I thought that jimmy was about Maynard.

It's about Maynard and Judith.

"Eleven and she was gone.
Eleven is when we waved good-bye.
Eleven is standing still,
Waiting for me to free him
By coming home."

She had her stroke and began her "10,000 days in the fire" when Maynard was eleven years old. I think that Maynard is personifying his innocence; innocence lost when his mother lost her life (as described in WFM- ". . . never lived a life . . ."). It seems to me that he wishes to reclaim his innocence by revisiting the tragedy- a metaphorical journey to the home of his innocence:

"Under a dead Ohio sky,
Eleven has been and will be waiting,
Defending his light,
And wondering...
Where the hell have I been?
Sleeping, lost, and numb.
So glad that I have found you.
I am wide awake and heading home."

But now back to your originally scheduled programming . . .

Well, i thought than the She that is mention there was some sort of a lover but now that you wrote that, make sense to be Judith.

Interesting that the number 11 seems to be recurring on 10,000 days also.

ok first off, i went over this in another thread before and second, i just quoted him, ok?

ha ha ok ok, thought you were attacking me. Sorry, it's all good!

Jesus Christ


Jesus Christ

Yeah, that isn't too obvious.

</sarcasm>

[QUOTE=Absolute_Zero;1167802]I thought Eulogy was about Bill Hicks [QUOTE]

I always thought the same thing, if you listen to his comedy, and if you know how he died... well he was a martyr for HIS (bill) cause

Bill died from cancer as far as I know...that doesn't fit into my definition of a martyr.

For the most part I would say music is up to interpretation. However in the case of Eulogy, it is most definately not about either Jesus, Bill Hicks or Judith.

First off, Maynard respects Jesus. He may not agree with modern christianity but he's not foolish enough to attack a great human.

As for Bill Hicks and Judith. He states in the song he swallowed his "facade". Both of these people may not have been living the "correct way" you can argue that. I would bet however that they are true to themselves and there is no facade going on here. Hicks lived on the boundaries of society and had his own ideas. Judith wasn't a christian to fool others. Her son was Maynard, I would think if she was so easily controlled, a man such as him would have changed her mind.

Finally I come to the conclusion that Eulogy may have first been written to attack L. Ron Hubbard, but like it has been said before, it can be interpreted for a wide array of people.

P.S. "Don't you step out of line, don't you fucking lie." Sounds to me like Maynard is recollecting on his days in the military, maybe the whole song is an attack on military leaders claiming to die for their country, well fuck you asshole.

you people are so fucking stupid in your analyses of tools songs...eulogy is about jesus christ...it couldnt be more plain and simple...matter of fact i had a friend who is a theologian take a look at the lyrics and he considers them to be blasphemous and is a tool fan...tool songs are not that hard to figure out half of them are about anal sex and the other half about trying to repent that you had anal sex...and as far as bill hicks is concerned the band loved him and looked up to him as a mentor thats why he is given time on the cd and inner sleeve...i dont know why i am typing this shit i feel so dirty now having been on a fansite for ANY band...

"Eulogy" by far - "Wings" is pretty superfluous.

Folks... just enjoy the music will ya?

It's safe to say The Noose was influenced by the death of his mother, perhaps he did not make ammends with the frustration that her faith caused him to feel. Smoke PCP all day/every day. GFY.

I always thought Eulogy was about Kurt Cobain for some reason. Think I read it somewhere on some unofficial Tool site.

i had something interesting to say but all the coffee has made me ill.

(worst 1st post ever!!!!!)

Superfluous? I what way?
It's the first movement for 10,000 Days, or 10,000 Days is the second movement for Wings for Marie. How in any way is that superfluous?

yeah i agree y do people try to figure out maynards meaning, sure there is a meaning for the song but its meaning is what ever the listener wants

I think it's interesting that Wings eulogizes someone. I think in that way the two tracks are associated. Eulogy seems to be more of the speaker taking issue with martyrs in general, while Wings deals with a specific martyr and the speaker's wish to critique and pay respect for her at the same time. Lyrics like "never told a lie/well, might have told a lie/but never lived one" seem to emphasize this.

For Eulogy to be specifically about Jesus is problematic because of the last few lyrics:

"To ascend you must die/you must be crucified/for our sins and our lies"

The speaker here seems to be explaining to the failed martyr (Hubbard or any number of candidates) what is required to be a Christlike martyr, and that because this person didn't do this they don't qualify and their martyrdom was in vain.

It's also problematic to imagine anyone's reading of the bible to include an interpretation of Jesus "ranting and pointing his finger at everything but his heart" or someone that was "so loud" and who "sure could yell". Perhaps an apt description of many of the ministers, preachers and prophets who have taken up Christianity, but Jesus isn't generally interpreted this way. It seems more a reference to any number of dictators such as Hitler.

I think Eulogy's non-distinct inferrence offers endless possibilities, which does open up the possibility of the song having something to do with Judith on an implicit level. She does stay strong in the faith despite her paralysis, after all. A faith which the speaker considers incomprehensible. They are the only two songs that come to mind that actually eulogize, and it's interesting to note the change in the approach between the songs. It mirrors the change in attitude between Third Eye and Rossetta Stoned (two other songs which seem connected for various reasons) from transcendence and self-discovery to utter sarcasm and cynicism.

my view:

Eulogy: I think Tool is using a strong false martyr as an example of someone who has that martyr archetype. I think the songs message is not to one particular person but for any "martyr" like person that is listening. This person seems to have a scarred inner child possibly from being ashammed as a child. They will suffer greatly to make others happy because of their bad ashammed childhood memories. This person seems to be calling for attention. Death is referring to the death of the martyrs own suffering and of the false/fake ego. hes healing the scars of the inner child. Crucifying the ego and resurrecting as the true self/ divine child.

jimmy: I think its about his inner child which is scarred, wounded, and abandoned. His inner child is scarred by all sorts of childhood experiences and horrible memories. I say he was abandoned because his mother was no longer around to be there physically. "jimmy" is about healing the wounds of the inner child and by doing so he is finding his inner child.

Pardon my whole inner child theme with Aenima. Aenima is after all full of jokes and is just screaming, "find that inner child and have fun once again."

Wings for Marie/10000days: To me I think his mom is just a good example of someone who was pretty much pure and next to eliminating that false ego. He does say that she never lived a lie and she illuminated her little piece of the divine.

I found that a lot of these Tool messages apply to almost everybody and that these songs are more then about themselves or certain people.

me like this vary much. vary to much therry. i like, it intertane me alot. i thaink u vary much. agen, i thainks to u all. vary gud therries. opinyun funny.

Word the fucking fuck up. It shouldn't matter who the subject is, it's the message.

it's a song, open to interpretation. the whole point is to apply it, not impose it.

word

bye dude

i just wanted to comment on Benjamin post that Maynard respects Jesus...I think in Sober he is directly talking junk to Jesus saying his mssg is old and tired out...that being said...if the noose is about Judith as well as Judith which is obvious it seems to me he takes a pretty aggressive stance towards his mother and her beliefs...and that seems to change in WFM/10000 days....and for me personally Eulogy is about my grandfather and i think of him when i hear it... however i still loved him very much ...no matter if he was a hypocrite or like the person described in eulogy

Maynard isn't even talking to Jesus in Sober. When you look at where the comma is you realize that Keenan is simply swearing... which is why Kabir responds to this question the way he does in the FAQ.

Opiate is the same way. It isn't about Jesus Christ coming to save anyone. It's "Jesus Christ, why don't you come save my life now?" He could be talking to anybody.

Thanks for taking that friggin idiot off paraflux!! I think some of the smartest people are on this website. I even envy half of them for having such in depth feelings for Tool and their music. It's a beautiful thing. I would have to say that I'm definitely more knowledgeable about the music instead of the lyrics. Just to sit back and get lost gives me my cleansing!!! NEVER DOWN A TOOL FAN!!!

I dunno if these songs are directly about his mother but if I'm feeling sad about the passing of my own mother I like to listen to The patient, disposition, Jambi, Right in two, 3 Libras, Sleeping beauty, Thinking of you, Weak & powerless, The noose, Gravity .... I'm sure I'm forgeting some of my favorites but thats a good start.

Amen to that. Everytime I listen to "Wings" or "10,000 days" I get taken back to my grandmother's funeral. Carrying her casket. Speaking at her funeral. She battled cancer for over fifteen years and was an extremely devout Catholic. It seems eerie to me sometimes how much these songs remind me of that time in my life. It might seem hokey to some people, but if you've lost someone close, these songs paint a great picture of the experience.

Yeah man, Wings 1 & 2 are pretty hard for me to listen to. As well as Parabol / Parabola (Wich I can't believe I forgot to put in my list BTW)

It's not really the whole song that chokes me up, but just little phrases and stuff...


"A light in your eyes then immobilized... Broken ... Broken. Fell at the hands of those movements that I wouldn't see Yet it was you who prayed for me. So what have I done To be a son to an angel? What have I done To be worthy?"


"But, enough about the collective Judas.
Who could deny you were the one who
Illuminated your little piece of the divine?

And this little light of mine, a gift you passed on to me;
I'm gonna let it shine to guide you safely on your way,
Your way home ...

Oh, what are they going to do when the lights go down
Without you to guide them all to Zion?
What are they going to do when the rivers overrun
Other than tremble incessantly?

High is the way, but all eyes are upon the ground.
You were the light and the way they'll only read about.
I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out.
Ten thousand days in the fire is long enough;
You're going home."

You see my mother was a faithful Christian and a brilliant school teacher who somehow contacted a very rare brain degenerative disease called Cruetzfeldt Jakobs Disease. It took her from perfectly normal to completely disabled in a little more than 2 months. The music of Tool & A Perfect Circle have helped me throughout the whole transition.. I loved their music before all of this happend but it took on a whole new life during and after.

lol, do you know what 'thinking of you' is about?

I take it by your post that its not about his mother? So is "thinking of you" a negative song? I dont really analyze APC's songs so Im wondering myself.

LOL, it's about sex. And i don't think in a way of "mother" and "fucking" in one sentence.

BTW, if you think sex is a negative thing T_I_S, you may think of "Thinking of You" as a negative song.

no, its not a negative song. It is about masturbation.

APC is pop rock.

fxd.