Take the best parts of 10000 Days, condense and distill it, filtering out all the filler, and what's left?

The Patient.

Hey, I've got an excellent idea.

Let's all just set our differences opinion aside and instead engage in a giant orgy of mutual fellatio! That way we can all mumble about how "Under a dead ohio sky" is the most meaningful phrase in our sad little lives, admittedly a little muffled by having a mouthfull of meat.

Seriously. Why the fuck would you come to a discussion forum on a band's new album if you're not capable of reading people's reasoned, justified opinions on why they are not enjoying it? I think you're maybe in the wrong meeting, my friend. The orgy is next door over in the lyric analysis threads...

Your error is calling the opinions reasoned and justified. They are neither. Thus, they deserve no worthwhile discussion.

I'm glad you found a way to work multiple fellatio references into one post, though. I was thinking it couldn't be done. But you have valiantly proved me wrong.

Agreed

You're a funny guy. You do a great spoof of the cliched "wanker Tool fan". But seriously, can we have a proper conversation?

Naturally any discussion of music is going to involve a degree of subjectivity. I explained my subjective feelings as a result of listening to the album, my initial position before listening to it and the reasons why I feel, subjectively, that this album is an utter turd.

I like the way that instead of playing EITHER the man or the ball you've instead actually just decided to play the "I'm the ref!" card instead. Funny stuff.

If this would have been another Lateralus, Aenima, Undertow or Opiate I would have been highly dissapointed.

Our belowed host wrote in his review "This is not what you expected but exactly what you wanted". Can't say it better myself.

COMING 2006 - Bilbornan

Tools best album!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
10,000 Days rocks my freakin` balls off.

Please reattach the aforementioned items. Thank you.

Bilbo R. Nan, the story of a young hobbit and his familial obsession with Indian breads... I'm looking forward to it already!

Post something thought-provoking, rather than the same old re-hashed ad nauseum "nothing on this album is innovative or original because I said so", and you might find me and some people "playing the ball". Until then, quit bitching.

Also, a conscious effort by you to not include so much god awful rhetoric in your posts would go a long way...

After being a HUGE Undertow fan while it was the only LP out, ... AENEMA did NOT sound like Tool to me AT ALL when it first came out.

you'll adjust.


.

THANK YOU!

and undertow wasnt as raw and rip your face off shit down your throat as opiate.

when i first heard sober...

i thought... FUCK theyve sold out.

till i adjusted.

now i dont do what all the idiots do everytime TOOL brings out something new.

ive evolved, opened my 3rd eye and excepted the beauty of a 46+2 chromazome evolution.

jump on in kids.

the waters great!

How on earth do you prove a negative? If I still had the album I could, for example, prove positive that there are numerous re-uses of riffs from prior Tool albums with only minor modifications. But I think that's already been covered fairly extensively, albeit with a very poor signal-to-noise ratio because of all the "Shut up, go listen to Green Day" posts interspersed around every possible attempt at analysis. Great examples would be the very minor modifications to riffs from H and Third Eye in Rosetta Stoned, or the constant re-use of that syncopated floor-tom-vs-guitar-and-bass trick from the end of 46&2 all over the whole album.

But I don't think it's possible to prove that there is nothing original on the album without, for example, reference to the entire world of music. Which is a bit unreasonable for both me and any readers attempting to follow.

What I am doing is stating my opinion. I'm a reasonably informed music listener - you can take my word for that or you can try a conversation on the topic - and my feeling is that when I listen to this all I am hearing is the same old Tool stuff over and over again with nothing but diminishing returns. If somebody would like to point to a non-nebulous feature of the album beyond that marvellous Peter Frampton solo on Jambi (and Justin's wicked new bass playing everywhere) that is actually new then I might even borrow it again so that I can stand corrected.

It seems like nebulous, asserted opinions are fine by you as long as they are, say, "Wings for Marie is the most beautiful song ever written by Tool". But when they're something like "10,000 days is made up of more recycled material than new" then somehow I'm a monumental idiot?

sounds like you have a good understanding of where you are with that last bit.

there are hints to things like 46&2 in right in 2 yes... but do you seriously not get it?

do you know what 46&2 is about.

im betting NO.

nevermind, why do i even waist my time?

Which proves my point.

The greatness to filler ratio is becoming exponentionally worse.

I've "know" idea why you "waist" your time on such arguments when you could instead be dedicating it to remedial English classes.

Trust me, I can play the "46&2 is about chromosome counts and the next stage of human evolution, Right In Two is about the rather unevolved nature of human behavior" interpreting game too. Or talk at great length on the Carlos Casteneda references in Third Eye. But really folks, we do need to remember we're talking about radio-friendly alt-prog-metal here. Some perspective might be in order.

Here's the thing, if the best stab at meaning you can manage to communicate is by means of reference to your earlier songs... well, that really just places to you on the same hightened plane as Dream Theater's "Metropolis Part 2: Scenes from a memory", doesn't it? Isn't saying "Well, we'd cover this topic again but we already did it better on this other song, so we'll play you a bit for a second" a bit of a cop-out?

And beyond that, I was actually referencing a particular little tension/release trick that Tool do *everywhere* and have done so increasingly on every album since Aenima. Just from memory I'm quite certain I heard it on Vicarious and Rosetta Stoned, but it's probably on every song if I went to look.

Oh, and how much were you betting again?

Hum...I agree with Tuzi on 2 facts :
1/ I don't understand why thinking that 10.000 days is not so good turns yourself in an idiot...I perfectly stand persons who find that this album is a masterpiece and I don't feel like insulting them...
2/ The re-use of riffs of the ancients albums in 10.000 days are OBVIOUS !!!! Just listen to all TOOL's albums and EP then listen to 10.000 days and it will jump to your ears !!!! So , coming from TOOL is REALLY disapointing.....

Sorry.
In some strange way they are not a "Part of me" anymore.
Them suckers will be missed.

Just keep listening to the album... you'll hear them eventually becaus they are definitely there!

I've been listening to it all day and I love it. Show of hands for every one that likes the new album!!!

For some reason people have a preconceived idea of what Tool should or should not sound like. Please open your minds, this is a Tool album afterall, I think that means Tool is Tool therefore this is a Tool sound. This is good music, just sit back and enjoy it, stop hypothesizing and coming up with the unexplainable. If you realy don't like this album that much, just stop posting here and go listen to something else.

MY first post here, I wasnt aware there was a good tool forum anywhere. So that said, Hello everyone. My opinion is that no matter what a band does, someone is always there to complain. Everytime a monster like Tool releases a new cd, they go under fire. I think the same people would be complaining even if 10000 days was Lateralus part 2. But thats my two cents. I love the new cd. And I think its 100% TOOL.

I agree. its called evolving. And while yes, there are moments that it sounds like others, but the same can be said about Lateralus, and Aenima. It's still the same four guys. I'm glad its further from Lateralus. But its all in opinion.

Well said. Tool is Tool, they know themselves better than we do, so how about we all STFU.

And I agree, it's RIDICULOUS how the biggest complaints are "sounds too much like old Tool" and "doesn't sound like Tool". Completely contradictory opinions, which just goes to show that none of us is "in the right".

Personally, I DO think the drums and vocals could be a bit louder, and the guitar a bit quieter, so I'm willing to say the new producer might not be as good as the old. I don't know where this album will stand compared to the other ones, but it's definitely pretty awesome. Especially Jambi, Vicarious, and Rosetta Stoned (so far).

I'm in full agreement with Tuzi. Aenima had me wanting more after the first listen, even after I skipped over the weird stuff at the end. Lateralus had me grinning and pumped with goosebumps after the first two minutes of the Grudge. This effort is a huge disappointment after countless playbacks of 13th step and the last two TOOL discs over the last 5 years. Hearing Vicarious on the radio had me salivating, but not with unrealistic expectations. I went into this thing open minded and came away completely let down...like when I listened to the last APC disc Emotive.

I would say this album doesn't sound like Tool BECAUSE Tool doesn't have the habit to recycle his old riffs to create new stuff....so yes it doesn't sound like Tool because it sounds too much like old Tool !!! Nothing paradoxal in this, it's what the main part of people who explains ( and not necessaraly COMPLAIN...) their disapointment say.....

I found them - http://toolnavy.com/showthread.php?t=45788 - but they are lacking.

You're spending an aweful lot of time discussing(rather, arguing helplessly) about an album that you hate.

Take a step back and go do something that matters for a while and stop trying to bring everyone down. If you don't like it, go spend time doing something fun, like masturbating and leave people alone.

*APPLAUSE*

You eiter like it, or you don't. Wait another 5 years and bitch about the next one will ya?

i am always surprised by the amount of time
and energy that the haters of 10,000 days
exude...when is everyone going to get it..regardless of
what you spew...love or hate for it..in the end it doesn't
matter because if you really care about the music
the artistic merit, you will listen to it for yourself
and come to conclusions on your own. no one will do it
for you. dont be a lazy listener. this band deserves so much
more.

Okay, what do we have today? 4th of May? Good! And two days afterwards people ("tool-fans") are judging their favorite artists as if they'd talk about a Britney Spears record. Very interesting ...

... I had the possibility to buy this precious piece of music on the 28th of April already and had about a bit the same feelings in the beginning as these "hate-posters". But I knew, that if any album ever grows, then it's a Tool-Record. Damn it! I think you all should know that since you're here.

And what can I say ... after 30 intense listenings it definitely grows. It's indeed less spheric than Lateralus was and the lyrics concern more wordly issues. But they are deep enough to think about, too, they're different. The atmosphere of the album is different. But once I had accepted these changes and took the music as it is I liked it more and more with each listening.

For example: I was disappointed about this obviously drug-related, 11 Minute, without-many-climaxes-song called "Rosetta Stoned". But now that I just listened to it many times wihout too much thinking about it and without having high expectation of finding anything exceptional, I realised for myself that the way Maynard sings it seems a lot ironic and sarcastic, a bit like in "The Gaping Lotus Experience". Plus: the very complex song structure of "Rosetta Stoned" begins to enfold and no: You can't grasp that within the first 20 listenings in two days. Even now I don't know it entirely, how could I? It's just that we all have still a lot of more time to listen to it and it will surely get better and better if you give it a chance to be good. Without too much thinking in the first place but an aware listening of the typical soft/hard, incredibly beautiful Tool-Sounds it'll grow. Each time Tool gives us about 5-6 years to get it ...

But anyway it's in a way good to hear that people really seem to dislike the album. The thing is just that the time for such long "hate-statements" has not come yet. And in the end they just offend people that like it, maybe even the Band itself, if they read some of the stuff here. If I were them I wouldn't. But just the imagination, that 2 days after the release people seem to know better and judge your album that you've worked on for years in such a way doesn't seem too nice.

Seems like I have to put an AMEN at the end now although I didn''t intend to sound like this. Anyway ... it'll grow, I'm sure ;)

Maynard is singing ironicly in almost all TOOL' songs !!! Do you think a serious guy could really love and play in Bikini bandits !!!??? TOOL' s songs are full of Anger ( not hate , just anger) or full of irony ( they put some sadness and melancholy in it too for 10.000 days and that's new according to me)....hum....what's the point of this post ??? I don't know...lol

Hum....it's not because 5 years passed before lateralus and 10.000 days that the guy worked on it 5 years !!! Danny said they stayed 5 months in studio...not 5 years....thanx god for them !!!! 5 years in a studio.... I just don't even imagine the smell !!! :p

So in other words, lower your expections, lower your standards?

that's how i feel as well. evolution, not revolution.

yes it does!

No it doesn't.

Go listen to Ticks and Leeches right now, you will HEAR TooL, the perfect mixing, the legendary Danny, the intensity, the Maynard, the emotional rollercoaster, the production, the adam-in-the-background-where-he-fucking-belongs, the greatness that makes 10000 Days sound like a collection of rejections

No, that's not what I meant ... I just think that if you hear without too much prejudgement you might begin to like the music by itself. At the moment it perhaps is like you put on the 10,000 Days and you think: "Nooo, that's something I know already, that's not Tool, too low voices etc." You're not listening and feeling then. You're thinking without listening!

If you afterwards dislike it anyway ... well, then it's the way it is.

By the way I have to admit that the Lateralus stays the better one (until now). But 10,000 Days is just very good. Can't see anything better around except Tools old records. Alors?? ... new Tool Songs. Great!