Go Back  The Tool Page: Opinion » Tool » Albums » 10,000 Days » 04. 10,000 Days (Wings pt. 2)
User Name
Password
View Poll Results: How would this affect your opinion of things?
It would raise my respect for Maynard, but wouldn't change my religious and spiritual values. 51 19.62%
It would lower my respect for Maynard, but wouldn't change my religious or spiritual values. 34 13.08%
It would raise my respect for Maynard, and it would change my religious and spiritual values. 2 0.77%
It would lower my respect for Maynard, and it would change my religious and spiritual values. 1 0.38%
It wouldn't affect my opinions at all. 172 66.15%
Voters: 260. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
Systolic
05-08-2006, 06:50 AM
Reply With Quote

How would this impact you?
__________________
Do you know what Nemesis means?
Old 05-08-2006, 06:50 AM   #1
Level 9 - Obstreperous
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: In racist-ville
Posts: 1,369
Bincount™: 862
If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

How would this impact you?
__________________
Do you know what Nemesis means?
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Oberon's Avatar Oberon
05-08-2006, 06:51 AM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by Systolic
How would this impact you?

Very little? It would make the lyrics much dumber, and i would enjoy this song even less than i already do.
__________________
RIP SEJEFF. APRIL 2006 - APRIL 2006

ANOTHER DEAD HERO.
Old 05-08-2006, 06:51 AM   #2
Level 9 - Obstreperous
 
Oberon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Boston
Posts: 1,128
Bincount™: 155
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Systolic
How would this impact you?

Very little? It would make the lyrics much dumber, and i would enjoy this song even less than i already do.
__________________
RIP SEJEFF. APRIL 2006 - APRIL 2006

ANOTHER DEAD HERO.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Lost
05-08-2006, 08:02 AM
Reply With Quote

I think it would only affect me in a way that if all this time, someone who was dead set convinced against it, someone who I considered to be rather intellectual and learned, suddenly changed their mind.... It would only make me doubt myself and where I stand. Religion is a bum. It's far too interesting to ignore... But when you get into it... Well when I get into it, it just blows my mind.
Old 05-08-2006, 08:02 AM   #3
Level 3 - Talker
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Mewn
Posts: 12
Bincount™: 1
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

I think it would only affect me in a way that if all this time, someone who was dead set convinced against it, someone who I considered to be rather intellectual and learned, suddenly changed their mind.... It would only make me doubt myself and where I stand. Religion is a bum. It's far too interesting to ignore... But when you get into it... Well when I get into it, it just blows my mind.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
ComradeNash
05-08-2006, 08:28 AM
Reply With Quote

Being Christian doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to this song. Some things exist no matter what you want to call them, no matter how you want to see them.

TOOL has never set itself against Christianity, just against the folks who dedicate themselves mindlessly to a dogmatic system that they don't understand. If you consciously decide to be celebate, for example, I believe that's admirable. If you're doing it because your book says so, that's another story.

Either way, I don't know how much of a joke April Fool's day was last year. There's a big difference between mindlessly worshipping an idol and aligning yourself with the proper spiritual currents to access the christ consciousness in the etheric.

In short, get a grip, and to quote Sir Dylan-

"Don't criticize what you can't understand"
__________________
customize your life with fonts

amazing multicolor facets of whatever

computer smells your souls, children

fucking use it, don't live it.
Old 05-08-2006, 08:28 AM   #4
Level 1 - Lurker
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Marquette, Michigan
Posts: 4
Bincount™: 1
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Being Christian doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to this song. Some things exist no matter what you want to call them, no matter how you want to see them.

TOOL has never set itself against Christianity, just against the folks who dedicate themselves mindlessly to a dogmatic system that they don't understand. If you consciously decide to be celebate, for example, I believe that's admirable. If you're doing it because your book says so, that's another story.

Either way, I don't know how much of a joke April Fool's day was last year. There's a big difference between mindlessly worshipping an idol and aligning yourself with the proper spiritual currents to access the christ consciousness in the etheric.

In short, get a grip, and to quote Sir Dylan-

"Don't criticize what you can't understand"
__________________
customize your life with fonts

amazing multicolor facets of whatever

computer smells your souls, children

fucking use it, don't live it.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
kaspguy
05-08-2006, 09:51 AM
Reply With Quote

I respect him even more already because of this song, because it shows a much more mature point of view since Judith
Old 05-08-2006, 09:51 AM   #5
Level 4 - Thinker
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 20
Bincount™: 0
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

I respect him even more already because of this song, because it shows a much more mature point of view since Judith
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
T-13h's Avatar T-13h
05-08-2006, 09:56 AM
Reply With Quote

If Maynard became a Christian it would lower my opinion of him.
__________________
The word of the Law is θέλημα
Old 05-08-2006, 09:56 AM   #6
Level 12 - Scurrilous
 
T-13h's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 4,539
Bincount™: 911
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

If Maynard became a Christian it would lower my opinion of him.
__________________
The word of the Law is θέλημα
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
T-13h's Avatar T-13h
05-08-2006, 10:21 AM
Reply With Quote

Exactly, man.
__________________
The word of the Law is θέλημα
Old 05-08-2006, 10:21 AM   #7
Level 12 - Scurrilous
 
T-13h's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 4,539
Bincount™: 911
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Exactly, man.
__________________
The word of the Law is θέλημα
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
kether4602's Avatar kether4602
05-08-2006, 10:41 AM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComradeNash
Being Christian doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to this song. Some things exist no matter what you want to call them, no matter how you want to see them.

TOOL has never set itself against Christianity, just against the folks who dedicate themselves mindlessly to a dogmatic system that they don't understand. If you consciously decide to be celebate, for example, I believe that's admirable. If you're doing it because your book says so, that's another story.

Either way, I don't know how much of a joke April Fool's day was last year. There's a big difference between mindlessly worshipping an idol and aligning yourself with the proper spiritual currents to access the christ consciousness in the etheric.

In short, get a grip, and to quote Sir Dylan-

"Don't criticize what you can't understand"
Good post. I agree.
Old 05-08-2006, 10:41 AM   #8
Level 6 - Very Deep Thinker
 
kether4602's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: California
Posts: 148
Bincount™: 12
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComradeNash
Being Christian doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to this song. Some things exist no matter what you want to call them, no matter how you want to see them.

TOOL has never set itself against Christianity, just against the folks who dedicate themselves mindlessly to a dogmatic system that they don't understand. If you consciously decide to be celebate, for example, I believe that's admirable. If you're doing it because your book says so, that's another story.

Either way, I don't know how much of a joke April Fool's day was last year. There's a big difference between mindlessly worshipping an idol and aligning yourself with the proper spiritual currents to access the christ consciousness in the etheric.

In short, get a grip, and to quote Sir Dylan-

"Don't criticize what you can't understand"
Good post. I agree.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Systolic
05-08-2006, 12:23 PM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComradeNash
Being Christian doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to this song. Some things exist no matter what you want to call them, no matter how you want to see them.

TOOL has never set itself against Christianity, just against the folks who dedicate themselves mindlessly to a dogmatic system that they don't understand. If you consciously decide to be celebate, for example, I believe that's admirable. If you're doing it because your book says so, that's another story.

Either way, I don't know how much of a joke April Fool's day was last year. There's a big difference between mindlessly worshipping an idol and aligning yourself with the proper spiritual currents to access the christ consciousness in the etheric.

In short, get a grip, and to quote Sir Dylan-

"Don't criticize what you can't understand"

Whoa whoa whoa... who's being critical here?

I was just seeing people's opinions. Jesus Christ.. chill!
__________________
Do you know what Nemesis means?
Old 05-08-2006, 12:23 PM   #9
Level 9 - Obstreperous
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: In racist-ville
Posts: 1,369
Bincount™: 862
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComradeNash
Being Christian doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to this song. Some things exist no matter what you want to call them, no matter how you want to see them.

TOOL has never set itself against Christianity, just against the folks who dedicate themselves mindlessly to a dogmatic system that they don't understand. If you consciously decide to be celebate, for example, I believe that's admirable. If you're doing it because your book says so, that's another story.

Either way, I don't know how much of a joke April Fool's day was last year. There's a big difference between mindlessly worshipping an idol and aligning yourself with the proper spiritual currents to access the christ consciousness in the etheric.

In short, get a grip, and to quote Sir Dylan-

"Don't criticize what you can't understand"

Whoa whoa whoa... who's being critical here?

I was just seeing people's opinions. Jesus Christ.. chill!
__________________
Do you know what Nemesis means?
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
ComradeNash
05-08-2006, 01:31 PM
Reply With Quote

Wasn't intended to be critical, especially not toward you. You merely posed a question, and as we see all too often, people get heated about absolutely nothing.
__________________
customize your life with fonts

amazing multicolor facets of whatever

computer smells your souls, children

fucking use it, don't live it.
Old 05-08-2006, 01:31 PM   #10
Level 1 - Lurker
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Marquette, Michigan
Posts: 4
Bincount™: 1
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Wasn't intended to be critical, especially not toward you. You merely posed a question, and as we see all too often, people get heated about absolutely nothing.
__________________
customize your life with fonts

amazing multicolor facets of whatever

computer smells your souls, children

fucking use it, don't live it.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Systolic
05-08-2006, 02:05 PM
Reply With Quote

Okay. Sorry.

I hate how undecipherable internet conversations can be. I thought that was directed at me.
__________________
Do you know what Nemesis means?
Old 05-08-2006, 02:05 PM   #11
Level 9 - Obstreperous
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: In racist-ville
Posts: 1,369
Bincount™: 862
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Okay. Sorry.

I hate how undecipherable internet conversations can be. I thought that was directed at me.
__________________
Do you know what Nemesis means?
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Goodwin
05-08-2006, 03:41 PM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by T-13h
If Maynard became a Christian it would lower my opinion of him.
I'm curious. Why is that?
Old 05-08-2006, 03:41 PM   #12
Level 6 - Very Deep Thinker
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 120
Bincount™: 2
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by T-13h
If Maynard became a Christian it would lower my opinion of him.
I'm curious. Why is that?
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
tyroneslothrop's Avatar tyroneslothrop
05-08-2006, 03:50 PM
Reply With Quote

I don't think the song would make a whole lot of sense if it was a declaration of faith on Maynard's part. An important part of the song seems to be the difference between the beliefs of Maynard and his Mother and the love and respect that he holds for her despite (or maybe even because of) such differences.

Not that it really matters. There are ignorant asshole Christians and there are intelligent, spiritually intuitive Christians. Similarly, there are ignorant asshole atheists and there are intelligent, open-minded atheists. Based on his lyrics, I imagine that if Maynard wanted to be categorized as a Christian or an atheist he would be the intelligent kind either way.
__________________
"The greatest hazard of all, losing the self, can occur very quietly in the world, as if it were nothing at all. No other loss can occur so quietly; any other loss- an arm, a leg, five dollars, a wife, etc.- is sure to be noticed"-Kierkegaard
Old 05-08-2006, 03:50 PM   #13
Level 6 - Very Deep Thinker
 
tyroneslothrop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: berkeley, ca
Posts: 109
Bincount™: 10
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

I don't think the song would make a whole lot of sense if it was a declaration of faith on Maynard's part. An important part of the song seems to be the difference between the beliefs of Maynard and his Mother and the love and respect that he holds for her despite (or maybe even because of) such differences.

Not that it really matters. There are ignorant asshole Christians and there are intelligent, spiritually intuitive Christians. Similarly, there are ignorant asshole atheists and there are intelligent, open-minded atheists. Based on his lyrics, I imagine that if Maynard wanted to be categorized as a Christian or an atheist he would be the intelligent kind either way.
__________________
"The greatest hazard of all, losing the self, can occur very quietly in the world, as if it were nothing at all. No other loss can occur so quietly; any other loss- an arm, a leg, five dollars, a wife, etc.- is sure to be noticed"-Kierkegaard
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Jayar's Avatar Jayar
05-08-2006, 04:25 PM
Reply With Quote

To each his own, whatever floats your boat, whatever dries your molasses.
Old 05-08-2006, 04:25 PM   #14
Suicide Booth ID: 15
 
Jayar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,011
Bincount™: 2221
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

To each his own, whatever floats your boat, whatever dries your molasses.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
eslupminoyler's Avatar eslupminoyler
05-10-2006, 02:59 AM
Reply With Quote

Well he did say, "Blind me with your light and your lies."
Kinda like saul at the road when he was blinded and heard the voice asking him why he was persecuting My (Jesus') people.



Now he says, "Dim my eyes if they should compromise our fulcrum"
Gigantic change.

Personally I'd be awesome. Maynard would never be a prototypical Christian. There is a difference between being a Christian and praying to Jesus.
Old 05-10-2006, 02:59 AM   #15
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
eslupminoyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: I live in Heaven, but I'm on a vacation without my passport to get back.
Posts: 333
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Well he did say, "Blind me with your light and your lies."
Kinda like saul at the road when he was blinded and heard the voice asking him why he was persecuting My (Jesus') people.



Now he says, "Dim my eyes if they should compromise our fulcrum"
Gigantic change.

Personally I'd be awesome. Maynard would never be a prototypical Christian. There is a difference between being a Christian and praying to Jesus.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
bitter_enigma's Avatar bitter_enigma
05-10-2006, 03:35 AM
Reply With Quote

Wouldn't change my opinon at all...

I'm not even sure if I have an actual opinion on Maynard. I mean Maynard, the man, is not an 'issue' or an event. He is a person, who most of us don't know personally.

To say he must be a Christian because of these lyrics...
Firstly that's a very shallow and naive perspective on the lyrics.
And secondly, where do you start with Undertow? What sort of person is he based on those lyrics??

And besides, so what? If you're going to change your opinion of someone just like that based on the fact whether they're Christian or not then what kind of person does that make you?

This is a silly topic. It's just as well at this point that more than half the votes show that most people have some sense and can think for themselves.

:/
__________________
"Damn my wine! Damn my wine!
Damn my wine if it should compromise a tour.
If vines and weeds divide me then I might as well be gonnnne!"
Old 05-10-2006, 03:35 AM   #16
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
bitter_enigma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Melbourne, AU
Posts: 339
Bincount™: 23
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Wouldn't change my opinon at all...

I'm not even sure if I have an actual opinion on Maynard. I mean Maynard, the man, is not an 'issue' or an event. He is a person, who most of us don't know personally.

To say he must be a Christian because of these lyrics...
Firstly that's a very shallow and naive perspective on the lyrics.
And secondly, where do you start with Undertow? What sort of person is he based on those lyrics??

And besides, so what? If you're going to change your opinion of someone just like that based on the fact whether they're Christian or not then what kind of person does that make you?

This is a silly topic. It's just as well at this point that more than half the votes show that most people have some sense and can think for themselves.

:/
__________________
"Damn my wine! Damn my wine!
Damn my wine if it should compromise a tour.
If vines and weeds divide me then I might as well be gonnnne!"
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
TheEulogyOfMe's Avatar TheEulogyOfMe
05-11-2006, 03:49 AM
Reply With Quote

I can almost guarantee Maynard believes in God, but not Christianity. If Bill Hicks is/was is hero, it seems quite fitting. And before some of you say "That's bull shit, how can he believe in God but not Christianity!? LOL." This is a very popular approach. Christinaity= A cult. Which refrains people from embracing Christianity, but the idea of a divine entity that created us all is swallowable (Somehow) to some people. They like it with out all the red tape and drama and bull shit.
__________________
Having not been informed to the highest degree of accuracy I find difficulty in articulating for fear of deviating from the true path of rectitude.
Old 05-11-2006, 03:49 AM   #17
Level 6 - Very Deep Thinker
 
TheEulogyOfMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 171
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

I can almost guarantee Maynard believes in God, but not Christianity. If Bill Hicks is/was is hero, it seems quite fitting. And before some of you say "That's bull shit, how can he believe in God but not Christianity!? LOL." This is a very popular approach. Christinaity= A cult. Which refrains people from embracing Christianity, but the idea of a divine entity that created us all is swallowable (Somehow) to some people. They like it with out all the red tape and drama and bull shit.
__________________
Having not been informed to the highest degree of accuracy I find difficulty in articulating for fear of deviating from the true path of rectitude.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
UtUmNo1's Avatar UtUmNo1
05-11-2006, 04:04 AM
Reply With Quote

I would care as much as I would if Bono changed his sunglasses.
__________________
If this grand panorama before me is what you call God....


....then God is not dead.
Old 05-11-2006, 04:04 AM   #18
Level 12 - Scurrilous
 
UtUmNo1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Monaco
Posts: 5,144
Bincount™: 4207
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

I would care as much as I would if Bono changed his sunglasses.
__________________
If this grand panorama before me is what you call God....


....then God is not dead.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
NextChapter's Avatar NextChapter
05-11-2006, 07:32 AM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComradeNash
Being Christian doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to this song. Some things exist no matter what you want to call them, no matter how you want to see them.

TOOL has never set itself against Christianity, just against the folks who dedicate themselves mindlessly to a dogmatic system that they don't understand. If you consciously decide to be celebate, for example, I believe that's admirable. If you're doing it because your book says so, that's another story.

Either way, I don't know how much of a joke April Fool's day was last year. There's a big difference between mindlessly worshipping an idol and aligning yourself with the proper spiritual currents to access the christ consciousness in the etheric.

In short, get a grip, and to quote Sir Dylan-

"Don't criticize what you can't understand"
. . .which makes this entire poll well, . . .pointless
__________________
It is this action being reborn by assets rightly earned which propels the thought to realize that all the gifts given, then taken, hath no need of rescue. They remain merely to be made by the hero who with new knowledge can forever remake anew.
Old 05-11-2006, 07:32 AM   #19
Level 3 - Talker
 
NextChapter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: TBA
Posts: 17
Bincount™: 1
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComradeNash
Being Christian doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to this song. Some things exist no matter what you want to call them, no matter how you want to see them.

TOOL has never set itself against Christianity, just against the folks who dedicate themselves mindlessly to a dogmatic system that they don't understand. If you consciously decide to be celebate, for example, I believe that's admirable. If you're doing it because your book says so, that's another story.

Either way, I don't know how much of a joke April Fool's day was last year. There's a big difference between mindlessly worshipping an idol and aligning yourself with the proper spiritual currents to access the christ consciousness in the etheric.

In short, get a grip, and to quote Sir Dylan-

"Don't criticize what you can't understand"
. . .which makes this entire poll well, . . .pointless
__________________
It is this action being reborn by assets rightly earned which propels the thought to realize that all the gifts given, then taken, hath no need of rescue. They remain merely to be made by the hero who with new knowledge can forever remake anew.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
NextChapter's Avatar NextChapter
05-11-2006, 07:37 AM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by Derge
Fuck do you think he cares for our OPINION? Ahem, hooker... And besides, for those so worried, I once thought he was ANTI-christian, but then, doesn't bother me. With Parabola my older bro was like what happend to TOOL. Life evolves, changes, reveals experiences beyond our comprehension. I despise religion, but good music, fuck what the singer believes. Not all lyrics would be based on the singer. He can draw influences, but if he changed his mind, I have more to my life than concern I was misled. We are all the time, REALITY misleads (quantum physics) so we should EXPECT that.
true to the last word

and sorry T-13h but i dont think this comment means he was agreeing with you on any level at all, in fact, it sounds like the oposite of what you were saying, your comment was based on your own personal feelings while his pretty much leys out the truth for what it is
__________________
It is this action being reborn by assets rightly earned which propels the thought to realize that all the gifts given, then taken, hath no need of rescue. They remain merely to be made by the hero who with new knowledge can forever remake anew.
Old 05-11-2006, 07:37 AM   #20
Level 3 - Talker
 
NextChapter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: TBA
Posts: 17
Bincount™: 1
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Derge
Fuck do you think he cares for our OPINION? Ahem, hooker... And besides, for those so worried, I once thought he was ANTI-christian, but then, doesn't bother me. With Parabola my older bro was like what happend to TOOL. Life evolves, changes, reveals experiences beyond our comprehension. I despise religion, but good music, fuck what the singer believes. Not all lyrics would be based on the singer. He can draw influences, but if he changed his mind, I have more to my life than concern I was misled. We are all the time, REALITY misleads (quantum physics) so we should EXPECT that.
true to the last word

and sorry T-13h but i dont think this comment means he was agreeing with you on any level at all, in fact, it sounds like the oposite of what you were saying, your comment was based on your own personal feelings while his pretty much leys out the truth for what it is
__________________
It is this action being reborn by assets rightly earned which propels the thought to realize that all the gifts given, then taken, hath no need of rescue. They remain merely to be made by the hero who with new knowledge can forever remake anew.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
T-13h's Avatar T-13h
05-11-2006, 08:06 AM
Reply With Quote

"If one were to take the bible seriously one would go mad. But to take the bible seriously, one must be already mad.”

Aleister Crowley


Like I was saying, if Maynard became a Christian it would lower my opinion of him. He might as well start buying real estate on Jupiter.
__________________
The word of the Law is θέλημα
Old 05-11-2006, 08:06 AM   #21
Level 12 - Scurrilous
 
T-13h's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 4,539
Bincount™: 911
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

"If one were to take the bible seriously one would go mad. But to take the bible seriously, one must be already mad.”

Aleister Crowley


Like I was saying, if Maynard became a Christian it would lower my opinion of him. He might as well start buying real estate on Jupiter.
__________________
The word of the Law is θέλημα
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
hbynoe's Avatar hbynoe
05-11-2006, 08:33 AM
Reply With Quote

whatever he does or what ever he expressing here..doesn't seem to me like
he is becoming a christian, he is merely accepting his mothers fate through
her death, a hope and a light for her because he eventually accepted that
she needed to believe in what she did. that being said. it doesn't change
the way i feel about his songwriting, profittering he is still a wonderful
extremely emotional artist. who wears more than his heart and soul on
his sleeve
__________________
http://www.hbynoe.com my art
Old 05-11-2006, 08:33 AM   #22
Level 9 - Obstreperous
 
hbynoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Bequia
Posts: 1,671
Bincount™: 801
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

whatever he does or what ever he expressing here..doesn't seem to me like
he is becoming a christian, he is merely accepting his mothers fate through
her death, a hope and a light for her because he eventually accepted that
she needed to believe in what she did. that being said. it doesn't change
the way i feel about his songwriting, profittering he is still a wonderful
extremely emotional artist. who wears more than his heart and soul on
his sleeve
__________________
http://www.hbynoe.com my art
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
eslupminoyler's Avatar eslupminoyler
05-11-2006, 08:38 AM
Reply With Quote

Aleister Crowley, Well I've yet to read anything by him, but to take the bible literally, is to believe, and that is it.
"If you have faith, that size of a grain of mustard seed and tell a mountain to fall, it will."
That is insane, and yet human beings endeavor to levitate, move objects with their minds (telekinisis), and be clairvoyant. So what is the difference? And how are these attempts not mad or insane?
We could have just remained as single celled organisms or monkeys.

Aleister Crowley, is just a man, and a hypocrite. It is a hypocrisy to label anything in regard to "if you believe this you are mad," because doubting the possibility of anything is mad, especially communication with ethereal and transcended light forms, such as Jesus and the Heavenly Host.
Old 05-11-2006, 08:38 AM   #23
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
eslupminoyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: I live in Heaven, but I'm on a vacation without my passport to get back.
Posts: 333
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Aleister Crowley, Well I've yet to read anything by him, but to take the bible literally, is to believe, and that is it.
"If you have faith, that size of a grain of mustard seed and tell a mountain to fall, it will."
That is insane, and yet human beings endeavor to levitate, move objects with their minds (telekinisis), and be clairvoyant. So what is the difference? And how are these attempts not mad or insane?
We could have just remained as single celled organisms or monkeys.

Aleister Crowley, is just a man, and a hypocrite. It is a hypocrisy to label anything in regard to "if you believe this you are mad," because doubting the possibility of anything is mad, especially communication with ethereal and transcended light forms, such as Jesus and the Heavenly Host.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
eslupminoyler's Avatar eslupminoyler
05-11-2006, 08:44 AM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by eslupminoyler
Aleister Crowley, Well I've yet to read anything by him, but to take the bible literally, is to believe, and that is it.
"If you have faith, that size of a grain of mustard seed and tell a mountain to fall, it will."
That is insane, and yet human beings endeavor to levitate, move objects with their minds (telekinisis), and be clairvoyant. So what is the difference? And how are these attempts not mad or insane?
We could have just remained as single celled organisms or monkeys.

Aleister Crowley, is just a man, and a hypocrite. It is a hypocrisy to label anything in regard to "if you believe this you are mad," because doubting the possibility of anything is mad, especially communication with ethereal and transcended light forms, such as Jesus and the Heavenly Host.
I don't believe the bible word for word, or even verse by verse, but to understand that a failure to belief while still acknowledging the possibility of what you fail to believe, is in a way believing that what you originally doubted was true.
"God has not given me a spirit of fear, but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind."
This verse I find as TRUTH, but not the whole verse, and yet even the diminuitive parts I find to be untrue could in fact be true and beyond my perception
Old 05-11-2006, 08:44 AM   #24
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
eslupminoyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: I live in Heaven, but I'm on a vacation without my passport to get back.
Posts: 333
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by eslupminoyler
Aleister Crowley, Well I've yet to read anything by him, but to take the bible literally, is to believe, and that is it.
"If you have faith, that size of a grain of mustard seed and tell a mountain to fall, it will."
That is insane, and yet human beings endeavor to levitate, move objects with their minds (telekinisis), and be clairvoyant. So what is the difference? And how are these attempts not mad or insane?
We could have just remained as single celled organisms or monkeys.

Aleister Crowley, is just a man, and a hypocrite. It is a hypocrisy to label anything in regard to "if you believe this you are mad," because doubting the possibility of anything is mad, especially communication with ethereal and transcended light forms, such as Jesus and the Heavenly Host.
I don't believe the bible word for word, or even verse by verse, but to understand that a failure to belief while still acknowledging the possibility of what you fail to believe, is in a way believing that what you originally doubted was true.
"God has not given me a spirit of fear, but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind."
This verse I find as TRUTH, but not the whole verse, and yet even the diminuitive parts I find to be untrue could in fact be true and beyond my perception
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
eslupminoyler's Avatar eslupminoyler
05-11-2006, 08:52 AM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by eslupminoyler
I don't believe the bible word for word, or even verse by verse, but to understand that a failure to belief while still acknowledging the possibility of what you fail to believe, is in a way believing that what you originally doubted was true.
"God has not given me a spirit of fear, but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind."
This verse I find as TRUTH, but not the whole verse, and yet even the diminuitive parts I find to be untrue could in fact be true and beyond my perception
My reasons, your perception, perhaps will see as psychotic.

I'd respect Maynard more for a few reasons:

1. My roots were with prayer to Jesus, and I went against him (with the darkness) for a while. I cursed God, and then conceded and absolved.

2. I could sense demons in his words (whether that be through cognitive regressions, or actual demons). It was a valiant struggle.

3. Many of his fans will benefit, because if Maynard truly has repented, and returned to The Holy Army, we've gained a powerful ally.
Old 05-11-2006, 08:52 AM   #25
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
eslupminoyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: I live in Heaven, but I'm on a vacation without my passport to get back.
Posts: 333
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by eslupminoyler
I don't believe the bible word for word, or even verse by verse, but to understand that a failure to belief while still acknowledging the possibility of what you fail to believe, is in a way believing that what you originally doubted was true.
"God has not given me a spirit of fear, but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind."
This verse I find as TRUTH, but not the whole verse, and yet even the diminuitive parts I find to be untrue could in fact be true and beyond my perception
My reasons, your perception, perhaps will see as psychotic.

I'd respect Maynard more for a few reasons:

1. My roots were with prayer to Jesus, and I went against him (with the darkness) for a while. I cursed God, and then conceded and absolved.

2. I could sense demons in his words (whether that be through cognitive regressions, or actual demons). It was a valiant struggle.

3. Many of his fans will benefit, because if Maynard truly has repented, and returned to The Holy Army, we've gained a powerful ally.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Luosdasa's Avatar Luosdasa
05-11-2006, 10:45 PM
Reply With Quote

I would not think of or repect Maynard any differently. On the one hand, i spose i Might think a little less of him should he place himself fully in one religion, to the point where he no longer questions anything suspect to do with said faith. But at the same time it would show that he was a humble enough person to renounce past ways in which he, imo, rather arogantly tried to force apon others (well maybe not force, but certainly attempt to influence while seeming to hold himself superior to others). That would offsett any respect lost due to blindly following any one religion.

But when it comes down to it... it doesnt really matter what i think of him, aslong as he keeps writing good and interesting lyrics.

And its not like he'd give a fuck one way or the other.
Old 05-11-2006, 10:45 PM   #26
Level 8 - Vociferous
 
Luosdasa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: NSW Australia
Posts: 594
Bincount™: 104
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

I would not think of or repect Maynard any differently. On the one hand, i spose i Might think a little less of him should he place himself fully in one religion, to the point where he no longer questions anything suspect to do with said faith. But at the same time it would show that he was a humble enough person to renounce past ways in which he, imo, rather arogantly tried to force apon others (well maybe not force, but certainly attempt to influence while seeming to hold himself superior to others). That would offsett any respect lost due to blindly following any one religion.

But when it comes down to it... it doesnt really matter what i think of him, aslong as he keeps writing good and interesting lyrics.

And its not like he'd give a fuck one way or the other.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
champion's Avatar champion
05-12-2006, 05:37 AM
Reply With Quote

It clearly doesn't mean Maynard turned Christian. It means that he has come to understand the err of his ways, because his mom believed in something that he didn't, but she was still a great person whom he lived. It's about acceptance.
Old 05-12-2006, 05:37 AM   #27
Banned.
 
champion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 5,321
Bincount™: 360
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

It clearly doesn't mean Maynard turned Christian. It means that he has come to understand the err of his ways, because his mom believed in something that he didn't, but she was still a great person whom he lived. It's about acceptance.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Koan's Avatar Koan
05-12-2006, 08:26 AM
Reply With Quote

This song is merely Maynard stating that if there is a heaven, his mother would deserve to enter. It is a tribute to her love and devotion, even while in pain. It is a magnificent song.
__________________
"I found the remnants of a crescent fang,
it cleaned my wing down to the bone....
Umbillical syllables left to decode,
there was no craddle I can taste it!"
Old 05-12-2006, 08:26 AM   #28
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
Koan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: In between my headphones
Posts: 246
Bincount™: 6
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

This song is merely Maynard stating that if there is a heaven, his mother would deserve to enter. It is a tribute to her love and devotion, even while in pain. It is a magnificent song.
__________________
"I found the remnants of a crescent fang,
it cleaned my wing down to the bone....
Umbillical syllables left to decode,
there was no craddle I can taste it!"
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Steventh
05-12-2006, 08:34 AM
Reply With Quote

Who the fuck cares if he is religious or not?
__________________
"I may find peace within the emptiness... how pitiful..."
Old 05-12-2006, 08:34 AM   #29
Level 6 - Very Deep Thinker
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 100
Bincount™: 0
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Who the fuck cares if he is religious or not?
__________________
"I may find peace within the emptiness... how pitiful..."
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
UtUmNo1's Avatar UtUmNo1
05-12-2006, 05:14 PM
Reply With Quote

It took this thread to work that out?
__________________
If this grand panorama before me is what you call God....


....then God is not dead.
Old 05-12-2006, 05:14 PM   #30
Level 12 - Scurrilous
 
UtUmNo1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Monaco
Posts: 5,144
Bincount™: 4207
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

It took this thread to work that out?
__________________
If this grand panorama before me is what you call God....


....then God is not dead.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
eslupminoyler's Avatar eslupminoyler
05-12-2006, 08:47 PM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by leefnaspleaf
If this song was intended to imply that Maynard Keenan is a Christian, then I'm a complete idiot who doesn't understand anything that happens ever.
Well, I think that is a bit short. There are many people that pray to Jesus that aren't necessarily Christians. Please expound upon what you mean, and your thoughts.
I'm a Christian that doesn't go to church. The average Christian probably thinks I'm going to hell.
So please expound upon your thoughts.
Old 05-12-2006, 08:47 PM   #31
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
eslupminoyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: I live in Heaven, but I'm on a vacation without my passport to get back.
Posts: 333
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by leefnaspleaf
If this song was intended to imply that Maynard Keenan is a Christian, then I'm a complete idiot who doesn't understand anything that happens ever.
Well, I think that is a bit short. There are many people that pray to Jesus that aren't necessarily Christians. Please expound upon what you mean, and your thoughts.
I'm a Christian that doesn't go to church. The average Christian probably thinks I'm going to hell.
So please expound upon your thoughts.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
HarryManback2122
05-12-2006, 09:31 PM
Reply With Quote

Maynard is a genius
Old 05-12-2006, 09:31 PM   #32
Level 2 - Poster
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Columbus,Oh
Posts: 8
Bincount™: 0
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Maynard is a genius
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
Carbonatedgravy
05-12-2006, 09:39 PM
Reply With Quote

I'd find it bizarre and unlikely if Maynard turned Christian. But it wouldn't bother me or change my opinions of the song. The song has in and of itself raised my respect of him though, because up until now I thought it was possible that he had hate for even the purist forms of Christianity, and now I see it's only the corruption by man that he's upset about, which is totally fair.
Old 05-12-2006, 09:39 PM   #33
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 296
Bincount™: 10
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

I'd find it bizarre and unlikely if Maynard turned Christian. But it wouldn't bother me or change my opinions of the song. The song has in and of itself raised my respect of him though, because up until now I thought it was possible that he had hate for even the purist forms of Christianity, and now I see it's only the corruption by man that he's upset about, which is totally fair.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
eslupminoyler's Avatar eslupminoyler
05-14-2006, 07:41 PM
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbonatedgravy
I'd find it bizarre and unlikely if Maynard turned Christian. But it wouldn't bother me or change my opinions of the song. The song has in and of itself raised my respect of him though, because up until now I thought it was possible that he had hate for even the purist forms of Christianity, and now I see it's only the corruption by man that he's upset about, which is totally fair.
Well put.
Old 05-14-2006, 07:41 PM   #34
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
eslupminoyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: I live in Heaven, but I'm on a vacation without my passport to get back.
Posts: 333
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbonatedgravy
I'd find it bizarre and unlikely if Maynard turned Christian. But it wouldn't bother me or change my opinions of the song. The song has in and of itself raised my respect of him though, because up until now I thought it was possible that he had hate for even the purist forms of Christianity, and now I see it's only the corruption by man that he's upset about, which is totally fair.
Well put.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
MypugsAreSmarterThanYou's Avatar MypugsAreSmarterThanYou
05-14-2006, 08:43 PM
Reply With Quote

[QUOTE=T-13h]"If one were to take the bible seriously one would go mad. But to take the bible seriously, one must be already mad.”

Aleister Crowley



sweet.
__________________
"here i am,expecting just a little bit...mmm..too much from...the wounded..."
Old 05-14-2006, 08:43 PM   #35
Level 9 - Obstreperous
 
MypugsAreSmarterThanYou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: canada
Posts: 1,317
Bincount™: 116
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

[QUOTE=T-13h]"If one were to take the bible seriously one would go mad. But to take the bible seriously, one must be already mad.”

Aleister Crowley



sweet.
__________________
"here i am,expecting just a little bit...mmm..too much from...the wounded..."
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
eslupminoyler's Avatar eslupminoyler
05-14-2006, 11:35 PM
Reply With Quote

[QUOTE=MypugsAreSmarterThanYou]
Quote:
Originally Posted by T-13h
"If one were to take the bible seriously one would go mad. But to take the bible seriously, one must be already mad.”

Aleister Crowley



sweet.
It's mad to assume insanity or madness from arriving at your own disposition of the disposition of others, because that societal norm which judges insanity or madness is based on humanities particulars and inferiorities.

So fuck Aleister Crowley, and all his clones.
Old 05-14-2006, 11:35 PM   #36
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
eslupminoyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: I live in Heaven, but I'm on a vacation without my passport to get back.
Posts: 333
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

[QUOTE=MypugsAreSmarterThanYou]
Quote:
Originally Posted by T-13h
"If one were to take the bible seriously one would go mad. But to take the bible seriously, one must be already mad.”

Aleister Crowley



sweet.
It's mad to assume insanity or madness from arriving at your own disposition of the disposition of others, because that societal norm which judges insanity or madness is based on humanities particulars and inferiorities.

So fuck Aleister Crowley, and all his clones.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
eslupminoyler's Avatar eslupminoyler
05-14-2006, 11:37 PM
Reply With Quote

[QUOTE=eslupminoyler]
Quote:
Originally Posted by MypugsAreSmarterThanYou

It's mad to assume insanity or madness from arriving at your own disposition of the disposition of others, because that societal norm which judges insanity or madness is based on humanities particulars and inferiorities.

So fuck Aleister Crowley, and all his clones.
You might say, "Hypocrit, you are saying you are mad too."

My response would be "I'm not ..."
Old 05-14-2006, 11:37 PM   #37
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
eslupminoyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: I live in Heaven, but I'm on a vacation without my passport to get back.
Posts: 333
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

[QUOTE=eslupminoyler]
Quote:
Originally Posted by MypugsAreSmarterThanYou

It's mad to assume insanity or madness from arriving at your own disposition of the disposition of others, because that societal norm which judges insanity or madness is based on humanities particulars and inferiorities.

So fuck Aleister Crowley, and all his clones.
You might say, "Hypocrit, you are saying you are mad too."

My response would be "I'm not ..."
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
blackandwhite's Avatar blackandwhite
05-15-2006, 11:16 AM
Reply With Quote

Just because you're saying fuck someone of course doesn't mean you're mad, but you're not really taking into consideration their point of view in this "opinion" forum. You're not mad, you're being blunt.
Old 05-15-2006, 11:16 AM   #38
Level 7 - Loquacious
 
blackandwhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: A bottle of Snapple Apple
Posts: 239
Bincount™: 7
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

Just because you're saying fuck someone of course doesn't mean you're mad, but you're not really taking into consideration their point of view in this "opinion" forum. You're not mad, you're being blunt.
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
mdurrant
05-15-2006, 11:35 AM
Reply With Quote

It wouldn't change my opinion of the music... people are welcome to believe whatever they like.

However, I tend to think Christians are delusional.

What's this you say? A delusional rocker with a Christ complex? Never...
Old 05-15-2006, 11:35 AM   #39
Level 4 - Thinker
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 32
Bincount™: 0
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

It wouldn't change my opinion of the music... people are welcome to believe whatever they like.

However, I tend to think Christians are delusional.

What's this you say? A delusional rocker with a Christ complex? Never...
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote
MypugsAreSmarterThanYou's Avatar MypugsAreSmarterThanYou
05-15-2006, 05:22 PM
Reply With Quote

[QUOTE=eslupminoyler]
Quote:
Originally Posted by eslupminoyler

You might say, "Hypocrit, you are saying you are mad too."

My response would be "I'm not ..."
who are you talking to?

you talkin' to me?
punk?
__________________
"here i am,expecting just a little bit...mmm..too much from...the wounded..."
Old 05-15-2006, 05:22 PM   #40
Level 9 - Obstreperous
 
MypugsAreSmarterThanYou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: canada
Posts: 1,317
Bincount™: 116
Re: If this song ended up meaning that Maynard was a Christian....

[QUOTE=eslupminoyler]
Quote:
Originally Posted by eslupminoyler

You might say, "Hypocrit, you are saying you are mad too."

My response would be "I'm not ..."
who are you talking to?

you talkin' to me?
punk?
__________________
"here i am,expecting just a little bit...mmm..too much from...the wounded..."
OFFLINE |   Reply With Quote


Reply

Rate This Thread
You have already rated this thread
« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

Quick Reply

Forum Jump

all posts © their respective authors. the tool page is not responsible for any of their thoughts, brilliant or otherwise.