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Old 04-27-2006, 11:17 AM   #1
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Gnostic interpretation

I hope somebody has already asked about this.

I think this song weaves elements of Gnostic, Greco-Roman mythology, Jungian alchemy, Buddhism and basic literal interpretations. This is Tool at one of its finest moments.

My take on this is emanation theory related to Qabalistic and Gnostic concepts. I know many have commented on the Qabala parts.

This song defintely reminds me of the Grudge that the robotic Demiurge (aka the God of Abraham) has against humankind and the trancendental and unknowable God of which the Coptic texts speak. Humans have the capacity to trancend and know the non-dualistic God and thus the Abrahamic God envies this power. Since Saturn can be simultaneously equated to Kronos and the Demiurge, Keenan and the rythm in this song even ties in the cycle of Samsara into which the Demiurge was born. This could be a model of man as well who limits his knowledge by confining and defining, becoming the Demiurge at that moment.

Very cool song.
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Old 05-14-2006, 03:05 PM   #2
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Re: Gnostic interpretation

Your though is really cool. Have you ever think about the tree of life and the angels in there? I don't remember the names, but I've heard something about a coronation of one of them in the three of life. Though it was the center of the tree
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Old 06-18-2006, 12:34 PM   #3
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Re: Gnostic interpretation

I've always thought there was something MAJORLY wrong with all the organized religions. Their world views and their perceptions of GOD (whichever name they give their deity) are only meant as a control mechanism for their own self interests. I always believed that there was something much more out there that they were actively hiding and trying to destroy. I was fascinated by concepts of "other realities" I picked up from different sources, like the ancient practices of the Aboriginal people and the Hopi. From modern experiments with mind altering substances like DMT. And from science with things like string theory and quantum physics. And especially from my own world views and perception of God.

But I just couldn't put all the pieces together to make it coherent in my own mind. Then about a year ago I started learning about the Gnostics and the Gnostic traditions and it really put into words what I've felt all along. Since then I've been reading and listening to everything I can about Gnosticism.

I've been a fan of tools music for years, mostly because of the pure genius of their songs, musically and lyrically. But there was always some underlying feeling or message or thought to their music that I just couldn't put my finger on. But after becoming read about Gnosticism, tools music took on a whole new meaning for me. I'm convinced that Gnostic thought is at the root of tools artistic, spiritual message. After going back and "re-listening" to all their previous work I find that here are SO many references to Gnostic ideas and concepts in tools lyrics that I can't even begin to list them all. And then 10k days comes out. The first time I listened to it I was just blown away. This album is just dripping with Gnostic undertones and concepts.

I read the interview where MJK said <quote>One of the main purposes of the lyric content in Tool's songs involves a personal connection on a level in which people are on quests for self-identity, understanding and reflection.</quote> BINGO! That nails it for me. That IS the fundamental foundation of Gnosticism. That it is a personal quest for the TRUE meaning to things. <quote>Gnosis refers to the deep inner knowledge relating to the true make-up of things: of the Cosmos in toto and of that Cause behind all manifestation: it transcends the doctrines and dogmas of any religion, ideology or creed; nor is the Gnosis related to any particular religion or following.</quote>

There’s no doubt in my mind. Tools music/lyrics are deliberately meant to do basically "pry open your third eye" even though everyone won’t take the same path. I would urge anyone to read up on Gnosticism and then listen to tools music again, and you'll see what I'm talking about.
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Old 06-22-2006, 03:19 PM   #4
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Re: Gnostic interpretation

^^^ yeah i really think that 'nard may be a modern Gnostic. Ill think youll agree. im currently arguing this point in the Jambi section
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Old 07-20-2006, 10:57 PM   #5
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Re: Gnostic interpretation

I think I am too, lol...look at my forum handle. I had the negative consequences of dualism in mind when I chose it, two sides devouring each other in endless violence...Everything is truly one, so any war, conflict, etc. is like the Ouroboros of legend, eating its own tail.
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Old 07-21-2006, 02:43 PM   #6
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Re: Gnostic interpretation

Hmm.
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Old 07-22-2006, 10:46 AM   #7
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Re: Gnostic interpretation

Gnosticism seems right on, as far as it goes. However, as a philosophy major, I've noticed that as soon as you really learn about a new school of thought then you start seeing references to it everywhere. It's always there, you just have to know what to look for. I know once I began studying buddhism i saw hints of it everywhere, including in Tool's music. I'm not saying that Tool has nothing to do with Gnosticism; to the contrary, its actually fairly likely. I just don't think that the message they are trying to spread is strictly that. I think that they try to reach people through a wide variety of means.
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Old 07-22-2006, 04:50 PM   #8
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Re: Gnostic interpretation

Quote:
Originally Posted by kites in knots
Gnosticism seems right on, as far as it goes. However, as a philosophy major, I've noticed that as soon as you really learn about a new school of thought then you start seeing references to it everywhere. It's always there, you just have to know what to look for. I know once I began studying buddhism i saw hints of it everywhere, including in Tool's music. I'm not saying that Tool has nothing to do with Gnosticism; to the contrary, its actually fairly likely. I just don't think that the message they are trying to spread is strictly that. I think that they try to reach people through a wide variety of means.
This man speaks the truth.
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