they don't take themselves seriously because they understand that our true nature is a most vulnerable and open spirit and NOT body; "it's just a ride". achetypically speaking, concerning the evolution of human consciousness, these guys play it as the magickal jesters, the fool, the trickster. not unlike hermes, oracles, thoth, prometheus, rafiki, enoch, the cheshire cat (wonder land). the "message of hope" line depicts this sacred archetype perfectly. check out that pronoun thing again and take this mentality to "harry manback". the way i see it, tool is simply trying to let us know that we are quite capable of remembering that "life is like a dream". by nudging our perspective to tune onto/into the awareness of such possibilities, tool reminds us all that (sorry):
(Get up and free yourself from yourself.)
Locked up inside you,
like the calm beneath castles,
is a cavern of treasures that
noone has been to.
Let's go digging.
Bring it out to take you back in.
therefore, they certainly do not take their separate identities all that seriously. do buddhists? natives? mayans? they think/play that we are all one ...that there's a sacred level of awareness of the human mind that is beyond ego (drunk on ego: which essentially exists as a fear-based CANCER on the mind, or censorship, cutting us all off from cognition of the eternal nature of a singular and unconditional movement of "love under will" - "and as the walls come down") ...therefore: shameless, nameless, nothing, no one, naked and fearless. THAT DEEP? i can't believe it took me so long to figure it out... very clever stuff.
"you all feel the same so why can't we just admit it?"
__________________ i know, shit!
Last edited by iAMtheMA!; 02-26-2008 at 09:42 PM..
yeah, i like it a lot. damn, we could probably start new threads based on nothing but the "trickster archetype and tool" or "the 'magick' within tool" or "the moon and tool" or "alchemy and tool", etc. or combine all of that with "THOTH and tool" ...this guy: http://www.crystalinks.com/thoth.html / http://www.crystalinks.com/emerald.html
speaking of the moon, would an "on/off" switch count as a 'trigger'? because the 1-2-3-on-5-6-7-off rhythmic effect within "reflection" seems to convey the lunar cycle. 1-2-3-full-5-6-7-new. i "wonder" what THAT could have to do with the third eye...
alright, please allow me to quickly elaborate this "moon - third eye" relationship, because it might be important, it might even swing perspectives slightly (i know it did for me, ESPECIALLY WITHIN ALL THAT TOOL IS)...
this is important. the ancients knew this would be important. ummm, that's why they built it so precise and large ...it's a big deal. huge.
the great pyramid of giza was constructed upon the very intimate relationship of the exact same 'square to circle' ratio found around the human body within da vinci's uber-famous "vitruvian man". <- that's a period. think about this. look over that image's square and circle. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../Vitruvian.jpg the overlap precisely depicts the ratio of 1:phi, or 1:1.6180339... http://www.soulsofdistortion.nl/images/picture%2029.gif now, according to plato (elements?), the 3-dimensional/solid forms of these elegant shapes represent an overlap or combination between the heavens (sphere) and earth (cube/hexahedron). the other elements are represented as water (icosahedron), air (octahedron), aether (dodecahedron - found in vicarious video, mystic eye? golden sperm?), and fire (tetrahedron) - concerning the pyramid's shape, keep in mind that "pyra-mid" = "middle flame" - somewhat resembles the tetrahedron.
http://www.vortexmaps.com/images/sphere.gif - it all comes from the sphere. all reflections of the ONE sphere. i repeat, ALL REFLECTIONS OF THE ONE. this is sacred geometry, folks. this is how they do it. "metaphor for a missing moment, pull ME in to your perfect circle - one womb, one shape, one resolve - liberate this will to release US ALL". and of course "it's source is bright and endless - a million light reflections pass over ME" ... and "mer de noms" (i.e. we are but ONE sea ...of names).
anyways, if you were to take that above "squaring the circle" image (an al-khem-ical term mind you - schism)... draw a horizontal line through the square, cutting it in half. now, bring those end points up towards the top of the heavens. that's the contruction of the great pyramid. magnificently - it's a direct reflection of the human form, yes, BUT!!! take a closer look. the difference between the overlapping shapes and the pyramid's construction (which creates that holy "spark flame FIRE" - "giggle and the flames grow higher, dance around a central fire") also determines the properties of the "all seeing eye" ...which, i mean long ago, is theorized to have had a "golden capstone". i would suppose the very real symbolism here might suggest that only the third eye is able to bring man's perceptions into the divine realms of heaven (sphere) - enlightenment, unity consciousness, truth, love. if you're aware of how the chakras may work, this information may come a little easier to you.
the ancients' PROOF that humans are:
THE REFLECTIONS OF HEAVEN ON EARTH
('as below, so above and beyond')
sour grapes
"There appeared before me a heavenly star, a holy virgin, the bringer of life and breath
And she spoke unto me, saying 'fear not the movement of the heavens above or the earth below
for change is what we are, my child. Righteous are those who look up and sway with the wind,
who look down and dance with the shifting of the soil, who swim with the movement of the tides,
who seek the truth around them and discover, we are and have always been in paradise.
The reflections of heaven on earth. Amen!'"
"Change, my child. Change is in the heavens. Change is on this earth.
Change is all around us, and we are reflections of the divine, we must roll with these changes, for we are these changes.
Eyes wide open, WE MUST LOOK UPON THE HEAVENS AS A MIRROR.
Wide awake, aware, deeply breathing"
concerning my first finger/trigger post, here's another for you all: "She ascended slowly from far beyond the horizon, her light like a heavenly finger pointing the way" (love ya)
the breathing while "wide eyed and hopefully wild" ...is important. "breathe in union"
"i'm just a soldier who's grooving to the GOLDEN rule of PUFF AND PASS"
and 44&2 is but a 'stepping stone' level of consciousness...
"clever got me this far, then tricky got me in ...I TAKE JUST WHAT I CAME FOR THEN I'M OUT THE DOOR AGAIN"
they don't take themselves seriously because they understand that our true nature is a most vulnerable and open spirit and NOT body
12 TOM CRUISE ISN'T LIKELY TO HAVE KEENAN OVER FOR DINNER
The man who penned the lyrics “Fuck L. Ron Hubbard and all his clones” recalls a 1993 gig at the Church of Scientology’s Celebrity’s Centre, where he spent most of the show baa-ing like a sheep at the audience. “Before our set this guy tries to intimidate me by showing me a gun in his jacket. I explained to him that if he pissed me off I’d start a riot.”
they don't take themselves seriously because they understand that our true nature is a most vulnerable and open spirit and NOT body; "it's just a ride". achetypically speaking, concerning the evolution of human consciousness, these guys play it as the magickal jesters, the fool, the trickster. not unlike hermes, oracles, thoth, prometheus, rafiki, enoch, the cheshire cat (wonder land). the "message of hope" line depicts this sacred archetype perfectly. check out that pronoun thing again and take this mentality to "harry manback". the way i see it, tool is simply trying to let us know that we are quite capable of remembering that "life is like a dream". by nudging our perspective to tune onto/into the awareness of such possibilities, tool reminds us all that (sorry):
(Get up and free yourself from yourself.)
Locked up inside you,
like the calm beneath castles,
is a cavern of treasures that
noone has been to.
Let's go digging.
Bring it out to take you back in.
therefore, they certainly do not take their separate identities all that seriously. do buddhists? natives? mayans? they think/play that we are all one ...that there's a sacred level of awareness of the human mind that is beyond ego (drunk on ego: which essentially exists as a fear-based CANCER on the mind, or censorship, cutting us all off from cognition of the eternal nature of a singular and unconditional movement of "love under will" - "and as the walls come down") ...therefore: shameless, nameless, nothing, no one, naked and fearless. THAT DEEP? i can't believe it took me so long to figure it out... very clever stuff.
"you all feel the same so why can't we just admit it?"
I might actually hear you out a little more if you didn't fucking repeat the goddamn lyrics every couple of words. It's fucking stupid. I would not be surprised if you have your entire bedroom walls covered in the writing of Tool's lyrics with a little fucking Maynard worshipping station in the middle
__________________ "WITHOUT A LITTLE EVIL, GOOD WOULD NEVER EXIST"
well, if i started throwing these sort of concepts out there 'willy-nilly', you (or someone else) would be all like "no, fucking. it's about heroin or fucking's mother or jesus or the fucking government (as many of us have been saying for fucking ever) ...where's the fucking proof, asshole?" so, you know ...i went for it. however, and as more of a suggestion ...if you don't like it, it might actually be more constructive (and considerate) to exercise whatever willpower is necessary to scroll down or skim along - as if to make the connection to whatever the context of my posts may suggest ...and then move on (perhaps to comment upon what has been expressed, make a sandwich, or continue roaming the internet). how fucking hard is that? there's certainly no need to throw unnecessary insults, judgments, and other such pathelogical walls towards me or anyone else.
well, if i started throwing these sort of concepts out there 'willy-nilly', you (or someone else) would be all like "no, fucking. it's about heroin or fucking's mother or jesus or the fucking government (as many of us have been saying for fucking ever) ...where's the fucking proof, asshole?" so, you know ...i went for it. however, and as more of a suggestion ...if you don't like it, it might actually be more constructive (and considerate) to exercise whatever willpower is necessary to scroll down or skim along - as if to make the connection to whatever the context of my posts may suggest ...and then move on (perhaps to comment upon what has been expressed, make a sandwich, or continue roaming the internet). how fucking hard is that? there's certainly no need to throw unnecessary insults, judgments, and other such pathelogical walls towards me or anyone else.
thanks for quoting my post.
Yeah, the "fucking" was a little redundant wasn't it? Much better post by the way.
__________________ "WITHOUT A LITTLE EVIL, GOOD WOULD NEVER EXIST"
You are doing well, iAMtheMA!. Thanks also for the link of the Trickster.
Aside from this or Mr. Maynard playing his part as the joker as a means and way to spread a truth, there is of course More still. The solid infallability and as well doubtless unverifiability are all these connections, there is just as well also Less to be done. There is a reason it is hidden, and there is a reason for those playing the part of the intellectual skeptic; due to the nature of the actual Truth it all points to.
The intellect is a kind of monster of illusion taking the body and mind of these things we call words - which likes to try and take shortcuts toward this Truth - it needs things explained with facts and more questions. By its nature it will never find it, simply because to medicate this beast requires the actual and literal process of unraveling, unwrapping, to measure the whole by its parts. This is the job of the joker, the trickster - to feed its questioning which acts as a kind of medication for this "great dis-ease". The fool is both wisdom and ignorance, it is both falsehood and truth. And so the only direction for this "ego" of intellect - the mudded eye of doing-and-not-being - to heal is by guaging where this Truth is, right in the Middle, by evaluating all extremes.
I would like to speak with you more about this, and especially I can aid your effectiveness in actually marketing these insights for yourself and others if even only to simply pre-chew such mindful insights for the intellectual ego's digestion of such matters of true subtlety and fake grandeurity. It is as ultimate as it is relative, as obvious as it is hidden, as real as it is imagined, as complex as it is simple - and you know as well that you are in the right direction.
I know because I have "found" exactly what you are looking for; and just like for many others, Tool has been a great... tool... in this very quest! =)
There indeed is a Puzzle. But one cannot understand or even perceive the puzzle let alone solve it, without taking each piece into considerations toward their unity of wholeness. And, it is as profoundly comforting as it is discomforting; to see this full understanding and wisdom, and especially to hear it and speak it for oneself - many many many will never get this chance - let alone to experience how profound and wise Tool really is, in this light!! Yet, it is *also* nothing special... =)
Here is a tip for now: The ever-hungry monster called "ego" cannot help but to answer any question it is asked, as it is by nature Defining and Confining. It gets highly defensive when there are no questions to be asked - like these lyrics for example - where it has no chance to "prove" itself by comparing with whatever it happens to believe. Also it strives for novelty, so repetitions are another of its weak points. Be humble, compassionate - after all one cannot teach without themselves also learning!
@Humasect -- nice work man, it seems like slowly people are starting to understand these things. Don't give up hope!
@Eulogy -- if you haven't figured it out yet maybe I could help -- I think you life is as fucked up as it is because of your outlook.
It's difficult to change an outlook but maybe start by trying to realize that other people in the world are (almost) as important as you. Maybe try to treat others with the respect you'd give yourself (or a piece of it.)
(And alcohol is only a temporary solution. We've all battled with it and I am sure there are some great support groups in your area?)
@Humasect -- nice work man, it seems like slowly people are starting to understand these things. Don't give up hope!
@Eulogy -- if you haven't figured it out yet maybe I could help -- I think you life is as fucked up as it is because of your outlook.
It's difficult to change an outlook but maybe start by trying to realize that other people in the world are (almost) as important as you. Maybe try to treat others with the respect you'd give yourself (or a piece of it.)
(And alcohol is only a temporary solution. We've all battled with it and I am sure there are some great support groups in your area?)
Whatever you say Sally. I'm a cynical optimist and a realist. My outlook is however I see fit, you talk about everyone else being entitled to their opinion and this is mine. If you don't like it you can go fuck yourself. I never once stated I was better than or more important than anybody on here, however I do possess an exquisite sense of common fucking sense unlike many.
And who the fuck ever said anything about alcohol?
__________________ "WITHOUT A LITTLE EVIL, GOOD WOULD NEVER EXIST"
Whatever you say Sally. I'm a cynical optimist and a realist. My outlook is however I see fit, you talk about everyone else being entitled to their opinion and this is mine. If you don't like it you can go fuck yourself. I never once stated I was better than or more important than anybody on here, however I do possess an exquisite sense of common fucking sense unlike many.
And who the fuck ever said anything about alcohol?
For someone who thinks everyone is entitled to an opinion, your sure quick to shoot someone's opinion down every chance you get.
For someone who thinks everyone is entitled to an opinion, your sure quick to shoot someone's opinion down every chance you get.
Go see Gogol Bordello, holy shit dudes.
Just because everyone is entitled to an opinion doesn't mean that everyone has a good one. Am I a hypocrite full of smite? At times yes, and fully aware of it. Do I care? No, I am strongly opinionated and self sufficient. I simply have a mark perpensity for the intellectually impaired....and yes, I'm also fully aware that it's subjective as well.
Adios
__________________ "WITHOUT A LITTLE EVIL, GOOD WOULD NEVER EXIST"
I knew you had a naturally intense inclination as being intellectually impaired, but don't go around trying to act as though you don't.....
LOL, apparently you have no idea what I said in that post, either you're dyslexic or you are truly ignorant. If necessary, I will reiterate this in layman's terms for you.
__________________ "WITHOUT A LITTLE EVIL, GOOD WOULD NEVER EXIST"
Woah, moon, third eye.. sheeth, that's gone really deep :)
I've asked my dad once, what do You think it means: "Rest your trigger on my finger". And he said: "Let me take control over you". And I must say I agree and it's enough for me.
Like it?
__________________ "music has infinite potential of positivity for mankind"Lord Worm www.last.fm/user/michalkob
Sorry then. I've been searching for anybody's explanation od noises/moans at around 4:50, and found this. And usually when I read and consider replying to the topics displayed, the time deadline :) is set at 1 month. But now I've set "the beginning" and found something interesting enough that I've forgot it might be a little old.
I like your view. Seems to fit really well. And the topic is really interesting..
Personally sometimes I feel too shy to dig into Aenima lyrics. They are related to some really serious things, many "from the dark side" but, like it or not, that's how the life looks like. That makes me take Lateralus much mor often. It is in the CD tray most of the time, with its "Let go", "Be patient", "Rediscover Communication", "Alive-I", "Spiral Out", "Crucify the Ego" stuff.
Pushit has a lot of potential in healing after suffering from a "fundamental differing", failed relationship. Checked personally and approved. As you watch the pieces tumble down your heart aches as you feel guilty, so our dark nature would like the other person to take responsibility for the failure. But "No fault, None to blame"...
Will ask my friend, a psychologist, about the disorder you mentioned.
Sorry for mentioning Schism all the way round. I'm a Schismoid man right now, finally managed to write its drum pattern in notes, then memorized it and I'm practicing right now.
All this stuff meant tens, maybe over hundred times I listened to Schism. But I think I've nailed it, my drum teacher says thats right, and Schism is my fav song since. Words can't describe the delight one feels while this kind of rhythm flows trough the body.
__________________ "music has infinite potential of positivity for mankind"Lord Worm www.last.fm/user/michalkob
iamthema gets tool. probably more than most at least. im sick of people saying that tool is 'just fucking with us.' yes, they do have a sense of humor and joke around but they are not leading us on and putting shit in their music for no reason. even the segues(fillers) that you skip over on your ipod have a meaning/purpose for being there. understand that they are artists. the puzzle in the 10000 days artwork has a meaning and purpose for being there. hell if i know exactly what it means.
your disbelief and discredit of tool's message is exactly what tool is trying to stop. step aside and open your mind to something that it is totally outside your comfort zone and give it a chance. 10000 days' message had to do with having faith even when all seems to be going downhill and bad.
Iamthema makes some far out claims but he does back them up. my only criticism would be to structure them so we can better understand what youre trying to say
no, i think i understand a lot of tool's deep meanings and messages but i still dont fully understand the puzzle in 10,000 days artwork. I have a partial comprehension but not a complete understanding of it.
no, 10000 days is not about religion. I think its about having faith and believing in something. maynard used to be cynical about his mother having blind faith in god, something he was unable to see. but he has come to appreciate her faith because she believed in him even though most did not. at least thats what i decipher from wings part 1 and 2; that she believed in what none could see. that being god, but also in maynard. These are different kinds of believing, but none the less, faith.
But to me 10000 days is more than just faith, it is about action and will. its saying, get off your ass, turn off the tv, do something to better the world/yourself
Also, there is a big theme of the hero/fallen hero. Judith is an angel who has saved maynard's life and who lead by example. the FOOL in rosetta stoned is a fallen hero/loser who had the KEYS to being the savior of mankind but was too fucked up on drugs. And i am starting to think that the narrator in Right in Two is supposed to be jesus or and alien or an angel. one in the same. someone removed from humanity, disassociated. One who has cut himself off from the rest of humanity. He must cut it all right in two. dividing himself form those who perpetually destroy themselves and eachother. The idea of the hero is explained further in Joseph Campbell's writings. He discusses the idea of the 'hero with a thousand faces'...take a look at the alex grey's album cover with the interconnected beings.
no, i think i understand a lot of tool's deep meanings and messages but i still dont fully understand the puzzle in 10,000 days artwork. I have a partial comprehension but not a complete understanding of it.
no, 10000 days is not about religion. I think its about having faith and believing in something. maynard used to be cynical about his mother having blind faith in god, something he was unable to see. but he has come to appreciate her faith because she believed in him even though most did not. at least thats what i decipher from wings part 1 and 2; that she believed in what none could see. that being god, but also in maynard. These are different kinds of believing, but none the less, faith.
But to me 10000 days is more than just faith, it is about action and will. its saying, get off your ass, turn off the tv, do something to better the world/yourself
Also, there is a big theme of the hero/fallen hero. Judith is an angel who has saved maynard's life and who lead by example. the FOOL in rosetta stoned is a fallen hero/loser who had the KEYS to being the savior of mankind but was too fucked up on drugs. And i am starting to think that the narrator in Right in Two is supposed to be jesus or and alien or an angel. one in the same. someone removed from humanity, disassociated. One who has cut himself off from the rest of humanity. He must cut it all right in two. dividing himself form those who perpetually destroy themselves and eachother. The idea of the hero is explained further in Joseph Campbell's writings. He discusses the idea of the 'hero with a thousand faces'...take a look at the alex grey's album cover with the interconnected beings.
A lot of this makes sense, however, I disagree at the point where you said that the god/alien/angel was the one cutting things right in two (disassociating himself from us mortals). The ones referenced as "cutting it all right in two" are us. What he's saying is that this earth is our eden yet, we fail to recognize and take everything for granted and due to greed, we always find ourselves ultimately fighting for wanting more instead of sharing, hence we're always cutting things and dividing them amongst ourselves instead of working in harmony and sharing. This is what leads to the ones with greed fighting to get a piece of what the other has. We took all the things we had and had to split them up, this is yours, this is mine...now I want some more of what you have because mine isn't enough anymore.
__________________ "WITHOUT A LITTLE EVIL, GOOD WOULD NEVER EXIST"
Recently I've noticed some interesting thing, which can even form sort of a link between Lateralus and 10000 Days. It is the cycle: Divide-reunite, destroy and rebuild, rediscover..
You know:
The Grudge - the cycle of Saturn, the precious chance happening once for 29 years.
Parabol(a) - THIS body... this particular one.. reincarnation? Not necessarily literally, but.. Plus the video, when these guys create a full circle on the table
Schism - watch the temple topple over, bring the pieces back together, rediscover...
Disposition - watch the weather change
---
Jambi - Shine until two become one, breathe in union
Right In Two - obvious - destroys the previous.
---
Back to Undertow album.. I've come round full circle
I'm totally helpless when it comes to Eastern beliefs, such as Merkaba.. Maybe I'm searching in the wrong place, but can you point me what is this circle of change and alternation?
I'm disappointed that I've noticed it so late, but how is this music so full of dynamism, so many Tool songs are written to describe one particular moment on our path.. This surprises me, you know, for me it is a deeper meaning.. Not created by syncing 13 songs played backwards, numbers of forty-six, viginti tres etc, but naturally trough blending of the songs meaning.
Sorry for lame English again.
__________________ "music has infinite potential of positivity for mankind"Lord Worm www.last.fm/user/michalkob
Okay, I think I have this song mostly figured out. But, one thing...
"Rest your trigger on my finger"?
What the fuck does this mean? My initial belief is that the line implies that the object will, at some point, take issue with the narrator and attribute all blame to him, when it is really the object's fault.
Am I anywhere near correct on this front?
there are two persons. one is the gun. pushit is from the perspective who is the gun. the other's perspective is given in a different song which goes:
Quote:
...
I need a fix 'cause I'm going down //Who am I to judge and strike you down?
Down to the bits that I left uptown
I need a fix cause I'm going down
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Happiness (is a warm gun)
Bang Bang Shoot Shoot
Happiness (is a warm gun, momma)
Bang Bang Shoot Shoot
(When I hold you in my arms)
Oooooooooh, oh yeah!
And when I feel my finger on your trigger //Rest your trigger on my finger,
Oooooooooh, oh yeah!
Not sure that song is related, and I don't see how this song has a person as a gun, as you describe. I know you don't mean literally, but even figuratively, you can have a trigger on your gun without being a gun...
yea "being" was a bad choice of words. It was just funny coincidence that i was listening to the beatles while reading this thread.
