Dark Matter

[GregoryWohlwend]

This is not of the subject of Tool at all other than it being a source of original thought, which i thought Tool and their audience would revel in.

After recently completing a course in astronomy at my university, i have been seriously contemplating dark matter, its origins and its characteristics. If you don't know, dark matter is the explanation for gallactic clusters rotating at similar speeds on the outside of the rotation disk as they are in close to the center. In short, dark matter is weird and crazy, it can't be seen or detected on ANY part of the electromegnetic spectrum, but is said to be 90% of the universes mass.

Is our current understanding of physics only one that applies to earth and not the universe? or is this dark matter... something else???? I won't begin to explain my theory, but i will say that coming to an understanding of dark matter that is similar, in level, to our understanding of our senses could be the key to the next step in evolution. Your thoughts?

[ShackledEidolon]

I know what your talking about but I forget if Dark matter actually inhibits our perception of things on the otherside of it.


It would be interesting to find a way to sense this dark matter other then through mathmatics...however that in itself may be what we are seeking.

Perhaps mathmatics are a new form of sense...we can predict things that we can not see. We can conceive of ideas that we may never experience directly through the 5 senses...so is Math an extra sensory perception?

[GregoryWohlwend]

When we look through dark matter from a gallactic cluster we see a distortion of very distant galaxies or possibly clusters. It makes sort of a spiral of the images behind the dark matter.

I am not too sure if we CAN conceive of ideas outside of the 5 senses. Maybe i am different from you but i find it extremely hard to come up with a COMPLETELY original thought not bounded by an previous definition or image. New combinations are definately possible, and further experience aid in creating new thoughts, but they all seem to be connected to what we know and feel is reality. I think the next step of the senses is something far greater than math, something we can't even imagine today.

Good luck evolving

[ShackledEidolon]

Very true, I was taking this as an extension to a thread on 46&2 about perception of higher diminsions. We have been doing a lot of discusion on how mathmatically we can predict more diminsions then the 3 we live in...of course we also exist in each diminsion but we only have perception and language to define the 3 that we are aware of directly.

I was saying that Math may be our closest thing to representing higher states in ours.

We had been using the idea that you can draw a cube on a 2D surface and thereby represent a higher state in a lower one...but we couldn't find a way to do the same with higher states into 3D environments. It must be the math that is our way of representing it in a way we can possibly understand.

So dark matter is much the same we can't really percieve it but we 'know' that it should be there.

We could be a long way away from truley knowing a higher state but at least we are to the point that we recognize that it indeed exists and even what it may in fact be...i havent read any string theory mainly because my math isnt up to par but I am very interested in it. Also my knowledge of dark matter is fairly limited all i know of it is from a 100 level astronomy class...if you could post a little more info about it then maybe i could give you a better response to it...and perhaps others could join in as well

[Un Lapin]

it is both interesting and revealing that the universe is 90% made up of unknown material.

[GregoryWohlwend]

To get more information just try to search on google or something with the keywords Dark Matter.

String theory interests me as well, again like you though, i don't know much about it.

Another theory on dark matter is that it doesn't exist and our physics are flawed when it comes to this mysterious medium.

[euthanasia]

There are actually more than 62 senses..., different perceptions our brain captures. Of course, human beings havent still reached out to its higher mental potential, we all know that. There are still thousands of barriers we have to break and tear down. It is of superbe importance that we humans try to evolve into a greater thing.
This need to see further, feel further, understand further in the world, has led me to want to study ourselves, the biggest mistery left undiscovered. I have to say that through investigation of some of tool´s theorys and philosphy, but I have taken the first steps, but it is a long way.

[Dissonance]

Originally posted by ShackledEidolon
Very true, I was taking this as an extension to a thread on 46&2 about perception of higher diminsions. We have been doing a lot of discusion on how mathmatically we can predict more diminsions then the 3 we live in...of course we also exist in each diminsion but we only have perception and language to define the 3 that we are aware of directly.


I study quantum physics in my spare time (weird hobby, no?) and its interesting, current theory (which has changed about 3 times in the last 5 years) holds that there are 11 dimensions.

The first 4 we live in (Height, Width, Length, Time) but the other 7 are actually "wound up" or "wrapped up" infinitely small. Its hard to explain, but its still interesting to contemplate. Two years ago, the current theory was that there were either 10 or 22 dimensions. The new frontiers of research say 11.

Theres alot to the universe we dont know. I love it!

[GregoryWohlwend]

In lieu of all this searching we should have a forum geared toward these explorative discussions, then we could stop going on and on about what words from Tool mean and start making our own words. Who is with me?

[Andy DV]

Sounds good, of course this is a TOOL board so its nice to have it somewhat related. I think its something the MODERATORS could hook up.

Also, in response to the post about 62 senses and whatnot - I suppose the more I think about it we do have many more than 5 senses. We can sense when someone is upset, or maybe even that funny feeling we get when something just isn't right.

Lately I've been trying to appreciate the funny coincidences and syncronocities in life and try to 'sense' the different occurances happening around us at all times. Along the lines of behaviorism, I feel we can have an active role in how different events in everyday life shape and mold our behaviors. We don't have to just wait for them to effect us, but decide how and to what degree. For me, many different songs throughout TOOL, especially on the Lateralus album, strenghten that point.

[THETA]

About the conception of ideas outside of our 5 senses, I realize that this isn't very applicable to our being and is in all likelyhood impossible, but, what if your senses were never stimulated? Say you born into a box and for all your life you saw, smelt, touched, tasted and heard nothing, what would your thought process be?

[Chris_Brightwell]

Thread locked. This is unbelievably off-topic, especially in an artwork forum, of all places.

This goes, if anyone in these fourms, in the yet-unopened Interact section.

Sorry.

Thanks.
Chris Brightwell // moderator