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View Full Version : Our fault for the breakdown?


Luna Galapogos
08-10-2003, 01:53 PM
Not only does this song completely relate to everyone that cares to have communication with anyone, but to the people that don't want it as well. Everyone is partly responsible for the oneness of all people, and for just one person to 'step out of line' this oneness is broken and leads to a breakdown in communication. You can take the reason for someone to step out as sin, people at a different stage of evolution compared to the others, a lack of faith in the social contract. Whatever the reason, people and people, people and God, people and science have been seperated from each other for lack of this communication. If we all stepped back into line, put the pieces back together then this tragedy of lost communication between man and everything else might fit back together as one. Why don't people care enough to restore perfection?

Jesus H. Christ
08-16-2003, 07:02 PM
perfection is a group of single celled organisims. We have grown far from that....

Luna Galapogos
10-01-2003, 02:18 PM
Think of a flower, first it is a seed. Then it sprouts and starts to grow. And eventually it blooms and seems that it is so much better than that seed ever was, but the seed was more alive than that blooming flower because after blooming it dies. Unless it is perennial, and then it takes more than one bloom for it to die. The more you grow, the closer you are to killing yourself. You make it sound like we are so much better than a single celled organism, but we are merely billions/trillions of them all working together. Keep breathing and you think you keep living, but you are killing yourself. Let's grow.

Windir
10-02-2003, 04:47 AM
While reading this I got the feeling you want to say that, the less we communicate, the less we live.



You said: Keep breathing and you think you keep living, but you are killing yourself. Let's grow.

So, you mean that, if we keep growing, bring back the pieces, communicate, that we will live free, because we can't live like someone that stepped out of the line, right?

What if... nobody would ever step out of the line, you say that we would grow... but we'll only grow closer to each other...
We won't grow as an individual, we won't grow as someone we like to be.

'Come on, let's stay in line, then we can be like everyone else.'



Isn't it good to have people that aren't the same, cause if we all step in the line, communicate with each other in the way you describe is, then we will all turn up the same.
There won't be someone smarter, nicer, hotter, anything.

That is a really insane thought.



You said:Think of a flower, first it is a seed. Then it sprouts and starts to grow. And eventually it blooms and seems that it is so much better than that seed ever was, but the seed was more alive than that blooming flower because after blooming it dies.
Isn't dying a part of life? Do you want us to be seeds our whole life? Which means that we can't grow for ourselfs, we can't explore who we are... we can't discover who we really are.

It would really be a shame to see someone that could be a genius, turn out to be nothing, because he stepped in line, like you want it to be.

Forget the line... or maybe not,.. but that doesn't mean it has to be a straight line.



Nothing is perfect, no one is perfect.
So step out of the line (give the line a different shape) and make your own perfection of something you truly want to be.

Mehhico
10-02-2003, 09:54 PM
Exactly.........................to the first post. I have had this type of thought-train when I have attempted to understand where Tool are going in their quest. It is quite interesting to see that, when taken in this light, how many of their songs fit this kind of theory. You had, whether consciously or not (although for one of them you did '<quote>'), referenced a few of their songs in your post.

IN MY OPINION, Aenema is full of these cryptic things (and yes, they can be taken 23 or more different ways), but the idea of stepping towards something, always comes up. Things like "don't you step out of line!", "I'll keep digging 'till I feel something", "try and read between the lines". They are hints at the idea that we once knew about our selves and our place on this Earth, but has long since been forgotten. If we work together, and we put our minds together, we can work it out.

Even into Lateralus, which is mainly what you were referring to (specifically Schism), the main idea is communication. But at the same time, the idea of all of us doing it together has become more surfaced. The Grudge welcomes change, forgiveness and understanding. Schism helps us to see that it all worked at one time, but it was the communication as you discussed before, which is our wall, which I think is continually being built higher and higher in some areas of our society. These people are moving further away from the rest of us who are trying to do this. Their wall is as high as their office buildings. They need to do some serious reflecting. Which moves me onto the most obvious song - Reflection. "We are all one mind. Capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable." and "LET THE WORDS SPILL THROUGH". - This could be another reference to our communication problem.

But thats enough from me, I am probably way off track. But it was fun, nevertheless. No regrets.

Kind regards,
Andy

p.s. I haven't just taken the above quotes out of context, I feel the entire songs reflect the meanings stated. I'm not starting a religion here ;)

Luna Galapogos
10-06-2003, 06:26 PM
I didn't say that the line had to be straight. There are many curved lines out there. I didn't say that I didn't want people to be individuals either. Back to the flower idea, there are many many flowers out there, but they are all perfect and not conflicting with the others. Then come along the bees and take what they need and the hummingbirds take what they need, and everything works in a perfect chain. Although many of these creatures and so forth are very different from each other, the fact that they all work together to form one ultimate end is perfect and beautiful. I love the fact that there are geniuses out there, I think they deserve to be able to explore themselves as does everybody, and I think that we should all be able to let all of the findings out into the open. We need to let the genius and the daft all come together in their egos and alter egos and let it all out, and then from there we can begin to put the pieces back together and work for an ultimate end just like the creatures in nature.

That is what I have felt about it anyway. You may see it differently. I hope to not come across in a way that does not show my true intentions.

P.S. think about this opinion section, a bunch of people letting out what their conscious, subconscious, ego, and alter ego allow them to see in TOOL's music. It is only a small way of us putting the pieces together. That is what we need to do with life.

AllforUnity
10-09-2003, 09:12 PM
Very poetic. :)

The_Outsider
10-13-2003, 01:31 PM
I agree with many of the things being said here, but I can't help this feeling that he is reffering to an event that happened somewhere in our past, someone referred to the idea of a one time we knew our place and ways on this earth, but it fell apart, at certain times i listen to this song and a shiver runs down my spine, i get this eerie alien feeling from it and some thought tugs at the edge of my conciousness but i cant seem to grasp it, does anybody know of some event in our past that could relate to this song? perhaps Babylon, or something similar? I don't know, just a hunch...

RRed
10-13-2003, 08:08 PM
I agree with many of the things being said here, but I can't help this feeling that he is reffering to an event that happened somewhere in our past, someone referred to the idea of a one time we knew our place and ways on this earth, but it fell apart, at certain times i listen to this song and a shiver runs down my spine, i get this eerie alien feeling from it and some thought tugs at the edge of my conciousness but i cant seem to grasp it, does anybody know of some event in our past that could relate to this song? perhaps Babylon, or something similar? I don't know, just a hunch...

Right On!!!!! both you and Andy are exactly right. A past. A common heritage. An origin. An eternal memory of sorts. It can't be coincidence that we are atronomically unique, each and everyone us, but at the sametime we share the identical DNA structure. Is it chance that we even share something like 96% of the same genetic structure as primates and apes? Or even like the 60%, or something like that, of the same genetic structure as a frog? I don't think this is necessarily concrete evidence of evolution but more so evidence of connection; that we are made up of the same essence and energies that have existed before time was told.

As far as the 'alien' feeling and the resonnation of some past memory....... listen to Parabol and Parabola in that light and maybe you'll see something different now.

And oh yeah, the alien thing... I think a few of you probably know what I think..... But check out Naacal, Aymara, zep tepi, and especially Nibiru and Anunnaki or Anannage. This last refernce may also shine some light on the 'let the water kiss and transmutate these leaden grudges into gold' excerpt from Grudge.. Check it out.

A distant memory, a common heritage, a family tree....... Where do we fit in??? Faaip de Oaid!!!!!

'and you will speak a language foreign to your tongue'........

RRed

AllforUnity
10-13-2003, 08:23 PM
l also believe this song is about something from the past...it's somewhat of an obviousness. l think it's about 2 things seperating, and then finding enough space to be formed back together. Maybe about the band breaking up, or having hard times, and they wrote this song to portray that.

The_Outsider
10-14-2003, 05:03 PM
I see the connection now, I've always known that Parabol /a refers to something before conciousness / in the past but I've never really seen that it describes my very aura when listening to Schism...


I can almost hear those words"...Nothing is a coincidence..."

RRed
10-15-2003, 12:31 AM
Oh yeah, Outsider.... just a thought, as far as some event that can relate to this song........ think about Eon Blue Apocolypse

The Great Deluge...

RRed

g-bay-be
10-17-2003, 08:17 PM
You see, the break down in communication sets its roots in the lack of trust... How can we comunicate if we don't know who we are? Go back to H. You have to find your self beofre you can cammunicate to someone else. We are all consumed by the snake. and thats where the breakdown in communiction starts. If we all step into line like you ask we would all have to not be blinded or swayed by what the snake is telling us. and why do we have to have a line... Be an individual!

Luna Galapogos
11-10-2003, 09:44 PM
Everyone wants to be an individual. Yes, that is a good thing, but too much individualism leads to an overall collapse. Look at the way our nation is turning out. Everybody so wrapped up in individual rights that we forget about the whole, and soon we will collapse. You must be an individual for sure, but within the bounds of the whole. The whole must be more important, otherwise the only thing you are is selfish. I used to hate the government, I still think that we could have a better one, but I have come to a point where I am satisfied with it because I realize that it could be better if we all worked within its bounds and didn't try to be better than everyone else or lord it over everyone else. Individualism is good, but not at the price of the whole.

Windir
11-11-2003, 01:10 AM
Damn, 4 weeks ago when this thing started, somewhere around that time, I thought I could have a good discussion, but I missed too much now.