I cant believe I didnt think of it myself!! I think you are 100% right. In eulogy, "Whats singing songs is a snake, IT IS" for example, in many mythologies snake often guards the entrance to a cave or a pool of water. This water is a common metaphor for truth or wisdom. According to Jung, this pool of water is the collective unconscious, and the snake is the shadow, or the parts of ourselves that are animalistic, that again according to Jung, are the parts of ourselves we should strive to do away with!
You are right on the money with the lyric inconsistencies too! I have heard these lyrics as well, or thought the lyrics on TDN are wrong.
I agree that maynard very likely is a construct of the band. What Im not sure about are the implications of this, maybe the Maynard idea is just something to sing about. Maybe the maynard construct is metaphor for jung's shadow, and just another way for the band to call for spiritual evolution, and maynard is the "Tool" they are using. But I dont agree that if the fans see this, that the band will change or something that you were eluding too fifth. Maybe "Maynard" is just a focus for the spotlights, to draw attention off all of them so no one has to feel left out of the fame. After all, who is the one always dressing and acting crazy on stage, while the rest of the band calmly plays, MAYNARD! The enigmatic, eccentric nut, while the rest of band are calm and reserved, and modest.
And to the rest of you that so harshly dissed this idea, how about a little tact? At least hear the man out and say I agree or I dont, some of those posts got pretty nasty.
I registered just now only because reading all this self-righteous posting made me angry. The following is my (brief) opinion, and after this I shall never post on this board again. So...
1) someone said something like this, "the next person who says 'think for yourself' is gonna make me want to kill something."
Personally, I have to agree. But I will add that the ppl who repeat this quote are not only ANNOYING, but downright ignorant. I don't care what the divine FAQ says, that quote is NOT by Tool nor their 'central message'. It is rightly attributed to Timothy Leary, who incidentally is the guy reading it out at the beginning of Third Eye on Salival. SO SHUT UP WITH IT FFS!
and on that note....
2) I have been humbled and learned the hard way that most ppl do not and can not understand tool. So I say to you all (except the few to whom this does not apply): LISTEN TO TOOL WHEN YOU ARE OFF YOUR TREE ON ACID!!!
By the time Maynard (yes I'm calling him MAYNARD!) has finished his blood-curdling scream on The Grudge you will realise how much of a TOOL you really have been all your life.
OK has anyone else noticed the trend that follows in just about every topic in the opinion section?...If for some uncanny reason you haven't, here's how it goes:
1) Topic Posted
2) People discuss topic
3) People find flaws in other peoples posts (ie punctuation, interpretations, layout etc)
4) People start bitching about each other
5) The intellectual battle begins
6) It continues
7) see above
8) People get bored
9) People move to another topic
but then again maybe i'm just 'over-analysing'...which by the way 'seperates the body from the mind'.....dammit some of you quote lyrics until they turn into meaning-less cliches....
OK I'm done.
__________________ He who devotes his whole mind to doing nothing, will have everything done for him.
1. All you people that have criticized Fifth for an idea, an opinion, something the majority of you think you deserve to show, but from i have seen you dont and your aggression towards Fifth is childish and unecessary. His opinion has a point based on what he believes in and the rest of you are taking a stand on what you believe in. the fact of the matter is that we really don't as much as we think and everybody on this post needs to calm down and take a good look at what fifth is trying to say
now that i got that out i will move on.
i agree with fifth in that Maynard is just a persona, a way to look at the reactions of others and get a good laugh at the over-imaginative masses expense. Just a way of being inside on the outside so to speak. the persona is a sheid from the ignorant and james is a sancturary to those who open thier minds to what can be made out of the human mind and is the hope that Fifth speaks of, the hope for mankind. i think alot of tool is just simply realizing potential and using it.
If we get the name of their band, Tool, and we say that constanants represent female and vowels represent male. we get the males next to one another. therefore, with out a doubt Maynard is a flaming homosexual. Do you want more evidence? Their choice of letters can be arranged into an abstract penis shape.
I'm not entirely sure if Cracker was being fecitious (sp?) or what... all I know is that Maynard has a son named Devo.
Originally posted by Metatron's Cube I cant believe I didnt think of it myself!! I think you are 100% right. In eulogy, "Whats singing songs is a snake, IT IS" for example, in many mythologies snake often guards the entrance to a cave or a pool of water.
Was a good insightful post, but I believe the song you're talking about is h. S'okay though, I understand that sometimes ppl just are blazing with an opinion and just gotta get it down and oh god just can't wait and then post and... whups! typo ;)
(not as bad as when a reporter in my area reported one of the songs at their concert the night before to be "4 seconds" ARRRRRRRGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!)
[QUOTE]Originally posted by verisimilitude
[B]you're all a bunch of fucking idiots
I see.
It did say at the start of this opinion section that these are your own views, now i dont share Fifths views but can you please either criticise with a civil tongue in your head, or wind your bloody neck in, people actually read these things and dont wish to read your swearing about what you think of someone else.
__________________ 'Open your Eyes, Open your mouths, Close your hand and make a fist'
How on Earth can you people criticize fifth's opinion???
I like that idea honestly, and I think he's brilliant for soming up with that. It makes perfect sense as well. Don't get mad at him for coming up with a better idea than what you have.
Oh, and about the "think for yourself" quote.. Yes its a great quote, and yes its over used.. but look.. this is what pisses me off..
Everytime some DOES think for his or herself that person gets SHOT DOWN!
Take fifth for example.... poor guy... I have sympathy for you.
While I'm here I want to say what the Tool Enigma isn't and where I'm coming from with it....
1. Maynard represents the wall people put in front of them to stop people connecting with others, James being the true person.
2. The members of tool arn't anything but normal people creating art with a message. Look at it like that and even at that level you can see as an artistic venture what they have done would be worth doing.
3. This Enigma runs along side what tool have been doing, there music is multi-meaning and holds diffirent meaning to each of us, the enigma being true doesn't change that, its an underlining base.
4. tool where great Bill Hicks fans, to see why they would have a kinda "test" in there works, why they would bother with all this go download and listen to a Bill Hicks show.
5. I agree you can find patterns in things but that is not how this presented itself to me and the others in my town, it came to us, not us to it and this happened over many months.
I think that covers it, I'll edit this post if I can think of anything else to add.
I'm not going to be around so much, I'm in training at the moment to become an instructor in G-K-R Karate and I also have my band, so my free time has dwindled. Theres more then enough here to show what the enigma is about so that doesn't really matter anyway.
Thanks to everyone whos posted up in this forum whatever your views, for or against this theory like I've said before, its all good.
Peace
Fifth
__________________ Knowledge is useless without application...
Location: Adrian, MI (North of Ohio/South of Heaven)
Posts: 538
Bincount™: 8
Re: Msynard Splits?
interesting thoughts on lyric differences but didn't maynard actually write in the lyrics at one point to a (this?) website........maybe im mistaken, i thought i read that somewhere
i can surely see where some of those connections could be made, but i really find it hard to believe that all of the examples fifth gave relate entirely and revolve around maynard. while of course this is just my opinion, it seems like the music indicates that its about much more than the members producing it. while it might relate to something that occured in his life, more importantly its supposed to relate to us all. isnt that the greatest thing about tool? just from a few powerful notes and well-chosen words we all seem to recall an event or emotion?
id also agree entirely that james is one side and maynard is another, but really arent any lead men of bands? how often do we, or do they want us, to see any further than whats projected through their voice and lyrics? "all you know about mes what i sold you". thats all we know.
