trying to see what the other side has to say. Being close-minded yourself.

-The atheist guy "probably got married" is your defense for his conversion, meaning basically "girls... were stupid, well most of them. All of them except the ones that talked to us…" (great quote by the way, I love it, the satire... *drools*). However, as soon as that one girl Sheri seemed to like you, you seemed interested. Then, once you were... rejected or whatever, you went back to disliking girls, putting her in the category as every other "tease".

-Xtians... lol

Those are the basic ones that I can pin-point. The whole article was REALLY good. I can admit that I do these things too (I don't like girls unless they talk to me, mainstream is crap compared to the "real" underground stuff, etc) but when it comes down to it, my ego still tries to put me above all of the others who think they're better.

Maybe I got a different idea from what you were trying to point out, but the ideas it gave me... very nice.
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Old 06-02-2004, 01:04 AM   #26
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

"Be careful, lest in fighting the dragon you become the dragon."
-Nietzsche.

Nice.
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Old 06-02-2004, 06:31 AM   #27
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Sorry. I must be stuck in toolavision land. I thought it was all about anal sex.

;)
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Old 06-02-2004, 01:03 PM   #28
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

thanks for the nice comments guys, i'm glad you enjoyed it, it's a nonfiction piece if you couldn't tell already. there isn't a right or a wrong answer, and since this first draft i've revised once or twice, but nothing big, just a few things here and there with the addition of another scene in the beginning.

and as always, mithrandir was the closest.
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Old 06-07-2004, 12:56 PM   #29
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
Originally Posted by iknowmaynard
I agree with you but except for the truth part; and rebellion is not the way to go IMHO. It's possible that you have not found the truth yourself; its great that you're looking but I assure you that once you get rid of your negativity you will get a lot more closer to it. Try to be objective about the whole thing; its difficult but you have to try. I also advise you to look for a tolerant christian (yes, they exist) and discuss things in a civilized manner; it's not good to be pissed; it clouds judgement. But I salute you for seeing through the bullshit of high school.
What exactly do you mean by a tolerant christian?
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Old 09-23-2004, 07:22 AM   #30
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
What exactly do you mean by a tolerant christian?
Those things exist? Wow, where? ;)

Actually going strictly by the word of the "good book" "TRUE" christians aren't supposed to be tolerant. They are supposed to preach to high heaven about the "word" and the "truth" and see anyone that doesn't follow that belief as lost and going to hell. Of course nowadays just like everything else, it's becoming more PC and relaxed with saying "well.... let's not take EVERYTHING the bible says literally, maybe we can tolerate gays.. even though our religion says they're sinning and going straight to hell".

:)

Now before the smartass comments get anyone pissy (like I would actually care since these are all pixels on a monitor) I do think that Jesus sounded like he was a very cool dude. It's everything else that I really like to pick on.

Oh, and cool story, I love the sarcasm in it. :) Reminded me alot of my highschool days (except I mostly hung out behind the school with the other potheads, and we DID run to lunch to get the food first, lol)
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Old 09-23-2004, 03:33 PM   #31
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Re: Closed-Minded Christians

Quote:
Originally Posted by VaporWare
Those things exist? Wow, where? ;)

Actually going strictly by the word of the "good book" "TRUE" christians aren't supposed to be tolerant. They are supposed to preach to high heaven about the "word" and the "truth" and see anyone that doesn't follow that belief as lost and going to hell. Of course nowadays just like everything else, it's becoming more PC and relaxed with saying "well.... let's not take EVERYTHING the bible says literally, maybe we can tolerate gays.. even though our religion says they're sinning and going straight to hell".
That's only debatably true. If you remember, Jesus ate with sinners regularly. His best friend was a prostitute. The bible does say homosexuality is a sin, but it doesn't necessarily say they should be persecuted - on earth - for it. According to the bible, a "TRUE" Christian is someone who does justice, loves kindness and walks humbly with his God.
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