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ShiningOne
09-04-2006, 06:28 AM
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Although I've been visiting this site for a few years, this is my first post. Some things I should say first:

1. I am a huge fan, I like 10,000 days a lot.
2. I am a Christian.
3. I do not look to rock music or musicians for any kind of spiritual guidance.

The reason for this post is that I've been doing quite a bit of research into Tool and their musical influences. Their stuff is heavily layered and very enigmatic and begs to be explored. So I took the bait. Even though I do not take any offense at any of MJK's lyrics or rants about organized religion, I'm a little concerned that a lot of people, especially younger people, view them as gospel. Which is a little sad.

It's obvious that Tool is inspired and influenced by many different "belief" structures and it's really cool for them to incorporate that into their art, which is really what art is all about: expressing yourself, your ideas, etc.

It would seem more productive and tolerant to spend more energy suggesting new ideas than attacking old ones, though. A case in point: in 2001 my brother and I saw Tool in Raleigh, NC. They played Opiate near the end of the show and everyone went nuts. But, when the song was over, there was a girl behind us, all goth-ed out, jumping up and down and clapping her hands, screaming "Fuck God, Fuck god!!"

To me, that just seems sad. I believe that had MJK been sitting beside her he would've been a little disappointed at the reaction his art produced. I also believe that *most* people do not take the time to really look into deeper spiritual things themselves and make their own educated decisions. It's a lot easier to hop on a bandwagon that's led by a loud voice and vent your own frustration. A cop out, if you ask me. By conforming to non-conformism, you're still conforming! Selling out to a different man is still selling out. To me, a central message in this music is to question authority--ALL authority-- and think, learn, and decide for yourself. My own experience with organized religion has been very productive and enlightening. In other words, I did the research, looked beyond the bullshit you see on the Sunday morning TV, and found truth and meaning in the Bible of all places--NOT the people you see making money off the Bible. It's a lot harder to do that than just vent at the establishment. Still, I try to be tolerant of other ideas and beliefs, even those in Tool's music.

Which leads me to the Occult/Mystic stuff. Now if someone really finds truth in these ideas and it makes their lives better and brings them a measure of satisfaction and peace, that's great. But exploring the Occult/Crowley has been a pasttime of rock stars for a while now. Jimmy Page dabbled in the Occult for years, only to remark about the whole experience in later life that it was "unfortunate".
The guys from Sabbath did the same--it actually led to the name of the band--but had experiences that made them swear the stuff off for good.

So if you're lookng for a good scare, or just wanna know what's out there, or like Danny Carey, want to go to Kansas to find the gateway to Hell (which, by the way, is just the kind of thing these guys would say to get a laugh, I never can figure out what to take seriously, so I take none of it seriously. I liken Tool to Rush: science fiction, with emphasis on the fiction part. Still a fun ride, though.) then that's okay. But why push it as "the alternative" to Christianity or any other religion? You're just trading one belief system for another. Still conforming to what's considered cooler at the moment. Which ain't so cool. Like armband tatoos or parachute pants.

Here's an analogy: Everyone knows a guy like this: One day you walk into work or school or whatever with a baseball cap on, let's say a Yankees hat. And this guy says "So, you're a Yankees fan, huh?" and you are, and he says, "Way to blow the World Series last year. And then he blasts your fave football team or music or movie or your favorite color even, so you get tired of his crap and you ask him: "okay well who do YOU like?" and he says: "oh I don't follow baseball."
Everybody hates that guy! What a cop out. All criticism and no substance. Sometimes, that's exactly what Tool makes me feel like. And when I've had enough, I turn it off. But then one morning I wake up with the riff from Prison Sex ringing in my head and I tune in and turn on again.

So my problem is with the same hypocrisy in Tool's message that they find in everyone else's. And for them to say "Yeah, we know we're hypocrites" is the worst cop-out of all. It hurts my teeth. So c'mon fellas, do something truly meaningful. Otherwise it feels more and more like you're manufacturing anger to sell records.

Still love ya, though. My conundrum.
Old 09-04-2006, 06:28 AM   #1
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Join Date: Aug 2006
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Tool and the Occult

Although I've been visiting this site for a few years, this is my first post. Some things I should say first:

1. I am a huge fan, I like 10,000 days a lot.
2. I am a Christian.
3. I do not look to rock music or musicians for any kind of spiritual guidance.

The reason for this post is that I've been doing quite a bit of research into Tool and their musical influences. Their stuff is heavily layered and very enigmatic and begs to be explored. So I took the bait. Even though I do not take any offense at any of MJK's lyrics or rants about organized religion, I'm a little concerned that a lot of people, especially younger people, view them as gospel. Which is a little sad.

It's obvious that Tool is inspired and influenced by many different "belief" structures and it's really cool for them to incorporate that into their art, which is really what art is all about: expressing yourself, your ideas, etc.

It would seem more productive and tolerant to spend more energy suggesting new ideas than attacking old ones, though. A case in point: in 2001 my brother and I saw Tool in Raleigh, NC. They played Opiate near the end of the show and everyone went nuts. But, when the song was over, there was a girl behind us, all goth-ed out, jumping up and down and clapping her hands, screaming "Fuck God, Fuck god!!"

To me, that just seems sad. I believe that had MJK been sitting beside her he would've been a little disappointed at the reaction his art produced. I also believe that *most* people do not take the time to really look into deeper spiritual things themselves and make their own educated decisions. It's a lot easier to hop on a bandwagon that's led by a loud voice and vent your own frustration. A cop out, if you ask me. By conforming to non-conformism, you're still conforming! Selling out to a different man is still selling out. To me, a central message in this music is to question authority--ALL authority-- and think, learn, and decide for yourself. My own experience with organized religion has been very productive and enlightening. In other words, I did the research, looked beyond the bullshit you see on the Sunday morning TV, and found truth and meaning in the Bible of all places--NOT the people you see making money off the Bible. It's a lot harder to do that than just vent at the establishment. Still, I try to be tolerant of other ideas and beliefs, even those in Tool's music.

Which leads me to the Occult/Mystic stuff. Now if someone really finds truth in these ideas and it makes their lives better and brings them a measure of satisfaction and peace, that's great. But exploring the Occult/Crowley has been a pasttime of rock stars for a while now. Jimmy Page dabbled in the Occult for years, only to remark about the whole experience in later life that it was "unfortunate".
The guys from Sabbath did the same--it actually led to the name of the band--but had experiences that made them swear the stuff off for good.

So if you're lookng for a good scare, or just wanna know what's out there, or like Danny Carey, want to go to Kansas to find the gateway to Hell (which, by the way, is just the kind of thing these guys would say to get a laugh, I never can figure out what to take seriously, so I take none of it seriously. I liken Tool to Rush: science fiction, with emphasis on the fiction part. Still a fun ride, though.) then that's okay. But why push it as "the alternative" to Christianity or any other religion? You're just trading one belief system for another. Still conforming to what's considered cooler at the moment. Which ain't so cool. Like armband tatoos or parachute pants.

Here's an analogy: Everyone knows a guy like this: One day you walk into work or school or whatever with a baseball cap on, let's say a Yankees hat. And this guy says "So, you're a Yankees fan, huh?" and you are, and he says, "Way to blow the World Series last year. And then he blasts your fave football team or music or movie or your favorite color even, so you get tired of his crap and you ask him: "okay well who do YOU like?" and he says: "oh I don't follow baseball."
Everybody hates that guy! What a cop out. All criticism and no substance. Sometimes, that's exactly what Tool makes me feel like. And when I've had enough, I turn it off. But then one morning I wake up with the riff from Prison Sex ringing in my head and I tune in and turn on again.

So my problem is with the same hypocrisy in Tool's message that they find in everyone else's. And for them to say "Yeah, we know we're hypocrites" is the worst cop-out of all. It hurts my teeth. So c'mon fellas, do something truly meaningful. Otherwise it feels more and more like you're manufacturing anger to sell records.

Still love ya, though. My conundrum.
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