1. the music of the leak sounds like there is some work behind it. not just like a bunch of songs done half-heartedly. for example, the lyrics again fit with the music by 100%, even with the oddest time signature changes. although i think maynard is good at what he does, i don't think he can pull off the lyrics for the leaked album along while working on some "real" deal. so, it think it would just be to much work to do one album for a leak thats as good as the leak thats floating around and also work on some "real stuff".

2. if they really did the leaked album as a decoy have some "real stuff" in backup, then why would they put so much work into the leaked thing? i mean, how many people will download the leak until the may 2.? it's us tool-nerds, waiting in internet for every little newsbit that comes up over the last years. and we are a little percentage of the more than 100.000 buyers of the new album. so why put so much work into something that only a very little audience will hear? that is contradictory. we, as the little percentage of downloaders, are not important.

3. and if they would really do two albums then there would always be the possibility that people would like the leak better than the "real stuff". again contradictory.

Ever thought that they might be mocking there fans as they often do?
Rev, you are assuming that TOOL are not mocking the fans.
Either that or Maynard found god *sigh* its reminiscent of the smashing pumpkin's machina... some good songs but on the whole it sucked. I guess i just really want to believe that TOOL have not lost the plot altogether.

It's easier for me to believe that they spent some time on creating a mediocre(compared to their gems) album than believing that they would release this "trash". In interviews they oftem mention their discerning fans...well, this seems aimed at very undiscerning fans. Its all there on the surface.
The problem is that it all amounts to nothing.

sure, they mocking the fans, no doubt about that. but with a decoy album they would mock only us, the downloading, internet-lurking fans, which are only a little percentage of all of their fans. i just think that the cost-benefit calculation of this stunt just wouldn't work, neither commercial, nor artistically nor on any personal, sadistic level ;)

how come nobody has considered this: if there are fans out there that hate this "album" so much, then why arent there any negative reviews of it coming from published journalists (ones who were at the listening party)?

Porcupine Tree have been around longer than Tool and have a completely different sound. They have heavily influenced Opeth and their singer/songwriter (Steve Wilson) engineered/mixed 'Blackwater Park', 'Damnation' and 'Deliverance'.

Yes i know about steve wilson etc etc.



=) Just because they've been around longer than tool doesn't mean they don't aspire towards a sound that tool perfected in 1996

Porcupine tree are considered prog, as is tool...not my labels dont shoot me.

There was supposed to be a heavy meshuggah influence on the new album, i only see it on vicarious.

Who cares what published jouranlists have to say. Published journalists love Coldplay.
Maybe the "real" album was played at the listening parties :p

I toyed with this idea for awhile. Until I listened to JJJ and heard the same versions of Jambi and Pot. I think its time to assume this is a contractual obligation album and hope something better arrives soon.

I didn't hear any Meshuggah influence on Vicarious at all.

I take no stance against coldplay, but I remember when X&Y came out the album got horrid reviews.

I feel I am as OGT as I can be given my age. I am now 20 years old and have been with TOOL since the Sober video playing on latenight Box Music Channel. I didn't own my first album until Ænima though. Now, I have grown up with TOOL in my life for 10 years and I feel that these tracks while great, have let me down. I almost feel like being an ex-OGT. Although, I am too committed to my love affair with the music and the goodtimes I have had with TOOL to just give up. All-in-all, 10000 Days real or not; its nice just to know the boys are still in the studio. If this is the real deal I feel I can let this one sink in a bit more and wait for the next album before just jumping ship. I mean its not like I can see an Iceberg up ahead.

If Blair hadn't made references to a decoy album, none of this would have ever started.

Uh... what?

Porcupine Tree sound nothing like Tool. Nothing.

Porcupine Tree has a very varied sound. The lighter stuff doesn't do much for me. the heavier stuff (E.G. blackest eyes) sounds like Aenima era tool.


I am in love with the song "buying new soul" though. They played that acoustic at virgin megastore... it was gorgeous

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

Nothing alike.

You probably know more about them than i do. I'm pretty much just basing this on the one live show i saw. their guitar sound is much much cleaner than tools, which i disliked... the overall vibe was toolish though.

lolerscates

A lot of us thought of it before even remembering those newsletters. I don't have a very good memory.

I support all of your opinions!!

Again for the record I support carson's opinions!!

You said it. TX represent.

It's denial, cognitive dissonance, whatever you want to call it. This is people's way of placating themselves about the album that has disappointed them for a few weeks. It has absolutely NOTHING to do with "benefit of the doubt". It's all about people letting their judgment and reason become clouded by their emotions.

In their right minds, they all know it's real. Nobody thinking clearly could think this was fake or a hoax or not "all of it". But the mind does some very interesting things when it doesn't want to believe something.

Dear toolnavy,

Sorry if this has been covered before, I'm sure it probably has. Either that or it goes without saying.

But, the sense of hope found in the older songs or albums seems to be diminished a bit in this one.

Aenima was probably the perfect combination of anger and hope.
I think thats a big element of what made Tool appealing compared to all the other "angry" trash music made over the years.
This album doesn't cover the spectrum of emotions much. It just goes on the angry/sullen route with one funny song in Rosetta Stoned, then back to despair and the album ends.

I guess Jambi is the one semi-hopeful song.
I think thats another reason why it seems shorter than the older ones in addition to the fact that there arent many real songs on it. But I suppose this was all intended, as they've said. Come to think of it, Lateralus was sorta the same way only the opposite. all hope, very little anger


Another thing that ocurred to me: Since this album is supposed to be more of a personal/social commentary album than Lateralus, I keep comparing it to aenima and examining why aenima is my favorite album while this one doesnt do much for me.

Lyrically, in Aenima, there are a lot of questions in the lyrics. Seems like a lot of the songs include one question or rhetorical question in a pretty intense part of the song.

what's become of subtlety, would you die for me, what was it like to see.., what is this but my reflection, who am I to judge or.., why are you running away?


10,000 days has just a couple, which are easily answered or are answered for you in the song, or just not very interesting to me. "who are you to wave your finger, why did father give these monkeys)

I dunno, maybe this album just has less of everything.

Sincerely,
Spoiled by Aenima

well, if i remember correctly, maynard did say that he was tired of giving people a problem as well as some sort of answer (as in previous albums) because no one listened. so he says this one he's presenting you with the problem & you have to decide what to do.

just because you cant find the complexity doesnt mean it isnt there

amen

and have we already forgotten that 10,000 days and Ænima are 2 different albums...that a decade has passed since the latter was made

people change...band's included. you ask why there are less questions? perhaps the band has grown in such a way that they no longer feel the need to ask questions; but rather give answers.

10,000 days is a CD of answers.

Maybe answers is too strong, but rather it is a CD of insight. Not nessecarily answers, but mere observation.

Aenima isn't like 10,000days?! Really? I find that as most people grow they learn to reach an equilibrium with being such that they arn't living their life in anger and rage, but rather in a state of placid existance. They may not nessicarily agree with everything in the world, and they may actually make attempts to curb some of what they see wrong, but I think one of the greatest things a person can learn in their life is to learn how to not be suprised, to learn how to take things in stride. If you get worked up to the point of anger and rage, you've lost the calm collected mind that will be almost surely more tactful and successful at making change than a world class hissy fit. Learn from T00L's progression in thought. Over time, it occurs to you, that you are but one person and the amount of change you inspire in the world is not the result of anger, not the result of indignant rage, but is the result of inspiring those around you to be better people, happier people, more enlightened. This has been the path of the righteous man for over 4000 years. Those that are most influential in history, most admired for advancing humanity, are not those that attacked the world with guns a blazing, but those who observed and learned from those around them only to help them do the same.

</rant>

not quite sure how you got from ^ (sarcasm?)

to this ^, but i agree with you 100%

But they gave answers in opiate/undertow as well! They are alternating between growing up and regressing?
You speak as though they were 18 year olds during the writing of Aenima.
The idea that they've grown up and are now writing more "mature" songs just doesn't mesh too well with what I'm hearing on the album.


I'm fine with them moving in a new direction, its not like I'd like them to just regurgitating the same shit. They'll just be not as unique or original of a band to me with the simple straightfoward uninteresting lyrics and sounds, in much the was APC was less interesting than Tool to a lot of people.

i didnt mean to make it seem like they were teens when they wrote aenima...but i guarantee you they feel that they have experienced new things and learned and changed from and because of those expeirences.

im through trying to justify this album...some of you guys who arent into it are just a little shellshocked because you expected something and it wasnt what you got. i understand the feeling but youve got to give up this false sense of control you have over what tool does. itd be nice if they always did what we thought they SHOULD do with their music...but they stayed honest with this album, they progressed (whether you see it as progression or not), and they gave us provoking art once more.

ill check back with you guys in 3 months and ill probably be surprised at how many found the merit in 10k days that was there all along.

Not quite sure where to start with this, so I'll just jump right in...

I think if it feels like something's missing from 10,000 Days for you it's because you're not on the same page as Maynard yet. You're not done with Aenima and Lateralus. Maynard's very revealing and honest in his lyrics, so he's a rare instance in which you can trace his personal development and compare it with your own.

What else can be said other than the album lyrics are just a snapshot of where he's at at the time. If Aenima is full of questions it's because he was just coming out of the youthful anger of Undertow. Undertow is about pointing fingers outwards, a very divisive stance on the world. Aenima is starting to understand other people's perspectives. Reaching out rather than lashing out. The questions are the initials attempts at a deeper connection to and understanding of people. Lateralus is about the healing that's come from communication. It's like a rebirth with a new, wholistic view of the world.

10,000 strikes me as a Buddhist sort of album. It's one step beyond Lateralus' view of everything as being holy. It's basically a personal meditation on the cycle of life and death. It's lacking in questions because it's an album of acceptance. And the Buddhist notion of sadness over the fact that life is suffering. It makes no excuses for people, and it's quite honest about human nature, particularly the dark sides of it. I think it's about coming to conclusion that you are responsible for yourself and the path you choose. It's once again stating the mantra of think for yourself. He's looking at his mother as an ideal of someone that walked the mean path (mean as in balanced) and lived a life of altruism. The hope of the album centers around the example of his mother. That if one person who had been through so much personal struggle was still able to give of herself to help save someone else, maybe others can follow in her footsteps.

stellar third post. very insightful. i agree. these concepts and these ideas that come out in this album are just merely examples and stories to learn from. thats why we love this band. its not just a musical high, its a personal high, an intellectual high, an emotional high.

Well, I hear ya, it wouldnt be the first time an album has grown on me.
It's just that this is the first time I've been so down on anything Maynard has done, let alone Tool. It's not like aenima was very easy to soak in initially. I went like 2 years just hearing the singles on the radio and never thought to check out any of their CDs. But when I finally did I couldn't stop myself from wearing the CDs out.

Lateralus wasn't exactly what I was expecting either. And who was expecting Mer De Noms?
Both of those as well as Thirteenth Step sunk in pretty quickly. I didn't love them at first but I could tell right away that eventually I'd like them.

Seems with 10,000 Days, I dont know it's pretty hard to explain, I took it all in right away and there's no need to go back to listen more. But I do anyway, and haven't gotten anything more from it in the last 4-5 listens.
The songs are also really anti-climactic in my opinion.

I am a little disappointed that it lacks anal sex, but I'll keep digging 'till I find something!

and where is one... ONE mention about a hooker with a penis? HUH?

how bout a recipe read by a german guy?

huh?

WAIT WAIT WAIT....

you are mad because you DID like it right away?

holy shit on a fucking stick sideways up a dogs ass.

you people.

Strip the Soul

I love Porcupine Tree but I have to agree to an extent that the album In Absentia does have the tool ænima feel to it. their newer one does not at all however. its totally different and in my opinion a bit worse, but i still like it.

That's really not what I get from that song.
To me it's just an extension of Judith, with the same ideas, only without the angry tone. I don't think he really learned much between the time judith was written and 10k days.

Does anyone else see the slight sarcasm/anger with the "fetch me the father, the ghost, and the spirit, tell them their pillar of faith has ascended" line?
As much as I find the song boring I like the idea of the song.

I don't think he would enourage anyone to follow in her footsteps, as far as her unconditional faith in her organized religion goes.

I'm not sure what you're talking about.
Did I imply that I think there's no room for a humorous and sarcastic song?
That shit was excellent, but that album had those two songs in addition to all the other normal songs.