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I agree with the whole 'thirsty' analogy someone threw out. I've lurked these borads for about a month now reading different theories on Vicarious, spirituality and other things in general, and have to say this is definatly at the top of things i have found. i might not agree with everything, and am more than confused about some of it (the whole 'gap' thing that is being spoken of,) but it definatly opens up doors to new thoughts. Next time i go for a walk, i'm taking the lyrics with me to see what i can see. Thank you man!
Last edited by Bob The Duck; 05-06-2006 at 05:26 PM..
05-06-2006, 05:23 PM
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#41
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Level 1 - Lurker
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Oxford, WI
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
I agree with the whole 'thirsty' analogy someone threw out. I've lurked these borads for about a month now reading different theories on Vicarious, spirituality and other things in general, and have to say this is definatly at the top of things i have found. i might not agree with everything, and am more than confused about some of it (the whole 'gap' thing that is being spoken of,) but it definatly opens up doors to new thoughts. Next time i go for a walk, i'm taking the lyrics with me to see what i can see. Thank you man!
Last edited by Bob The Duck; 05-06-2006 at 05:26 PM..
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05-06-2006, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Saturnist
Is there any chance that you could find the posts you made, similar reactions to the older albums?
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05-06-2006, 05:24 PM
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#42
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frat boy extraordinaire
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: The Gold Coast
Posts: 4,486
Bincount™: 6242
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
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Originally Posted by Saturnist
Is there any chance that you could find the posts you made, similar reactions to the older albums?
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I have looked already. They are too old, in the archives. I havent chose to repeat myself for a couple of years now. Actually if you find them, post them here so I can see how I have changed, if at all.
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05-06-2006, 05:27 PM
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#43
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Banned.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: revelation
Posts: 10,298
Bincount™: 9070
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
I have looked already. They are too old, in the archives. I havent chose to repeat myself for a couple of years now. Actually if you find them, post them here so I can see how I have changed, if at all.
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i haven't really sat down and spent quality time with the album yet myself, but i DEFINITELY see where you're coming from on this. well spoken. well thought-out. a pre-emptive "fuck you" to mindless trolls.
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05-06-2006, 05:29 PM
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#44
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Level 3 - Talker
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
i haven't really sat down and spent quality time with the album yet myself, but i DEFINITELY see where you're coming from on this. well spoken. well thought-out. a pre-emptive "fuck you" to mindless trolls.
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05-06-2006, 05:41 PM
Expanding on Glotch's idea.. perhaps the whole creation of the Earth type thing. The 7 days. 6 days of creation, 7th day of rest. Perhaps 6 albums is all they will do?
More to expand on with discussion...
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05-06-2006, 05:41 PM
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#45
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$2 + a potato = $2
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: THE BIT BUCKET
Posts: 9,521
Bincount™: 7267
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Expanding on Glotch's idea.. perhaps the whole creation of the Earth type thing. The 7 days. 6 days of creation, 7th day of rest. Perhaps 6 albums is all they will do?
More to expand on with discussion...
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05-06-2006, 05:41 PM
Wow, very interesting post. I can't believe you got all of that out so early. Like others I'm still trying to digest just the music and the album art. I can't say I agree or disagree with you yet, but you support your points very well.
It would be nice if you made a thread with links to more interesting viewpoints(threads) of this album as well as the rest of the albums. It's hard to shift thru all this shit on here just to find a needle in the haystack. As requested earlier could you link us to your other album reviews?
gf
edit: didn't even see page two before I posted.
__________________
My review of the greatest concert experience yet!
Last edited by GullyFoyle; 05-06-2006 at 05:45 PM..
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05-06-2006, 05:41 PM
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#46
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Level 6 - Very Deep Thinker
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Teegeeack
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Wow, very interesting post. I can't believe you got all of that out so early. Like others I'm still trying to digest just the music and the album art. I can't say I agree or disagree with you yet, but you support your points very well.
It would be nice if you made a thread with links to more interesting viewpoints(threads) of this album as well as the rest of the albums. It's hard to shift thru all this shit on here just to find a needle in the haystack. As requested earlier could you link us to your other album reviews?
gf
edit: didn't even see page two before I posted.
__________________
My review of the greatest concert experience yet!
Last edited by GullyFoyle; 05-06-2006 at 05:45 PM..
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05-06-2006, 05:49 PM
Excellent work, Paraflux. You should sticky this.
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05-06-2006, 05:49 PM
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#47
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Banned.
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: NY
Posts: 1,985
Bincount™: 664
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Excellent work, Paraflux. You should sticky this.
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05-06-2006, 06:04 PM
That was an awesome read, the most well articulated post ive read on 10,000 days. Although i got the reverse of your meaning on Rossetta Stoned, i thought it was a parody, but you might well be right, it does seem a little strange for them to just say "stop listening so hard we have nothing to say really." after working so hard on the message of the previous albums.
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05-06-2006, 06:04 PM
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#48
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Level 8 - Vociferous
Join Date: May 2004
Location: uk
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
That was an awesome read, the most well articulated post ive read on 10,000 days. Although i got the reverse of your meaning on Rossetta Stoned, i thought it was a parody, but you might well be right, it does seem a little strange for them to just say "stop listening so hard we have nothing to say really." after working so hard on the message of the previous albums.
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05-06-2006, 06:09 PM
mmm...this was a refreshing read. There is no such thing as over analyzation with Tool - i wish people would learn this.
however i still think Rosetta Stoned is more of a humorish (i daresay joke) song that has something to do (perhaps everything to do) with BMBs last newsletter - just read it and tell me what you think.
Like a lot of you guys here, i have read all of the faqs, reviews, interviews etc., that we have received in the last few months. Of all the things that i read, ONLY one thing stuck out to me, and it was very subtle... I forget what interview, but I believe it was a European publication interviewing Adam some time after ,"10,000 Days" was finished, (correct me if im wrong here) and he commented that he hopes Maynard is more involved in the writing process on the next album. Many of you were simply excited to hear that there might be a NEXT album, however i read into this remark a little deeper.
I was (and still am) a little worried that this comment might hint that Adam Jones is dissatisfied in some way with some portion of this album. I understand that that shouldnt ruin my fun, but it does make me more apt to believe that the incohesiveness that we percieve on this album is not merely imagined. I fear that the band had something in mind when they wrote the music to this album, and when Maynard came along, his contribution lacked a real theme, other than just sounding as if he is having a mid-life crisis of sorts. Im not saying i dont love this album - i think its terrific - Im just making a suggestion (based on miserably tenuous evidence) that songs like Rosetta Stoned, Intension, and perhaps even Jambi were "intended" to sound a bit different, but MJKs work elsewhere kind of stunted this album at its roots.
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"I think everyone should treat one another in a Christian manner. I will not, however, be responsible for the consequences."
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05-06-2006, 06:09 PM
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#49
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Level 8 - Vociferous
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: California
Posts: 655
Bincount™: 104
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
mmm...this was a refreshing read. There is no such thing as over analyzation with Tool - i wish people would learn this.
however i still think Rosetta Stoned is more of a humorish (i daresay joke) song that has something to do (perhaps everything to do) with BMBs last newsletter - just read it and tell me what you think.
Like a lot of you guys here, i have read all of the faqs, reviews, interviews etc., that we have received in the last few months. Of all the things that i read, ONLY one thing stuck out to me, and it was very subtle... I forget what interview, but I believe it was a European publication interviewing Adam some time after ,"10,000 Days" was finished, (correct me if im wrong here) and he commented that he hopes Maynard is more involved in the writing process on the next album. Many of you were simply excited to hear that there might be a NEXT album, however i read into this remark a little deeper.
I was (and still am) a little worried that this comment might hint that Adam Jones is dissatisfied in some way with some portion of this album. I understand that that shouldnt ruin my fun, but it does make me more apt to believe that the incohesiveness that we percieve on this album is not merely imagined. I fear that the band had something in mind when they wrote the music to this album, and when Maynard came along, his contribution lacked a real theme, other than just sounding as if he is having a mid-life crisis of sorts. Im not saying i dont love this album - i think its terrific - Im just making a suggestion (based on miserably tenuous evidence) that songs like Rosetta Stoned, Intension, and perhaps even Jambi were "intended" to sound a bit different, but MJKs work elsewhere kind of stunted this album at its roots.
__________________
"I think everyone should treat one another in a Christian manner. I will not, however, be responsible for the consequences."
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05-06-2006, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by mike tyson
...but to me, 10,000 Days doesn't have the same dark and dreary mood that I was so accustomed to and liked so much on Aenima and Lateralus.
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I totally agree, that is why Aenima and Lateralus are my fav. Tool albums. I was really hoping that Tool could top themselves, but 10,000 days is still a pretty decent album.
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T00LARMY: BJ
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05-06-2006, 06:15 PM
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#50
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Watch the Weather Change
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Room 237
Posts: 6,717
Bincount™: 4444
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
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Originally Posted by mike tyson
...but to me, 10,000 Days doesn't have the same dark and dreary mood that I was so accustomed to and liked so much on Aenima and Lateralus.
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I totally agree, that is why Aenima and Lateralus are my fav. Tool albums. I was really hoping that Tool could top themselves, but 10,000 days is still a pretty decent album.
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T00LARMY: BJ
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by paraflux
How long do we need to be pushed before we do it on our own? How fucking long? As responsible sentient beings, do they keep pushing us and feeding us? If they did that, they would be leading us. And that’s not how it works. That’s no different than any cult or sect of religious fanaticism. They don’t want to be your Christ. They don’t want fanatic followers who follow just as blindly as any hardline religion. The euphemism “think for yourself” is mocked often, because it’s so cliché’d now, since every 12 year old who saw Tool on that tour where that Leary quote preceded Third Eye has it in their signature. But it’s really a point they want to drive home. Do it for yourself, guys, because it’s time. And that’s what makes this album so scary to me. I’m facing fears here that I haven’t faced in a while. This album’s passive-ness made me not be able to sleep last night. We aren’t being pushed, driven, because it’s up to us and we cant keep being fed because the time is coming where if we cant do it on our own, we’ll see ourselves on the wrong side of the gap. We’re junkies for the kind of inspiration and push that Tool provides us with. Do they mind doing it? Of course not, but as I said, as responsible sentient beings, they cant keep feeding the junkies or the junkies will not progress. They wont always be able to show us the next door through, and we will have to be able to find them on our own.
Try to listen to this album next time in that light. See if you don’t feel yourself craving being driven, having inspiration exploding through your brain at all times. Then wonder if I could be correct. See if your hostility towards them using parts of music they have used in the past is misguided. See if you can accept it as them simply pointing to things they have already told us, and take it as a mockery of us not being able to get it the first time.
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no one commented on this and it should be shouted from the rooftops.
oh the irony. tool have been molded--by fans--into the types of things they rally against. you hit the nail on the head. i think this is what's going on. and if this was their intention? BRILLIANT on so many levels i can't even wrap my head around it.
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05-06-2006, 06:26 PM
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#51
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Level 5 - Deep Thinker
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: USA
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
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Originally Posted by paraflux
How long do we need to be pushed before we do it on our own? How fucking long? As responsible sentient beings, do they keep pushing us and feeding us? If they did that, they would be leading us. And that’s not how it works. That’s no different than any cult or sect of religious fanaticism. They don’t want to be your Christ. They don’t want fanatic followers who follow just as blindly as any hardline religion. The euphemism “think for yourself” is mocked often, because it’s so cliché’d now, since every 12 year old who saw Tool on that tour where that Leary quote preceded Third Eye has it in their signature. But it’s really a point they want to drive home. Do it for yourself, guys, because it’s time. And that’s what makes this album so scary to me. I’m facing fears here that I haven’t faced in a while. This album’s passive-ness made me not be able to sleep last night. We aren’t being pushed, driven, because it’s up to us and we cant keep being fed because the time is coming where if we cant do it on our own, we’ll see ourselves on the wrong side of the gap. We’re junkies for the kind of inspiration and push that Tool provides us with. Do they mind doing it? Of course not, but as I said, as responsible sentient beings, they cant keep feeding the junkies or the junkies will not progress. They wont always be able to show us the next door through, and we will have to be able to find them on our own.
Try to listen to this album next time in that light. See if you don’t feel yourself craving being driven, having inspiration exploding through your brain at all times. Then wonder if I could be correct. See if your hostility towards them using parts of music they have used in the past is misguided. See if you can accept it as them simply pointing to things they have already told us, and take it as a mockery of us not being able to get it the first time.
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no one commented on this and it should be shouted from the rooftops.
oh the irony. tool have been molded--by fans--into the types of things they rally against. you hit the nail on the head. i think this is what's going on. and if this was their intention? BRILLIANT on so many levels i can't even wrap my head around it. |
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nice interpretation. i only just began to see the storyline, i'm amazed you have it detailed already.
the one hole i do see in your ideas is the pot and lipan conjuring. i don't know what it is but i have a feeling there is more there.
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05-06-2006, 07:08 PM
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#52
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Level 5 - Deep Thinker
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Washington DC
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
nice interpretation. i only just began to see the storyline, i'm amazed you have it detailed already.
the one hole i do see in your ideas is the pot and lipan conjuring. i don't know what it is but i have a feeling there is more there.
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05-06-2006, 07:14 PM
Amazing post paraflux.
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05-06-2006, 07:14 PM
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#53
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Level 12 - Scurrilous
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Cali
Posts: 4,024
Bincount™: 954
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Amazing post paraflux.
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Become what you are
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05-06-2006, 07:18 PM
paraflux -
great job. really thought provoking. I loved the album before, can't wait to listen to it again.
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05-06-2006, 07:18 PM
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#54
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Level 7 - Loquacious
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: new york city
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
paraflux -
great job. really thought provoking. I loved the album before, can't wait to listen to it again.
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05-06-2006, 07:34 PM
so long
worth it tho. good shit
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give me a place to stand and i will move the earth
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05-06-2006, 07:34 PM
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#55
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Level 12 - Scurrilous
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: UNBAN SHADE UNBAN SHADE UNBAN SHADE UNBAN SHADE UNBAN SHADE UNBAN SHADE UNBAN SHADE UNBAN SHADE IMO
Posts: 5,320
Bincount™: 8627
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
so long
worth it tho. good shit
__________________
give me a place to stand and i will move the earth
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by tangledupinblue
no one commented on this and it should be shouted from the rooftops.
oh the irony. tool have been molded--by fans--into the types of things they rally against. you hit the nail on the head. i think this is what's going on. and if this was their intention? BRILLIANT on so many levels i can't even wrap my head around it.
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See that's the problem. You say that Tool has been molded into this cultish type phenomenon or whatever by the fans. If this is the case, then why does Maynard go out of his way to be mysterious/crazy/deep/etc? I've seen Maynard hide behind a sheet at a concert and then he immediately runs away after the show. Why? He knows that feeds the crowd's appetite for everything Tool.
I've heard it said a million times that "Tool wants you to think for yourself", but everything they do/say works against that. Why do people hang on every syllable that comes out of MJK's mouth if they're supposed to be thinking for themselves? Is it their fault? Hell no. HE'S the one that couches everything he says in fifty million layers of sarcasm and innuendo and purposely goes out of his way to feed the rumor mill.
Seriously, if Tool started all those years ago with a plan to be the "saviour" for the masses that would listen then props to them. However, I just can't buy into that. As much as Maynard claims to hate Jesus and have issues with him he sure does act like him alot. I think that Tool is actually a tool for Maynard to work out all his issues with himself (like enjoying getting it up the keister). We all get to be privy to one man's supposed suffering, quest for enlightenment, and rants on all things political that's why we come back time and time again (kind of like Vicarious. . .).
I enjoy Tool for their unique sound, the artwork associated with their albums, and the chance for me to listen to something that isn't "look at my lovely lady lumps, humps, and bullshit". If Maynard thinks he is helping me to save my soul, great. I was thinking for myself long before I ever started listening to Tool and I'll be doing it long after Tool disappears. Whatever I get from their music I'll take it and continue on my merry way w/o buying into it wholesale and trying to alter my life around it.
Enjoy Tool. Don't take it as something you need to try and squeeze every iota of hidden meaning out of to try and find the true path or anything like that. Just my 2 cents.
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05-06-2006, 07:36 PM
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#56
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Level 3 - Talker
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by tangledupinblue
no one commented on this and it should be shouted from the rooftops.
oh the irony. tool have been molded--by fans--into the types of things they rally against. you hit the nail on the head. i think this is what's going on. and if this was their intention? BRILLIANT on so many levels i can't even wrap my head around it.
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See that's the problem. You say that Tool has been molded into this cultish type phenomenon or whatever by the fans. If this is the case, then why does Maynard go out of his way to be mysterious/crazy/deep/etc? I've seen Maynard hide behind a sheet at a concert and then he immediately runs away after the show. Why? He knows that feeds the crowd's appetite for everything Tool.
I've heard it said a million times that "Tool wants you to think for yourself", but everything they do/say works against that. Why do people hang on every syllable that comes out of MJK's mouth if they're supposed to be thinking for themselves? Is it their fault? Hell no. HE'S the one that couches everything he says in fifty million layers of sarcasm and innuendo and purposely goes out of his way to feed the rumor mill.
Seriously, if Tool started all those years ago with a plan to be the "saviour" for the masses that would listen then props to them. However, I just can't buy into that. As much as Maynard claims to hate Jesus and have issues with him he sure does act like him alot. I think that Tool is actually a tool for Maynard to work out all his issues with himself (like enjoying getting it up the keister). We all get to be privy to one man's supposed suffering, quest for enlightenment, and rants on all things political that's why we come back time and time again (kind of like Vicarious. . .).
I enjoy Tool for their unique sound, the artwork associated with their albums, and the chance for me to listen to something that isn't "look at my lovely lady lumps, humps, and bullshit". If Maynard thinks he is helping me to save my soul, great. I was thinking for myself long before I ever started listening to Tool and I'll be doing it long after Tool disappears. Whatever I get from their music I'll take it and continue on my merry way w/o buying into it wholesale and trying to alter my life around it.
Enjoy Tool. Don't take it as something you need to try and squeeze every iota of hidden meaning out of to try and find the true path or anything like that. Just my 2 cents. |
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05-06-2006, 07:45 PM
This is the greatest thread ever. Flux, fantastic job on translating your interpretation for everyone, I think it's spot on. There actually hasn't been one stupid, or hostile thing said on this thread yet. Sticky this, it will surley go down in tdn history.
__________________
bury your fucking dead
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05-06-2006, 07:45 PM
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#57
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Level 7 - Loquacious
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NOLA
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
This is the greatest thread ever. Flux, fantastic job on translating your interpretation for everyone, I think it's spot on. There actually hasn't been one stupid, or hostile thing said on this thread yet. Sticky this, it will surley go down in tdn history.
__________________
bury your fucking dead
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05-06-2006, 07:58 PM
Quote:
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Originally Posted by InertUniformity
mmm...this was a refreshing read. There is no such thing as over analyzation with Tool - i wish people would learn this.
however i still think Rosetta Stoned is more of a humorish (i daresay joke) song that has something to do (perhaps everything to do) with BMBs last newsletter - just read it and tell me what you think.
Like a lot of you guys here, i have read all of the faqs, reviews, interviews etc., that we have received in the last few months. Of all the things that i read, ONLY one thing stuck out to me, and it was very subtle... I forget what interview, but I believe it was a European publication interviewing Adam some time after ,"10,000 Days" was finished, (correct me if im wrong here) and he commented that he hopes Maynard is more involved in the writing process on the next album. Many of you were simply excited to hear that there might be a NEXT album, however i read into this remark a little deeper.
I was (and still am) a little worried that this comment might hint that Adam Jones is dissatisfied in some way with some portion of this album. I understand that that shouldnt ruin my fun, but it does make me more apt to believe that the incohesiveness that we percieve on this album is not merely imagined. I fear that the band had something in mind when they wrote the music to this album, and when Maynard came along, his contribution lacked a real theme, other than just sounding as if he is having a mid-life crisis of sorts. Im not saying i dont love this album - i think its terrific - Im just making a suggestion (based on miserably tenuous evidence) that songs like Rosetta Stoned, Intension, and perhaps even Jambi were "intended" to sound a bit different, but MJKs work elsewhere kind of stunted this album at its roots.
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Yeah, it seems to me that on this album more than any other, or maybe the only album rather, that they just arent on the same page. It would be impossible to make this assumption on the music versus lyrical content. There have been some curious comments made especially by Adam Jones that elude to the fact that he may not be real happy with the lyrical direction of this work. Or at least feel no better than content with it.
Reading or listening to interviews with these guys you really got the idea that Maynard was the voice of things the band really wanted to say in the past. I dont know if you can say the same thing this time. I do really like this album, dont get me wrong, for me it always takes a while to feel a tool album as a cohesive unit, this one will be no different.
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05-06-2006, 07:58 PM
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#58
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Level 4 - Thinker
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: St. Louis
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by InertUniformity
mmm...this was a refreshing read. There is no such thing as over analyzation with Tool - i wish people would learn this.
however i still think Rosetta Stoned is more of a humorish (i daresay joke) song that has something to do (perhaps everything to do) with BMBs last newsletter - just read it and tell me what you think.
Like a lot of you guys here, i have read all of the faqs, reviews, interviews etc., that we have received in the last few months. Of all the things that i read, ONLY one thing stuck out to me, and it was very subtle... I forget what interview, but I believe it was a European publication interviewing Adam some time after ,"10,000 Days" was finished, (correct me if im wrong here) and he commented that he hopes Maynard is more involved in the writing process on the next album. Many of you were simply excited to hear that there might be a NEXT album, however i read into this remark a little deeper.
I was (and still am) a little worried that this comment might hint that Adam Jones is dissatisfied in some way with some portion of this album. I understand that that shouldnt ruin my fun, but it does make me more apt to believe that the incohesiveness that we percieve on this album is not merely imagined. I fear that the band had something in mind when they wrote the music to this album, and when Maynard came along, his contribution lacked a real theme, other than just sounding as if he is having a mid-life crisis of sorts. Im not saying i dont love this album - i think its terrific - Im just making a suggestion (based on miserably tenuous evidence) that songs like Rosetta Stoned, Intension, and perhaps even Jambi were "intended" to sound a bit different, but MJKs work elsewhere kind of stunted this album at its roots.
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Yeah, it seems to me that on this album more than any other, or maybe the only album rather, that they just arent on the same page. It would be impossible to make this assumption on the music versus lyrical content. There have been some curious comments made especially by Adam Jones that elude to the fact that he may not be real happy with the lyrical direction of this work. Or at least feel no better than content with it.
Reading or listening to interviews with these guys you really got the idea that Maynard was the voice of things the band really wanted to say in the past. I dont know if you can say the same thing this time. I do really like this album, dont get me wrong, for me it always takes a while to feel a tool album as a cohesive unit, this one will be no different. |
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Originally Posted by Liquid Vision
See that's the problem. You say that Tool has been molded into this cultish type phenomenon or whatever by the fans. If this is the case, then why does Maynard go out of his way to be mysterious/crazy/deep/etc? I've seen Maynard hide behind a sheet at a concert and then he immediately runs away after the show. Why? He knows that feeds the crowd's appetite for everything Tool.
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So if a man does nothing, he is considered deep and mysterious? I dont get it. The notion that you actually have to put yourself in the spotlight to not be pretentious is beyond me.
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I've heard it said a million times that "Tool wants you to think for yourself", but everything they do/say works against that. Why do people hang on every syllable that comes out of MJK's mouth if they're supposed to be thinking for themselves? Is it their fault? Hell no. HE'S the one that couches everything he says in fifty million layers of sarcasm and innuendo and purposely goes out of his way to feed the rumor mill.
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Their layers are layers of depth. The fact that people take that to mean that someone is trying their best to be fake is beyond me. You act as if you sat down with the man and planned his career, saying what he "purposefully" does.
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Seriously, if Tool started all those years ago with a plan to be the "saviour" for the masses that would listen then props to them. However, I just can't buy into that. As much as Maynard claims to hate Jesus and have issues with him he sure does act like him alot. I think that Tool is actually a tool for Maynard to work out all his issues with himself (like enjoying getting it up the keister). We all get to be privy to one man's supposed suffering, quest for enlightenment, and rants on all things political that's why we come back time and time again (kind of like Vicarious. . .).
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There's a lot that's beyond me, I guess. I dont see why people cant understand that saviors do not ask nor do they want to be. You keep saying "he" as if you arent including the whole band. There are 4 members all saying the same thing, at least last time I listened. All acting the same way.
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I enjoy Tool for their unique sound, the artwork associated with their albums, and the chance for me to listen to something that isn't "look at my lovely lady lumps, humps, and bullshit". If Maynard thinks he is helping me to save my soul, great. I was thinking for myself long before I ever started listening to Tool and I'll be doing it long after Tool disappears. Whatever I get from their music I'll take it and continue on my merry way w/o buying into it wholesale and trying to alter my life around it.
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He doesnt think about you, man. At all. His compassion is for the race, not for you. No one is asking you to buy into anything, especially not them. Apathetic, man. What's necessary.
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Enjoy Tool. Don't take it as something you need to try and squeeze every iota of hidden meaning out of to try and find the true path or anything like that. Just my 2 cents.
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I dont know if one can enjoy Tool to the maximum potential without doing that. Responsibly.
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05-06-2006, 08:09 PM
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#59
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Banned.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: revelation
Posts: 10,298
Bincount™: 9070
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Liquid Vision
See that's the problem. You say that Tool has been molded into this cultish type phenomenon or whatever by the fans. If this is the case, then why does Maynard go out of his way to be mysterious/crazy/deep/etc? I've seen Maynard hide behind a sheet at a concert and then he immediately runs away after the show. Why? He knows that feeds the crowd's appetite for everything Tool.
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So if a man does nothing, he is considered deep and mysterious? I dont get it. The notion that you actually have to put yourself in the spotlight to not be pretentious is beyond me.
Quote:
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I've heard it said a million times that "Tool wants you to think for yourself", but everything they do/say works against that. Why do people hang on every syllable that comes out of MJK's mouth if they're supposed to be thinking for themselves? Is it their fault? Hell no. HE'S the one that couches everything he says in fifty million layers of sarcasm and innuendo and purposely goes out of his way to feed the rumor mill.
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Their layers are layers of depth. The fact that people take that to mean that someone is trying their best to be fake is beyond me. You act as if you sat down with the man and planned his career, saying what he "purposefully" does.
Quote:
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Seriously, if Tool started all those years ago with a plan to be the "saviour" for the masses that would listen then props to them. However, I just can't buy into that. As much as Maynard claims to hate Jesus and have issues with him he sure does act like him alot. I think that Tool is actually a tool for Maynard to work out all his issues with himself (like enjoying getting it up the keister). We all get to be privy to one man's supposed suffering, quest for enlightenment, and rants on all things political that's why we come back time and time again (kind of like Vicarious. . .).
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There's a lot that's beyond me, I guess. I dont see why people cant understand that saviors do not ask nor do they want to be. You keep saying "he" as if you arent including the whole band. There are 4 members all saying the same thing, at least last time I listened. All acting the same way.
Quote:
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I enjoy Tool for their unique sound, the artwork associated with their albums, and the chance for me to listen to something that isn't "look at my lovely lady lumps, humps, and bullshit". If Maynard thinks he is helping me to save my soul, great. I was thinking for myself long before I ever started listening to Tool and I'll be doing it long after Tool disappears. Whatever I get from their music I'll take it and continue on my merry way w/o buying into it wholesale and trying to alter my life around it.
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He doesnt think about you, man. At all. His compassion is for the race, not for you. No one is asking you to buy into anything, especially not them. Apathetic, man. What's necessary.
Quote:
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Enjoy Tool. Don't take it as something you need to try and squeeze every iota of hidden meaning out of to try and find the true path or anything like that. Just my 2 cents.
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I dont know if one can enjoy Tool to the maximum potential without doing that. Responsibly. |
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05-06-2006, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by paraflux
Lipan Conjuring
Sounds to me like this could be an Indian burial ceremony. Hmmm…
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awesome post. thanks for the thought and time you invested for our collective consumption.
you may or may not have read, in an interview danny stated this track is a Lipan exorcism. he wanted this on the record as a way of warding off evil.
__________________
Childbirth is no more a miracle then eating food and a turd coming out of your ass -bh
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05-06-2006, 08:10 PM
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#60
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Level 8 - Vociferous
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: wny
Posts: 665
Bincount™: 762
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by paraflux
Lipan Conjuring
Sounds to me like this could be an Indian burial ceremony. Hmmm…
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awesome post. thanks for the thought and time you invested for our collective consumption.
you may or may not have read, in an interview danny stated this track is a Lipan exorcism. he wanted this on the record as a way of warding off evil.
__________________
Childbirth is no more a miracle then eating food and a turd coming out of your ass -bh
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That would make more sense, perhaps. Exorcism, yes.
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05-06-2006, 08:11 PM
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#61
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Banned.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: revelation
Posts: 10,298
Bincount™: 9070
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
That would make more sense, perhaps. Exorcism, yes.
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05-06-2006, 08:21 PM
i read the first two posts and had to stop...i am too drunk to understand anything.but will give this a read once im sober...from what i read this seems like a very in-depth review. it's fun to see someone so passionate about a piece of music, but then again it's tool...we've all been there...
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05-06-2006, 08:21 PM
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#62
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Level 7 - Loquacious
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: finland
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
i read the first two posts and had to stop...i am too drunk to understand anything.but will give this a read once im sober...from what i read this seems like a very in-depth review. it's fun to see someone so passionate about a piece of music, but then again it's tool...we've all been there...
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Liquid Vision
See that's the problem. You say that Tool has been molded into this cultish type phenomenon or whatever by the fans. If this is the case, then why does Maynard go out of his way to be mysterious/crazy/deep/etc? I've seen Maynard hide behind a sheet at a concert and then he immediately runs away after the show. Why? He knows that feeds the crowd's appetite for everything Tool.
I've heard it said a million times that "Tool wants you to think for yourself", but everything they do/say works against that. Why do people hang on every syllable that comes out of MJK's mouth if they're supposed to be thinking for themselves? Is it their fault? Hell no. HE'S the one that couches everything he says in fifty million layers of sarcasm and innuendo and purposely goes out of his way to feed the rumor mill.
Seriously, if Tool started all those years ago with a plan to be the "saviour" for the masses that would listen then props to them. However, I just can't buy into that. As much as Maynard claims to hate Jesus and have issues with him he sure does act like him alot. I think that Tool is actually a tool for Maynard to work out all his issues with himself (like enjoying getting it up the keister). We all get to be privy to one man's supposed suffering, quest for enlightenment, and rants on all things political that's why we come back time and time again (kind of like Vicarious. . .).
I enjoy Tool for their unique sound, the artwork associated with their albums, and the chance for me to listen to something that isn't "look at my lovely lady lumps, humps, and bullshit". If Maynard thinks he is helping me to save my soul, great. I was thinking for myself long before I ever started listening to Tool and I'll be doing it long after Tool disappears. Whatever I get from their music I'll take it and continue on my merry way w/o buying into it wholesale and trying to alter my life around it.
Enjoy Tool. Don't take it as something you need to try and squeeze every iota of hidden meaning out of to try and find the true path or anything like that. Just my 2 cents.
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i don't know if this post was directed at me or what, but i got over idol worship with new kids on the block. i've been a fan of tool since the mid 90s. up until the leak, i didn't know the names of the band members except MJK. and tool is definetely one of my favorite bands.
my point is that it's about the music and only the music. everything else is superfluous in my opinion.
i don't agree that everything they do goes against thinking for yourself. the stuff they sing about (pre 10k days, imo) may just be new to you. that's why "you" or whoever hangs onto every word.
and i have no idea where taking it up the butt came from. :)
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05-06-2006, 08:30 PM
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#63
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Level 5 - Deep Thinker
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: USA
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Liquid Vision
See that's the problem. You say that Tool has been molded into this cultish type phenomenon or whatever by the fans. If this is the case, then why does Maynard go out of his way to be mysterious/crazy/deep/etc? I've seen Maynard hide behind a sheet at a concert and then he immediately runs away after the show. Why? He knows that feeds the crowd's appetite for everything Tool.
I've heard it said a million times that "Tool wants you to think for yourself", but everything they do/say works against that. Why do people hang on every syllable that comes out of MJK's mouth if they're supposed to be thinking for themselves? Is it their fault? Hell no. HE'S the one that couches everything he says in fifty million layers of sarcasm and innuendo and purposely goes out of his way to feed the rumor mill.
Seriously, if Tool started all those years ago with a plan to be the "saviour" for the masses that would listen then props to them. However, I just can't buy into that. As much as Maynard claims to hate Jesus and have issues with him he sure does act like him alot. I think that Tool is actually a tool for Maynard to work out all his issues with himself (like enjoying getting it up the keister). We all get to be privy to one man's supposed suffering, quest for enlightenment, and rants on all things political that's why we come back time and time again (kind of like Vicarious. . .).
I enjoy Tool for their unique sound, the artwork associated with their albums, and the chance for me to listen to something that isn't "look at my lovely lady lumps, humps, and bullshit". If Maynard thinks he is helping me to save my soul, great. I was thinking for myself long before I ever started listening to Tool and I'll be doing it long after Tool disappears. Whatever I get from their music I'll take it and continue on my merry way w/o buying into it wholesale and trying to alter my life around it.
Enjoy Tool. Don't take it as something you need to try and squeeze every iota of hidden meaning out of to try and find the true path or anything like that. Just my 2 cents.
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i don't know if this post was directed at me or what, but i got over idol worship with new kids on the block. i've been a fan of tool since the mid 90s. up until the leak, i didn't know the names of the band members except MJK. and tool is definetely one of my favorite bands.
my point is that it's about the music and only the music. everything else is superfluous in my opinion.
i don't agree that everything they do goes against thinking for yourself. the stuff they sing about (pre 10k days, imo) may just be new to you. that's why "you" or whoever hangs onto every word.
and i have no idea where taking it up the butt came from. :) |
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05-06-2006, 08:35 PM
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Originally Posted by azatoth
i read the first two posts and had to stop...i am too drunk to understand anything.but will give this a read once im sober...from what i read this seems like a very in-depth review. it's fun to see someone so passionate about a piece of music, but then again it's tool...we've all been there...
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lol, gotta love honesty about not reading...
__________________
Childbirth is no more a miracle then eating food and a turd coming out of your ass -bh
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05-06-2006, 08:35 PM
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#64
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Level 8 - Vociferous
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: wny
Posts: 665
Bincount™: 762
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by azatoth
i read the first two posts and had to stop...i am too drunk to understand anything.but will give this a read once im sober...from what i read this seems like a very in-depth review. it's fun to see someone so passionate about a piece of music, but then again it's tool...we've all been there...
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lol, gotta love honesty about not reading...
__________________
Childbirth is no more a miracle then eating food and a turd coming out of your ass -bh
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05-06-2006, 08:45 PM
Quote:
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Originally Posted by tangledupinblue
i don't know if this post was directed at me or what, but i got over idol worship with new kids on the block. i've been a fan of tool since the mid 90s. up until the leak, i didn't know the names of the band members except MJK. and tool is definetely one of my favorite bands.
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how can you not know all of the band members names? *scratches head* tool has been the only band ive ever bothered to learn all of their names, but i guess to each his own. does this mean you havent bought an album by them, because i cant picture someone who buys the cds and still doesnt know the band members names until the 5th album (yes im counting opiate as an album, sue me:-D).
__________________
Think. Digest. Reflect.
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05-06-2006, 08:45 PM
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#65
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Level 5 - Deep Thinker
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sacramento, CA
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by tangledupinblue
i don't know if this post was directed at me or what, but i got over idol worship with new kids on the block. i've been a fan of tool since the mid 90s. up until the leak, i didn't know the names of the band members except MJK. and tool is definetely one of my favorite bands.
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how can you not know all of the band members names? *scratches head* tool has been the only band ive ever bothered to learn all of their names, but i guess to each his own. does this mean you havent bought an album by them, because i cant picture someone who buys the cds and still doesnt know the band members names until the 5th album (yes im counting opiate as an album, sue me:-D).
__________________
Think. Digest. Reflect.
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OFFLINE |
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by tangledupinblue
i don't know if this post was directed at me or what, but i got over idol worship with new kids on the block. i've been a fan of tool since the mid 90s. up until the leak, i didn't know the names of the band members except MJK. and tool is definetely one of my favorite bands.
my point is that it's about the music and only the music. everything else is superfluous in my opinion.
i don't agree that everything they do goes against thinking for yourself. the stuff they sing about (pre 10k days, imo) may just be new to you. that's why "you" or whoever hangs onto every word.
and i have no idea where taking it up the butt came from. :)
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No, it wasn't directed at you, more to para and folks in general. No, nothing from Tool is new to me. Obviously some people hang onto every word because they spend hours on end trying to dissect the music and then they post a thesis on this message board.
Maynard (from the quote at the entrance to this forum) wants you to "be inspired and do something extraordinary" and use it as "inspiration for some other activity they excel in". Is everyone's activity they excel in posting nonsense on the internet about what they think Tool/Maynard means by this one word here or that one number there? My point is. . .quit wasting your time hashing and rehashing everything they say man. Better ways to spend your time.
Taking it up the butt comes from Maynard trying to cope with the fact that he likes anal stimulation. I never thought it was a big deal, but he obsesses over it and then tries to cover it up by making you think there is some higher meaning. That's a whole other 100 page thread in itself tho. ;)
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05-06-2006, 08:47 PM
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#66
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Level 3 - Talker
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by tangledupinblue
i don't know if this post was directed at me or what, but i got over idol worship with new kids on the block. i've been a fan of tool since the mid 90s. up until the leak, i didn't know the names of the band members except MJK. and tool is definetely one of my favorite bands.
my point is that it's about the music and only the music. everything else is superfluous in my opinion.
i don't agree that everything they do goes against thinking for yourself. the stuff they sing about (pre 10k days, imo) may just be new to you. that's why "you" or whoever hangs onto every word.
and i have no idea where taking it up the butt came from. :)
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No, it wasn't directed at you, more to para and folks in general. No, nothing from Tool is new to me. Obviously some people hang onto every word because they spend hours on end trying to dissect the music and then they post a thesis on this message board.
Maynard (from the quote at the entrance to this forum) wants you to "be inspired and do something extraordinary" and use it as "inspiration for some other activity they excel in". Is everyone's activity they excel in posting nonsense on the internet about what they think Tool/Maynard means by this one word here or that one number there? My point is. . .quit wasting your time hashing and rehashing everything they say man. Better ways to spend your time.
Taking it up the butt comes from Maynard trying to cope with the fact that he likes anal stimulation. I never thought it was a big deal, but he obsesses over it and then tries to cover it up by making you think there is some higher meaning. That's a whole other 100 page thread in itself tho. ;) |
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05-06-2006, 08:51 PM
Great thread. I've really enjoyed reading it. =] Sticky this. It not only helps define what this album is about [or may be about], but maybe opens the door for some other ideas about it to flow through.
I certainly hadn't looked at a lot of the songs the same way, but now I will on next listen, and see where that takes me.
Thanks for all of the time that this must have taken to construct 'flux. Most excellent.
__________________
[omfgrawr]
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05-06-2006, 08:51 PM
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#67
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Level 4 - Thinker
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Saint Paul
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Great thread. I've really enjoyed reading it. =] Sticky this. It not only helps define what this album is about [or may be about], but maybe opens the door for some other ideas about it to flow through.
I certainly hadn't looked at a lot of the songs the same way, but now I will on next listen, and see where that takes me.
Thanks for all of the time that this must have taken to construct 'flux. Most excellent.
__________________
[omfgrawr]
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05-06-2006, 08:51 PM
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gl0tch
Great post Paraflux!
Good things come in 3's. So do Tragedies. If 10,000 Days, in it's implication of sadness and violence, is Tool's 2nd generation version of Undertow, then their next 2 albums might just present the extremes of both sides of this gap.
Regarding the live aspect of Tool, its true that many people who caught Tool during the Lateralus tour never saw them live before. Chances are, during the fall 2006 10kD tour many of the people will have at least one show under their belt. Considering this (and not knowing how they could possibly develop a live show that could move beyond that of the Lateralus tour and still influence new ideas while they are playing old 'hits'), I fear many people will grow in their own personal cynicism, further non-constructively critize the band, and express their well cultivated lack-of-concentration-meets-internet-inflicted-attention spans. They will find the occasional inclusion of a few new songs parallel to the process of teaching an old dog a few new tricks.
All things considered, I might suggest the following:
Tool tours during the fall not to develop the next chapter of their ideas in a live context, but rather only to hone their technical skills. Immediately after, instead of taking 5 years off, they do what they did between Undertow and Ænima and re-enter the studio in the most gut wrenching, ball crushed, tired and pissed fashion and channel all that energy into their next album. They release their 5th album during the fall of '07 or spring '08. Here, we find all the dirty and explosive, bitter and dead remnants of affect and disgust. Right in time for the next presidential election! This is to be the album that illustrates the side of the gap which forgoes hope.
And then, they DO NOT tour for this album.
Following, they record their 6th (and final?) proper full length, the most encoded, spirtual and highest tiered album to date. This makes Lateralus look like Border's Books & Music's self-help section. This doesnt just illustrate the hope side of the gap.
This album IS hope. This is THE SOUNDTRACK for the hope side of the gap. This is what we will hear...
THEN, then, they tour! They only play music from the as-of-yet 5th and 6th albums, with all new visualizations, all new aspects, no regurgative songs, no re-telling old stories, no prior audience relationship with these songs live. All new experience. All new vulnerability. All new instruction.
End Tool.
The way I see their LP catalog in full:
Undertow is to 10, 000 Days (both are transitions),
as Ænima will be to Album 5
and Lateralus will be to Album 6
Where we see these themes:
Undertow - Pain can manifest Potential.
Ænima- Potential can manifest Plans.
Lateralus- A Plan can manifest Change.
10,000 Days- Then, a decision must be made.
Album 5- Choose against and Consequence 'A' will be negative.
Album 6- Choose for and Consequence 'B' will be positive.
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Very good theory, 99% correct (imo). Except for the not touring part. Name me a world known band such as tool, That has'nt toured after an album release.
Also how will they hold up (time/age). That will put maynrd around 47-50 years old by the time they tour for album six ( your theory ). So i think they tour and unfortunatly stop at album 5.
__________________
If I'm on the toilet longer than 2 minutes I'm jerking off. - (jag)
toolhed46n2//support your loco bands
Bin Purpose: You are the real fluxerpretation, its true personification.
TOYKO!! R.I.P. The Alien Gus
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05-06-2006, 08:51 PM
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#68
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Member Of The Bored (tdn $upporter)
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: lolapolis™
Posts: 5,058
Bincount™: 11897
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gl0tch
Great post Paraflux!
Good things come in 3's. So do Tragedies. If 10,000 Days, in it's implication of sadness and violence, is Tool's 2nd generation version of Undertow, then their next 2 albums might just present the extremes of both sides of this gap.
Regarding the live aspect of Tool, its true that many people who caught Tool during the Lateralus tour never saw them live before. Chances are, during the fall 2006 10kD tour many of the people will have at least one show under their belt. Considering this (and not knowing how they could possibly develop a live show that could move beyond that of the Lateralus tour and still influence new ideas while they are playing old 'hits'), I fear many people will grow in their own personal cynicism, further non-constructively critize the band, and express their well cultivated lack-of-concentration-meets-internet-inflicted-attention spans. They will find the occasional inclusion of a few new songs parallel to the process of teaching an old dog a few new tricks.
All things considered, I might suggest the following:
Tool tours during the fall not to develop the next chapter of their ideas in a live context, but rather only to hone their technical skills. Immediately after, instead of taking 5 years off, they do what they did between Undertow and Ænima and re-enter the studio in the most gut wrenching, ball crushed, tired and pissed fashion and channel all that energy into their next album. They release their 5th album during the fall of '07 or spring '08. Here, we find all the dirty and explosive, bitter and dead remnants of affect and disgust. Right in time for the next presidential election! This is to be the album that illustrates the side of the gap which forgoes hope.
And then, they DO NOT tour for this album.
Following, they record their 6th (and final?) proper full length, the most encoded, spirtual and highest tiered album to date. This makes Lateralus look like Border's Books & Music's self-help section. This doesnt just illustrate the hope side of the gap.
This album IS hope. This is THE SOUNDTRACK for the hope side of the gap. This is what we will hear...
THEN, then, they tour! They only play music from the as-of-yet 5th and 6th albums, with all new visualizations, all new aspects, no regurgative songs, no re-telling old stories, no prior audience relationship with these songs live. All new experience. All new vulnerability. All new instruction.
End Tool.
The way I see their LP catalog in full:
Undertow is to 10, 000 Days (both are transitions),
as Ænima will be to Album 5
and Lateralus will be to Album 6
Where we see these themes:
Undertow - Pain can manifest Potential.
Ænima- Potential can manifest Plans.
Lateralus- A Plan can manifest Change.
10,000 Days- Then, a decision must be made.
Album 5- Choose against and Consequence 'A' will be negative.
Album 6- Choose for and Consequence 'B' will be positive.
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Very good theory, 99% correct (imo). Except for the not touring part. Name me a world known band such as tool, That has'nt toured after an album release.
Also how will they hold up (time/age). That will put maynrd around 47-50 years old by the time they tour for album six ( your theory ). So i think they tour and unfortunatly stop at album 5.
__________________
If I'm on the toilet longer than 2 minutes I'm jerking off. - (jag)
toolhed46n2//support your loco bands
Bin Purpose: You are the real fluxerpretation, its true personification.
TOYKO!! R.I.P. The Alien Gus
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Im happy that this thread has differing opinions, yet there is no flaming. Thanks.
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05-06-2006, 08:54 PM
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#69
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Banned.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: revelation
Posts: 10,298
Bincount™: 9070
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Im happy that this thread has differing opinions, yet there is no flaming. Thanks.
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05-06-2006, 08:55 PM
After thought: I also remember hearing MJK will do something with APC again, So that totalally throws the time frame out of wack.
__________________
If I'm on the toilet longer than 2 minutes I'm jerking off. - (jag)
toolhed46n2//support your loco bands
Bin Purpose: You are the real fluxerpretation, its true personification.
TOYKO!! R.I.P. The Alien Gus
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05-06-2006, 08:55 PM
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#70
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Member Of The Bored (tdn $upporter)
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: lolapolis™
Posts: 5,058
Bincount™: 11897
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
After thought: I also remember hearing MJK will do something with APC again, So that totalally throws the time frame out of wack.
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05-06-2006, 08:56 PM
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Originally Posted by imatoolhed
After thought: I also remember hearing MJK will do something with APC again, So that totalally throws the time frame out of wack.
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Nope. APC is dead now.
Great posts, flux. I really enjoyed that... it definately helped knit this album together for me. I'm going to listen to it a few more times with what you said in mind...
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05-06-2006, 08:56 PM
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#71
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On Probation
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by imatoolhed
After thought: I also remember hearing MJK will do something with APC again, So that totalally throws the time frame out of wack.
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Nope. APC is dead now.
Great posts, flux. I really enjoyed that... it definately helped knit this album together for me. I'm going to listen to it a few more times with what you said in mind... |
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05-06-2006, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by paraflux
Im happy that this thread has differing opinions, yet there is no flaming. Thanks.
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It's the thread ... So thank you.
Even better the second time. :)
__________________
If I'm on the toilet longer than 2 minutes I'm jerking off. - (jag)
toolhed46n2//support your loco bands
Bin Purpose: You are the real fluxerpretation, its true personification.
TOYKO!! R.I.P. The Alien Gus
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05-06-2006, 08:57 PM
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#72
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Member Of The Bored (tdn $upporter)
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by paraflux
Im happy that this thread has differing opinions, yet there is no flaming. Thanks.
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It's the thread ... So thank you.
Even better the second time. :)
__________________
If I'm on the toilet longer than 2 minutes I'm jerking off. - (jag)
toolhed46n2//support your loco bands
Bin Purpose: You are the real fluxerpretation, its true personification.
TOYKO!! R.I.P. The Alien Gus
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Originally Posted by SubconsciousFeer
how can you not know all of the band members names? *scratches head* tool has been the only band ive ever bothered to learn all of their names, but i guess to each his own. does this mean you havent bought an album by them, because i cant picture someone who buys the cds and still doesnt know the band members names until the 5th album (yes im counting opiate as an album, sue me:-D).
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what can i say? no reason to admit such blasphemy on a tool message board if it weren't true. i'm not big on liner notes. the "thank yous" and all that. maybe that's why. i always saw them as faceless, i guess and was fine with that.
yes, i have all albums. don't listen to all of them equally.
i'm one of those radiohead nerds. and most radiohead nerds devote all online music time to radiohead and only radiohead. it's not something i'm proud of.
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05-06-2006, 08:58 PM
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#73
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Level 5 - Deep Thinker
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: USA
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
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Originally Posted by SubconsciousFeer
how can you not know all of the band members names? *scratches head* tool has been the only band ive ever bothered to learn all of their names, but i guess to each his own. does this mean you havent bought an album by them, because i cant picture someone who buys the cds and still doesnt know the band members names until the 5th album (yes im counting opiate as an album, sue me:-D).
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what can i say? no reason to admit such blasphemy on a tool message board if it weren't true. i'm not big on liner notes. the "thank yous" and all that. maybe that's why. i always saw them as faceless, i guess and was fine with that.
yes, i have all albums. don't listen to all of them equally.
i'm one of those radiohead nerds. and most radiohead nerds devote all online music time to radiohead and only radiohead. it's not something i'm proud of. |
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05-06-2006, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by imatoolhed
Very good theory, 99% correct (imo). Except for the not touring part. Name me a world known band such as tool, That has'nt toured after an album release.
Also how will they hold up (time/age). That will put maynrd around 47-50 years old by the time they tour for album six ( your theory ). So i think they tour and unfortunatly stop at album 5.
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I hear what you're saying, but APC is dunzo. That, and I dont know what you guys think, but lately in "celebrity culture" 50 seems like the new 35. I think skill increases with age, wisdom, and discipline for some people. The only people I would be concerned physically is Danny and Maynard, which ironically seem to be the 2 people more dealing in "the sacred arts" Perhaps that alone could keep them going.
Plus, look at all the people jerking off over Alex Grey, who happens to be a geezer AND only getting better. Speaking from experience, standing upright in the same place and making paintings like that is not an easy task on the body. Though I appreciate his work at arm's length at best, he is looking physically fit, appearing mentally tight, and generating larger pieces each year. Kudos to him.
There's no reason in my mind as the band gets older and individually near closer to the end of their own mortality, the representation of this divide will get more and more magical and intense.
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05-06-2006, 09:15 PM
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#74
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Level 7 - Loquacious
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: places
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by imatoolhed
Very good theory, 99% correct (imo). Except for the not touring part. Name me a world known band such as tool, That has'nt toured after an album release.
Also how will they hold up (time/age). That will put maynrd around 47-50 years old by the time they tour for album six ( your theory ). So i think they tour and unfortunatly stop at album 5.
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I hear what you're saying, but APC is dunzo. That, and I dont know what you guys think, but lately in "celebrity culture" 50 seems like the new 35. I think skill increases with age, wisdom, and discipline for some people. The only people I would be concerned physically is Danny and Maynard, which ironically seem to be the 2 people more dealing in "the sacred arts" Perhaps that alone could keep them going.
Plus, look at all the people jerking off over Alex Grey, who happens to be a geezer AND only getting better. Speaking from experience, standing upright in the same place and making paintings like that is not an easy task on the body. Though I appreciate his work at arm's length at best, he is looking physically fit, appearing mentally tight, and generating larger pieces each year. Kudos to him.
There's no reason in my mind as the band gets older and individually near closer to the end of their own mortality, the representation of this divide will get more and more magical and intense. |
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05-06-2006, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by semoshocker
Wow, I think that is some serious over analyzation. This album is devoid of all the mystery and deep meaning that surrounds tool, its the easiest to analyize. Its tool wearing their feelings on their sleeves instead of hiding them in cryptic lyrics. I would also like to add that re-hashed guitar riffs are re-hashed guitar riffs, there is no way to spin meaning out of using the same riffs over and over. That said, I personally like this album, and as a musician disagree with the amount of rehashed riffs, I think most people are blowing that out of proportion. I do however agree that the overall feeling of this album is greif and sadness. Also, one question, who are tool to lead us anywhere? Last time I checked thay are regular ass people just like the rest of us, but with very self righteous attitudes. Tool is a beautifully artistic band that makes epic music at a time where that type of thing is hard to find. They are not a spiritual movement and hardly examples of how to live your life. Who are they to point their fingers, or tell us anything, they must be high.
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Amen.
__________________
Let us now, as Futurists, enter one of these hospitals for anaemic sounds. There: the first bar brings the boredom of familiarity to your ear and anticipates the boredom of the bar to follow. Let us relish, from bar to bar, two or three varieties of genuine boredom, waiting all the while for the extraordinary sensation that never comes.
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05-06-2006, 09:17 PM
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#75
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If nothing is everything I've got it all (tdn $upporter)
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Houston, TX
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
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Originally Posted by semoshocker
Wow, I think that is some serious over analyzation. This album is devoid of all the mystery and deep meaning that surrounds tool, its the easiest to analyize. Its tool wearing their feelings on their sleeves instead of hiding them in cryptic lyrics. I would also like to add that re-hashed guitar riffs are re-hashed guitar riffs, there is no way to spin meaning out of using the same riffs over and over. That said, I personally like this album, and as a musician disagree with the amount of rehashed riffs, I think most people are blowing that out of proportion. I do however agree that the overall feeling of this album is greif and sadness. Also, one question, who are tool to lead us anywhere? Last time I checked thay are regular ass people just like the rest of us, but with very self righteous attitudes. Tool is a beautifully artistic band that makes epic music at a time where that type of thing is hard to find. They are not a spiritual movement and hardly examples of how to live your life. Who are they to point their fingers, or tell us anything, they must be high.
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Amen.
__________________
Let us now, as Futurists, enter one of these hospitals for anaemic sounds. There: the first bar brings the boredom of familiarity to your ear and anticipates the boredom of the bar to follow. Let us relish, from bar to bar, two or three varieties of genuine boredom, waiting all the while for the extraordinary sensation that never comes.
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I forgot
my pen
to do something when I posted this. This thread is dedicated to searchforme.
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05-06-2006, 09:23 PM
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#76
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Banned.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: revelation
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
I forgot
my pen
to do something when I posted this. This thread is dedicated to searchforme. |
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05-06-2006, 09:24 PM
Very insightful.
I'm off to listen to the album with these thoughts in mind. I have a few things to add, but they are just vague ideas that need grounding.
Good work flux.
PS this is one of the coolest threads I've seen on tdn in awhile.
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What you are, you are by accident of birth; what I am, I am by myself. There are and will be a thousand princes; there is only one Beethoven.
-Ludwig van Beethoven
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05-06-2006, 09:24 PM
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#77
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Level 10 - Vehement
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Very insightful.
I'm off to listen to the album with these thoughts in mind. I have a few things to add, but they are just vague ideas that need grounding.
Good work flux.
PS this is one of the coolest threads I've seen on tdn in awhile.
__________________
What you are, you are by accident of birth; what I am, I am by myself. There are and will be a thousand princes; there is only one Beethoven.
-Ludwig van Beethoven
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05-06-2006, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by paraflux
How many times have we heard the weariness in their song, releasing the burden of never really being grasped by the mass majority of listeners? The Patient. Over Now on Mer de Noms. The pointed bitter sarcasm. How many times can you repeat yourself in different ways to infant-like souls before you realize that you aren’t getting through to most of them? What we are missing, guys, is being pushed. We have all felt it. I mean, Opiate was my first record, so I have seen the progressional concept from the band in all of it’s fascinating history. Opiate gathered the angry. Undertow took the anger and pushed and molded the anger into some sort of plan. Ænima pushed us to understand what was available to us. Lateralus pushed us to see why we should take it, showing us ethereal soundscapes depicting our potentials, all laid out for us in it’s epic glory. How long do we need to be pushed before we do it on our own? How fucking long? As responsible sentient beings, do they keep pushing us and feeding us? If they did that, they would be leading us. And that’s not how it works. That’s no different than any cult or sect of religious fanaticism. They don’t want to be your Christ. They don’t want fanatic followers who follow just as blindly as any hardline religion. The euphemism “think for yourself” is mocked often, because it’s so cliché’d now, since every 12 year old who saw Tool on that tour where that Leary quote preceded Third Eye has it in their signature. But it’s really a point they want to drive home. Do it for yourself, guys, because it’s time. And that’s what makes this album so scary to me. I’m facing fears here that I haven’t faced in a while. This album’s passive-ness made me not be able to sleep last night. We aren’t being pushed, driven, because it’s up to us and we cant keep being fed because the time is coming where if we cant do it on our own, we’ll see ourselves on the wrong side of the gap. We’re junkies for the kind of inspiration and push that Tool provides us with. Do they mind doing it? Of course not, but as I said, as responsible sentient beings, they cant keep feeding the junkies or the junkies will not progress. They wont always be able to show us the next door through, and we will have to be able to find them on our own.
Try to listen to this album next time in that light. See if you don’t feel yourself craving being driven, having inspiration exploding through your brain at all times. Then wonder if I could be correct. See if your hostility towards them using parts of music they have used in the past is misguided. See if you can accept it as them simply pointing to things they have already told us, and take it as a mockery of us not being able to get it the first time.
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I was going to read this whole thread, but this particular post intrigued me. I haven't had time to repeatedly listen to it lately, due to school, but I think I will absorb it before I return to this thread. So far, very thought provoking and I hope to return to it afterwards.
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nvm
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05-06-2006, 09:30 PM
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#78
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Level 9 - Obstreperous
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: SCAMBAG
Posts: 1,670
Bincount™: 2158
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by paraflux
How many times have we heard the weariness in their song, releasing the burden of never really being grasped by the mass majority of listeners? The Patient. Over Now on Mer de Noms. The pointed bitter sarcasm. How many times can you repeat yourself in different ways to infant-like souls before you realize that you aren’t getting through to most of them? What we are missing, guys, is being pushed. We have all felt it. I mean, Opiate was my first record, so I have seen the progressional concept from the band in all of it’s fascinating history. Opiate gathered the angry. Undertow took the anger and pushed and molded the anger into some sort of plan. Ænima pushed us to understand what was available to us. Lateralus pushed us to see why we should take it, showing us ethereal soundscapes depicting our potentials, all laid out for us in it’s epic glory. How long do we need to be pushed before we do it on our own? How fucking long? As responsible sentient beings, do they keep pushing us and feeding us? If they did that, they would be leading us. And that’s not how it works. That’s no different than any cult or sect of religious fanaticism. They don’t want to be your Christ. They don’t want fanatic followers who follow just as blindly as any hardline religion. The euphemism “think for yourself” is mocked often, because it’s so cliché’d now, since every 12 year old who saw Tool on that tour where that Leary quote preceded Third Eye has it in their signature. But it’s really a point they want to drive home. Do it for yourself, guys, because it’s time. And that’s what makes this album so scary to me. I’m facing fears here that I haven’t faced in a while. This album’s passive-ness made me not be able to sleep last night. We aren’t being pushed, driven, because it’s up to us and we cant keep being fed because the time is coming where if we cant do it on our own, we’ll see ourselves on the wrong side of the gap. We’re junkies for the kind of inspiration and push that Tool provides us with. Do they mind doing it? Of course not, but as I said, as responsible sentient beings, they cant keep feeding the junkies or the junkies will not progress. They wont always be able to show us the next door through, and we will have to be able to find them on our own.
Try to listen to this album next time in that light. See if you don’t feel yourself craving being driven, having inspiration exploding through your brain at all times. Then wonder if I could be correct. See if your hostility towards them using parts of music they have used in the past is misguided. See if you can accept it as them simply pointing to things they have already told us, and take it as a mockery of us not being able to get it the first time.
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I was going to read this whole thread, but this particular post intrigued me. I haven't had time to repeatedly listen to it lately, due to school, but I think I will absorb it before I return to this thread. So far, very thought provoking and I hope to return to it afterwards.
__________________
nvm
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05-06-2006, 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by gl0tch
Where we see these themes:
Undertow - Pain can manifest Potential.
Ænima- Potential can manifest Plans.
Lateralus- A Plan can manifest Change.
10,000 Days- Then, a decision must be made.
Album 5- Choose against and Consequence 'A' will be negative.
Album 6- Choose for and Consequence 'B' will be positive.
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hmm it seems like people are too quick to dismiss opiate's place in lists such like this. i was thinking that though it is very different from the other albums, it plays a role in the subject of themes. throughout the album, theirs a lot of references to things that oppress, control and try to dictate peoples lives, such as religion, the FCC, laws, etc. I mean look at lyrics from the song.
In sweat, "the sun is burning hot again" and, which is holding back the fisherman/thinker, making him dizzy as "he's trying to remember when."
in Hush, of course its about how the FCC regulates and controls the airwaves, so "I can't say what I want to, even if I'm not serious." The song also talks about how people want to regulate everything too. Parents, for example, dont want their children to be subjected to 'harmful things,' so "People tell me what to say, what to think, and what to play."
Part of Me takes the role of someone who controls, as he tells a person that: "You don't judge. You can't speak. You can't leave. You can't hurt me. You're just here for me to use."
In cold and ugly, we have a woman who is controlled by fear, which keeps her from feeling or being able to be connect with people. she is "rembling at the thought of feeling, Wide awake and keeping distance"
In Jerk-Off, we have the government or religion telling us "that there's a right and wrong, and that punishment would come to those who dare to cross the line" and "that Consequences dictate our course of action," and thus we are manupulated further by these things which hang in the back of our heads.
and of course we have Opiate, which pretty much sums up and repressents this whole idea of losing self control. "what you need is someone strong to use you," "Don't judge or question", "Just do everything I tell you to do," "Deaf and blind and dumb and born to follow;" the lyrics pretty much speak for themselves
so i think that if we are to follow this idea of each album representing a chronological theme, it should be that:
Opiate - oppression/manipulation can manifest pain
__________________
Think. Digest. Reflect.
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05-06-2006, 09:31 PM
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#79
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Level 5 - Deep Thinker
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sacramento, CA
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gl0tch
Where we see these themes:
Undertow - Pain can manifest Potential.
Ænima- Potential can manifest Plans.
Lateralus- A Plan can manifest Change.
10,000 Days- Then, a decision must be made.
Album 5- Choose against and Consequence 'A' will be negative.
Album 6- Choose for and Consequence 'B' will be positive.
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hmm it seems like people are too quick to dismiss opiate's place in lists such like this. i was thinking that though it is very different from the other albums, it plays a role in the subject of themes. throughout the album, theirs a lot of references to things that oppress, control and try to dictate peoples lives, such as religion, the FCC, laws, etc. I mean look at lyrics from the song.
In sweat, "the sun is burning hot again" and, which is holding back the fisherman/thinker, making him dizzy as "he's trying to remember when."
in Hush, of course its about how the FCC regulates and controls the airwaves, so "I can't say what I want to, even if I'm not serious." The song also talks about how people want to regulate everything too. Parents, for example, dont want their children to be subjected to 'harmful things,' so "People tell me what to say, what to think, and what to play."
Part of Me takes the role of someone who controls, as he tells a person that: "You don't judge. You can't speak. You can't leave. You can't hurt me. You're just here for me to use."
In cold and ugly, we have a woman who is controlled by fear, which keeps her from feeling or being able to be connect with people. she is "rembling at the thought of feeling, Wide awake and keeping distance"
In Jerk-Off, we have the government or religion telling us "that there's a right and wrong, and that punishment would come to those who dare to cross the line" and "that Consequences dictate our course of action," and thus we are manupulated further by these things which hang in the back of our heads.
and of course we have Opiate, which pretty much sums up and repressents this whole idea of losing self control. "what you need is someone strong to use you," "Don't judge or question", "Just do everything I tell you to do," "Deaf and blind and dumb and born to follow;" the lyrics pretty much speak for themselves
so i think that if we are to follow this idea of each album representing a chronological theme, it should be that:
Opiate - oppression/manipulation can manifest pain
__________________
Think. Digest. Reflect.
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05-06-2006, 09:32 PM
RIP searchforme.
Always sad.
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05-06-2006, 09:32 PM
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#80
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Level 7 - Loquacious
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: places
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Re: The fluxerpretation of 10,000 Days
RIP searchforme.
Always sad.
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