1. Is it impossible that, to 100% avoid a leak that they just showed the decoy to people for review? Isn't it at all possible that what we all are hearing will be released AS WELL as something else that is under heavy gaurd? Say what you will about the power of the net, i do believe it IS POSSIBLE to prevent a LONG AWAITED album such as tool from leaking.

2. Whatever it takes to surprise your fans with another CD. It's not impossible that they were just lazy with this CD and didn't care much if it got leaked because they ARE only b-sides/rarities.

3. Blair.

4. Who said that they were re-recorded? Why can't these songs just be songs that were lying around and never used? From the Lateralus session, for example. Time wasn't wasted if they were already recorded and mastered.

5. Maybe, to make it seems more believable, they put that song on the album for convincing purposes.

your turn.

But my point is, leaking a "sacrificial lamb" would have the same effect as far as making money goes. They save the "real" cd getting leaked, sure, but they spent a lot of extra time and money on a hoax that is going to hurt record sales the same as a true leak would.

it's easier for them to ignore and dismiss then to offer a logical explanation most of the time.

agreed.

Of course, it is POSSIBLE. The question is: why? So a critic can give the album a mediocre review because he felt it wasn't up to par? Isn't that the risk they would be taking by presenting a B-sides album to critics? Because, as you say, these songs aren't up to the quality of past albums, so they must be B-sides. What was the point of the listening sessions to begin with?

Why do the interview at all? Guitar World is probably the most legitimate and respected guitar magazine in the world. He did an interview with them before Lateralus came out and it didn't keep him from revealing information about that album, so why should it be any different this time?

So, I guess there never was a song called LK that was 17 minutes long either. I'm sure you weren't thinking he was lying then. Now, when you finally hear it and are dissapointed in it, you call him a liar. Why? Because he lied to us 5 years ago about Systema Encephale (or however you spell it)? Because you don't like the songs?

The quality in the guitar (especially the distortion) is much better on this album than it was on Aenima, Undertow, and Opiate, that's for sure. Is it better sounding quality than Lateralus' sound? Questionable. However, it's argued that these songs are b-sides from a bunch of different albums, so if they weren't re-recorded, shouldn't they sound different from each other instrument-wise? The drums sound different from each other on Aenima and Lateralus. Maynard' mom died after Lateralus was released. I don't see how that song could have been recorded during the Lateralus sessions or even before that.

Except, a lot of people feel it's one of their best songs already and no doubt the band would feel that way too. Why put a song that was so emotionally important to Maynard on a "fake" album?

I, and others have already offered a logical explanation. Lots of bands use material they come with on tour to write new songs with. "The Patient" intro guitar riff can be heard on some Aenima tour bootlegs.

The point of the listening sessions were to see the response. I never said that they wouldn't release what we have/heard. I do believe that the 11 songs that were leaked WILL be released on May 2nd, however, I think something ELSE will be released with it. Why not show the 'other' album at a listening session? Wouldn't you like to have a BRAND NEW/UN-HEARD tool cd along with this one on May 2nd?
Why do the interview at all? To add to the shock. Like I said, I think this will be released, so Adam wasn't lying at all. He just wasn't releasing ALL the information. Remember, they ask the questions... He chooses what to say and what not to say. What to let out and what to remain a secret.
At any point did I say Blair lies about everything? It's just one of those twists and turns thing. Using Blair and/or a Newsletter as foundation for arguement probably isn't the best idea. But you and I both did. So using Blair or a newsletter written by Blair would equal running in circles.
I don't think this song was recorded during Lateralus... actually, it couldn't have been. And you say people are saying this is the best song written by them. That's a matter of opinion. Who's to say that they don't have 11 songs that are BETTER than this one? Are we to now believe that no song that TOOL will write from now on will be better than Wings/10,000 Days?

I can't help but feel sorry for anybody who has all their hope tied up in thinking this is a decoy/hoax/sacrificial lamb/etc. What will you guys do when all of this self-generated hype implodes and you are left with that which you believe to be 'not worthy' of Tool: 10,000 Days?

To be so caught up in believing anything beyond 10kD exists is just a setup for disappointment.

And I can only imagine what the boys from Tool must think if/when they come across this kind of skepticism. Seems like it would suck that you release an album that you poured everything into just to have people brush it off as a fake.

If ever there was an maximum, a threshold, of getting your hopes up for an album, it would be this talk of an imaginary album. I wish you guys the best of luck in recovering on May 2nd, I really do.

Fair enough. I don't think we will ever agree with each other on this. So, there isn't really much sense in arguing. Your view on saying another cd will be released with it on May 2nd is interesting, no doubt about that. However, it being a b-sides cd would more so explain why it's only selling for $10.98 at Amazon. You should use that in your argument. Double discs can cost up to 30 dollars in some stores. The whole obsession with stereoscopic images on Adam's myspace page and the way the supposed cover looks, with how it's two faces that actually form one face if you look at it closer, it would fit your argument. Have you mentioned that stuff yet?

Quoted to illustrate the truth of the matter.

no, i haven't. but that's a good point. good to see that you CAN see my side of the arguement though. however, the whole cd being under priced for a double disc, well... that's where the 10,000 YEARS (being $24.49) CD comes into play. Amazone AND Target HAD it advertised, but i guess it got taken down. Time will tell. And with that, work time. Peace.

This isnt a bad theory, but highly unlikely. Its fun to dream though, getting two albums would be unreal. Im happy either way, this new album is fuckin rad. Nothing will ever top Lateralus though... that album was epic and their best work in my opinion.

"The greatest deception the devil every orchestrated was to convince the world that he did not exist."

People would rather believe a lie when the truth is unpalatable to them.

First off, I'll say this now: assuming the hoax theory holds, Kabir, the band, Blair, etc. must be rendered untrustworthy sources of official information. This is because of the burden they bear in maintaining the hoax. All of them must be on the same page, so to speak, because they must be consistent in their facade. This goes for the media reviews as well, and that is why Tool understood that the media must be given 10,000 Days (instead of the "real" album). Basically, those in the media who were granted preemptive listens of the "new" album were listening to the very same leak we currently have, and thus, it follows that the media's reviews would parallel our own listens of 10,000 Days.

Unfortunately, this is a subjective piece of evidence, and being a non-guitarist, I have no knowledge on the subject. I will say, though, that I have heard guitarists state otherwise, but only a couple out of a total of, probably, less than ten.

I'll quickly reference my response to (1.) and state that, again, consistent with the hoax theory, it is expected that the newsletters, Blair posts, Kabir posts, Kabir review, etc. all maintain the same position, namely, that this is the new album. And they won't change their stance any time soon, unless they finally confess to the hoax. I think there was a reason why Kabir only extolled the new album in his review, and in the process, dropped little golden nuggets like one-liners and such, or this song sounds so much like this older Tool song (which is unremarkable evidence due to the fact that the album so conveniently does sound uncannily like previous albums). In my opinion, Kabir obviously prepped us with what we wanted to hear, and what we were going to hear. He only sugared ears that so desperately wanted to be sugared.

Also, it's important to note, I think, that Blair has had absolutely no hand in any of this in quite a long while. This is quite intentional, because we all know Blair's history of being a cheap little bastard. So, the band and co. decided that the burden fall to Kabir, who's always been on "our" side. I mean, look, the guy created this website--of COURSE people were going to trust him before Blair!

I agree that they were recorded fairly recently, but also that they may have been written anytime during/after Aenima's release, therefore, it didn't take them much time to write/record/produce 10,000 Days. I currently believe the following regarding the leak: I don't think it may ever be released as an official album because it doesn't need to be. The leak is going to stay just that, a leak. It served its purpose under the hoax theory and is obviously unneeded now, assuming that there is another album, the "real" new album, to be released on a certain date we do not know (which could very possibly be after May 2nd).

To make it all the more believable. Trust me, I know it truly does sound crazy, especially with all the exceptions and the grand assumption that the most official of Tool sources are pulling our leg. But, I have to say, given Tool's history of hoaxes in general, plus the fact that they're not the biggest fans of their fans (and other evidence that I've mentioned in previous threads but doesn't apply to your comments here), I'm going with the hunch that Tool are just being pranksters, yet again.

EDIT: And sorry this took so long; I basically was almost done writing this response, and then hit the reload button or something, and it was all lost.

No, I find it more objective. Adam stated he was experimenting with more effects on the new album and here it is, loud and clear. He didn't stray too much from his usual style on their past albums. Using a wah-wah occasionally on Lateralus could have been considered "risky" for him. He goes way farther than that on this album.

I can't really respond to the rest of your message because it's opinion based. You believe what you believe and I believe what I believe. We won't agree with each other. I just have a feeling about that.

I would love to believe this theory, but, like it or not (I for one, do like it) 10,000 days is the real deal. Live with it.

You can tell they were all recorded and produced at the same time... the album sounds like that.

Same instrument sounds, same levels, etc.

Well if it remains a leak, it shall be the greatest fake album leak ever. I do truly like this album.

If it's a B-sides album to accompany a true new release... well by god not only will I be happy, but it'll be a master stroke of genious.

Ok, picture this:
They record a double album- Disc one, a proper album. Disc two- b-sides, unreleased shit, rarites, all rerecorded.
But then, they don't want it leaked before it's release, so they make it out like disc 2 is the album. They leak it all on purpose so people will stop hunting for the real album

In fact, they even play disc 2 to media and shit so EVERYONE thinks it's the new album.

Then on may 2nd we have 10,000 Days, but right beside it is 10,000 Years or something else which is the real new album.



Crazy? Yes. Implausible? Yes. Unlikely? Yes. Impossible? Hell no.

As do I...



As do I. :)

it is a great theory, hope like hell its real. but realistically lets not get our hopes up.

“Seems like it would suck that you release an album that you poured everything into just to have people brush it off as a fake.”

But this is what I’m saying!
It doesn’t seem that after seeing what Tool created buy pouring their heart out for the last 4 albums, that this is the result of pouring their heart out. It just doesn’t make any sense to me that after 5 years and countless pouring their heart out, that this is what comes out, something is not right in Tool land to me.

What's there to say? It's obviously the same stuff.

"I currently believe the following regarding the leak: I don't think it may ever be released as an official album because it doesn't need to be. The leak is going to stay just that, a leak. It served its purpose under the hoax theory and is obviously unneeded now, assuming that there is another album, the "real" new album, to be released on a certain date we do not know (which could very possibly be after May 2nd)."


despite what anyone may believe about tool hating the recording industry, they are still artists. these days, almost every successfull artist is either a business man or has a business man running the show (the money side of things). as artists that depend on their art as income, i highly doubt that they would just "give you" this album for "free". be a little realistic here. double album, uh maybe, it is in the so called realm of possibility. but think of it this way for a sec: the dominant force on this album is wings for marie 1&2 and there just so happens to be exactly 11 songs on this album. then again maybe i am the one reading too much into these things....

From Kabirs mouth:
And so, it was time for "Viginti Tres." But my host was running late for dinner, and I was as well. It's another segue, I was told. I'll hear it soon, I said. We left the ... booth. last song.

Is it interesting that the last song is described as a segue? Does that imply more to follow?

So essentially all the 'hoax' and 'sacrificial lamb' theories about the leaked release are because some don't like the new Tool album? Other than pure speculation I have yet to see an actual FACT that would have a person begin to speculate that the leaked version is a decoy or anything but the real version...

If you don't like the new Tool that's fine with me...makes getting tickets for the May 12th show a little easier for me...

And I too must quote Fd2Blk because I think he has put it best...

"If ever there was an maximum, a threshold, of getting your hopes up for an album, it would be this talk of an imaginary album. I wish you guys the best of luck in recovering on May 2nd, I really do."

with the actual mix tapes, you can change any level.

Yeah but you can't change the fact that, for example, Adam Jones was using totally different gear in the Undertow era, and totally different gear in the AEnima era, and different gear again in the Lateralus era.

And the album's sounds seem pretty homogenised to me.

Plus Maynard sounds undeniably different too. In a good way, but different.

Also, does the fact that a lot of the track names sound like working titles (Jambi, Rosetta Stoned, The Pot?) lend a bit of creedence to this implausible theory.

Funny, anyhow. :)

Consider what proloific and accomplished musicians the members of Tool are.

Five years is a VERY long time to work on anything, let alone an album. Imagine the sheer volume of material that those four could have hammered out during that time. I'm no musical genius myself, but I've written 11 strong, technically demanding songs in two months before. These guys are beyond brilliant, have tremendous resources at their disposal (unlike myself) and they've had five years to get this album together....

Is it not inconcievable that perhaps the leaked album was just a taste of what's to come?

Besides, knowing Tool's penchant for misinformation and the general fucking with of people, I wouldn't put it past them to have orchestrated the leak themselves.

That said, sacrifical lamb or not, the leaked material is trully brilliant. You just have to be open to it. Latteralus was a departure too. All you naysayers, I have a word for you - the word is HEADPHONES.

Man, I can't wait for May 2nd.

Exactly. This happened with the latest Dredg album a year ago. A demo version with lots of weird noise interludes leaked and it was credited as the real thing, but the actual album sounded a lot better. I'm sure many people were turned off by how the internet fake version sounded...

If the definition of the word is any indication one would have to assume so. Something cant be defined as a segue if nothing follows it.

SO TRUE, I remember this being played live when I saw them during lateralus tour. Holy shit man.....you fuckers are getting my hopes up.

YOU'RE ALL WRONG!!! I made this album and forced Maynard to sing on it with my Super Soaker....

oh ya? lets hear some proof on that.

um this did not happen. The songs for Catch without Arms were all played live before the album came out. The leak was of these new songs.

personally, i do not believe this theory crap. BUT, for the love of TOOL, i hope you guys are right. if the band read this about their album, and as i suspect, it turns out to actually be the real album, what are all of you "fans" going to do then? this album is brilliant, not comedic. imagine spending years of your life creating this and reading that your fans think its a joke. if all of these theories are wrong, and this is the album, the egg will not easily wipe off of your face.

I like this theory based on the fact that there is a "10,000 days import" coming out may 16th if you check amazon