Maynard's words on this song...

[sk8ingknot4659]

I have word for word Maynard's Opinion on this song, this was said at concert in Houston...

"Ever heard of Jesus, or Buddah, Kristna (sp), or Muhamad, they had some pretty some good ideas. Then their agents, sorta trying to make some money on them, and fucked everything up. Never trust an agent. This song is about those agents" *Music Starts*

Once again another funny comment that is about a great song, which raises the question, are the agents he talking about preachers? I think they are...

[hateandvaseline]

Well, not really preachers, but those middlemen who distort and stretch the truth. You know, they show up on your doorstep with bibles, trying to convince you to do join their plague. (This is just one example)

[anhour]

in the case of Christianity: one of the biggest problems is that little of the bible is actually in Jesus's words, possibly none. it was written after his death, not during his preaching. it was also second or third-hand or accounts even further from the source.
then it has been translated at least two or three times. (arimaic to greek to english and in the case of the old testament/torah, ?arimaic? to hebrew to english, and sometimes from hebrew to greek to english depending on the translation)

but there are still good things said in the bible, but unfortunately it is often grossly misinterpreted and sometimes the book itself is completely ignored and people go to the middleman.

[Chris_Brightwell]

Originally posted by sk8ingknot4659
I have word for word Maynard's Opinion on this song, this was said at concert in Houston... That recording is from 11.23.1996 in Philadelphia, PA.

Thanks.
Chris Brightwell // moderator

[Jerk off]

What is an Agent? I think an Agent is anyone who clams to speak for "God." <Not any particular God mind you> They can tell you pretty much whatever the hell they want in the name of "God." They can take advantage of you because of your fear in that "God." Although I don't think I want to believe in anything that says "IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN ME YOUR GOING TO HAVE EVERLASTING PAIN!!!" seems a little sadistic, but whatever works for you. :) Sorry I kind of got off subject.

MW


Think for yourself. Question Authority.

Trust your brain. Destroy your beliefs. Trust
you divinity

[Ace Starflyer]

Think for yourself. Question Authority.

Trust your brain. Destroy your beliefs. Trust
you divinity
-Jerk off

I find it funny that all of Tool's messages are transfered in imperative sentences. They tell me exactly what to do, and yet they tell me to not let anyone tell me what to do... Does anyone else see a bit of a contradiction, or some kind of problem in commanding people to not let anyone command them? No one can completely abide by this directive, and yet no one can completely disobey it either. Kinda spiffy...

Anyhow, to the point at hand. To arbitrarily decide that no one can legitimately speak a god's message is to unnecessarily limit the places where you can find truth. IF there was a god, and s/he decided that s/he wanted to show his/herself through a messenger, then that kind of assumption would fly against the truth. Granted that people try to tie their authority with a deity's by saying that the deity has authorized them to do so, but still... If you're searching for an untainted truth, you gotta look everywhere, even the places where people who don't think look.

[Jerk off]

That is a good point, a very good point. I guess I did not state my self clearly, I didn't mean that all the agents of "God" were liars. I mean that there a a majority of people who can and will use your beliefs against you.
MW

[GentryXaties]

Originally posted by Jerk off
I mean that there a a majority of people who can and will use your beliefs against you.
MW

It's true, and unfortunately, that paranoid outlook is why there are so few people who will believe anything anymore. Religion, politics, science... I mean, what else is there if you can't take anything at face value?

[OpiAtE_666]

I find it funny that all of Tool's messages are transfered in imperative sentences. They tell me exactly what to do, and yet they tell me to not let anyone tell me what to do... Does anyone else see a bit of a contradiction, or some kind of problem in commanding people to not let anyone command them? No one can completely abide by this directive, and yet no one can completely disobey it either. Kinda spiffy...


I think you can take someone else's philosophy, and apply to your every day life while still thinking for yourself. I don't think its contradictory on Tools part. But sometimes Tool fans can be hypocritical, spouting off tool quotes as if they're the fucking bible or something. If you really understand Tool's philosophy, you'll question everything, even them.

[Ace Starflyer]

Originally posted by OpiAtE_666


I think you can take someone else's philosophy, and apply to your every day life while still thinking for yourself.[...] If you really understand Tool's philosophy, you'll question everything, even them.

Good point! Don't get me wrong; i wasn't saying otherwise, or i didn't mean to. I was just kinda playing a word game. I agree that you can take someone else's philosophy. What I'm trying to say is that what Tool's saying is more explicitly forceful than what christianity says (I can't speak on the other main religions for I have no expperience with them). To buy into one philosophy means, at least in regards to my approact to truth, means that you must also look at other philosophies to further confirm the one you hold to as true at the moment. That way the true philosophy will stand as being that much more true... if that makes sense.

[realitytrip]

the bible is a book of stories told by writers.. the bible is not a text book on spiritual life.. People read the bibe and often misunderstand it.. they think that it was meant to be read and understood one ceratin way.. then they go to a preacher in hope that he will tell them what it all means.. I think the bible should be read like any other book, or painting.. not seen as it was meant to be seen, but instead seen how it means to you.. take what you read and think "what does this mean to me?" not "what does this mean?" or "what did they mean by this"..

[3gor]

I know exactly what you are talking about Ace Starflyer. I never really applied it to tool but I have thought about that while studying forms of government. The communist had the exact same approach. They would tell you what to do by telling you not to listen to the people who tell you what to do. Its kind of a crazy cycle that you can very easily get eaten up in. I am not comparing tool to communism by any means but realizing this contradiction is pretty interesting.

[larips]

I suspect there may be a little over thinking going on here. The firat rule of creating art in order to convey a message is show, don't tell. Tool, and particularly maynard with his lyrics understand this perfectly.

The clear message of the song is to be aware of greeks bearing gifts and easy answers. Of course you have to think for yourself. We could chase our tails for hours saying, why should i question what i hear just because maynard said so, but that would achieve nothing. And of course what maynard said is to be held up for the same scrutiny as anything else. Jest beacuse he is quite possibly the greatest poet of our time does not mean he knows better than anyone else what is right for you.

Consider it. No one wants to be told what to think (even if in reality they are much more comfortable with that as a state of affairs). That is the point of the song. Don't out and out tell people what to do, scare the pants off them and they will follow you.
Look at the frenzy that the current despotic leader of the USA is whipping up now with Iraq etc.

Religion essentially presents you with an option. They can not force you to comply, but they can scare you with the consequences of not doing so. This message can be easily transferred to the government or any branch of the established status quo.

This is how maynard writes songs. Although many of them sound out and out preachy, at no point does he tell you what to do or what to think. He paints a picture, and shows how he sees the world. The rest is up to you.

[seeker]

you know, i have been wondering for a while what maynard had to say about this song. thanks for the post, i have some people to show it to :)

[Teisen]

The thing that I see in OPIATE is that maynards brief military background is intertwined in the overall religious conotations that make up the majority of the message in this song. He went to West Point briefly where leadership is shoved down your throat and I am sure they stressed doing what you are told and not to question orders from authority figures. This is also expressed strongly in INTOLERANCE. Anyway this is a key to fully understanding the overall context of the song in general. The song has many themes but overall it tells me to question those in charge and ask what are there true intentions.

[Aeturnus]

I agree opiate666. Think for yourself? Well most do, those who don't either shouldn't in the first place or choose not to whether it be subjectively or objectively. Question Authority? Sure, but why don't we question Tool's Authority as well? The Authority, or power of influence is one thing, the study of meaning is another. To understand why Maynard and Tool say the things they do you have to sometimes believe yourself over them.

[dissemblance]

Originally posted by realitytrip
the bible is a book of stories told by writers.. the bible is not a text book on spiritual life.. People read the bibe and often misunderstand it.. they think that it was meant to be read and understood one ceratin way.. then they go to a preacher in hope that he will tell them what it all means.. I think the bible should be read like any other book, or painting.. not seen as it was meant to be seen, but instead seen how it means to you.. take what you read and think "what does this mean to me?" not "what does this mean?" or "what did they mean by this".. good job man.way to put that in ways even the dumbest reject can comprehend. you know maybe finally some one will understand what i have been trying to say all along.but i couldnt get enough people to listen to understand what in all respects is the reality no one wants to hear because they need hope and guidance and for us to decide our basically our fate our destiny and base it on one book is the higher meaning in our lives. live the way you want and be your own man but remember everything comes with a price: are you prepared to pay peace and guidance

[Oblivious]

hello again. i have recently bought a book suggested by danny carey form www.dannycarey.org and in Rhythm drummer magazine. anyway it is called the "holy blood and the holy grail" and it tackles the issue of the cinstruction of the bible. personally i think this is a great book and well researched. read it if you wish to see another perspective on the matter. agents and arguments within the bible are brought to surface, discussed and resettled. it is written by:
Michael Baigent,
Richard Leigh&
Henry Lincoln.
anybody who has read it please tell me your thoughts on it.

[11thc]

Karl Marx:
"Religion is opiate to the people."

Without drawing a strict parallel to marxism, the quote, I think, covers the theme of the song in very few words. The way I interpret the lyrics, it's a message concerning the messages of Jesus when he spoke to the masses with a voice that petrified the mind (opiate/Opiate), preachings that acted in a hypnotic way - according to the Bible, the preachings of Jesus 'encuraged' a lot of people to follow him.

-
You are broken now
but faith can heal you
Just do everything I tell you to do
-

--> [according to the Bible]
Jesus spoke,
he was the son of God
and people did follow him.

What I really think Opiate is about is dealing with personal reflections on christianity - whether people chose to follow Jesus or not, then today it's your own business to deal with facts from the bible - it doesn't mean shit if he led the Jews to Israel: That was 2000 years ago. Today has no connection if you don't concieve your own ideas from the Biblical messages. Do you actually need to know what the Bible is? Wouldn't the shit therein be the exact same if it was written yesterday by a guy who just ate seven E's? You need to See then Think instead of Read then Follow. If you need to know that it's the words of God to believe them, you are already a slave - and if you don't believe in that, then I believe you are truly a christian, which is not neccesarily a good thing.

11thc

[sircorn]

Originally posted by Ace Starflyer
-Jerk off

I find it funny that all of Tool's messages are transfered in imperative sentences. They tell me exactly what to do, and yet they tell me to not let anyone tell me what to do... Does anyone else see a bit of a contradiction, or some kind of problem in commanding people to not let anyone command them? No one can completely abide by this directive, and yet no one can completely disobey it either. Kinda spiffy...

Anyhow, to the point at hand. To arbitrarily decide that no one can legitimately speak a god's message is to unnecessarily limit the places where you can find truth. IF there was a god, and s/he decided that s/he wanted to show his/herself through a messenger, then that kind of assumption would fly against the truth. Granted that people try to tie their authority with a deity's by saying that the deity has authorized them to do so, but still... If you're searching for an untainted truth, you gotta look everywhere, even the places where people who don't think look.

Lol i love it. Your exactly right, but this ca't be helped because everything you think has already been thought of by someone else(reflection). D/L this and listen to 1:15

http://www.deadohiosky.net/audio.php?go=download&path=10_02_01--New_York_City&id=10_02_01--New_York_City--Opiate.mp3

[tomcat]

"Once again another funny comment that is about a great song, which raises the question, are the agents he talking about preachers? I think they are..."


I've been listening to this song for a long time, and I think this is definitely about the hypocrisy of established religion, especially Christianity. That is the hypocrisy of the church itself, and not so much the ideas of the religion. Having grown up roman catholic, and having gone to catholic grammar and high schools, I fully agree with this sentiment. I mean, I do believe that most of the priests that are on the street, in the local churches, ect., really do mean well, but they are stuck in this hypocritical bureaucracy that is the modern church. They are more interested in self preservation than spirituality. They are forced to try to brainwash people, to make them Deaf, Blind and Dumb and born to Follow, just to simply fill the churches with bodies. They try to convince people that your faith (in the church, not the necessarily religion) can heal you. They gave up long ago on dolling out any kind of spiritual guidance or insight, which is the whole point of religion. And that makes them hypocritical.

[DieForMe]

Originally posted by Chris_Brightwell
That recording is from 11.23.1996 in Philadelphia, PA.

Thanks.
Chris Brightwell // moderator
hahaha denied

[soberwithapenis]

Originally posted by anhour
in the case of Christianity: one of the biggest problems is that little of the bible is actually in Jesus's words, possibly none. it was written after his death, not during his preaching. it was also second or third-hand or accounts even further from the source.
then it has been translated at least two or three times. (arimaic to greek to english and in the case of the old testament/torah, ?arimaic? to hebrew to english, and sometimes from hebrew to greek to english depending on the translation)

but there are still good things said in the bible, but unfortunately it is often grossly misinterpreted and sometimes the book itself is completely ignored and people go to the middleman.

The bible second/ third hand? Ha! the version of bible that the western world uses today took 39 men nearly 1800 years. Thats like playing telephone for 1800 years, do you know how historically innacurate the bible is, if in fact there is something for it to be accurate to? here's a quote from thebible.com (check it out, the blantant contradictions throughout are hilarious to me) "Many versions of the bible exist, each reflects the limited scientific knowledge, personal beliefs of the writers/translators, and the social beliefs in the time period in which it was written/translated"
I think to myself why would any one follow something that is supposedly so singular but is not at all possible accurate?
Personally i think religeon is the downfall of man. After all those who follow religeon do not think for themselves, yet most do not question the authority of the religeon. They follow it blindly.
As for the middle man, there shouldnt be a middleman. That is why this song is bashing said middleman.

Just read the quote on the Opinion Homepage

[joshuacureton]

Originally posted by soberwithapenis
The bible second/ third hand? Ha! the version of bible that the western world uses today took 39 men nearly 1800 years. Thats like playing telephone for 1800 years, do you know how historically innacurate the bible is, if in fact there is something for it to be accurate to? here's a quote from thebible.com (check it out, the blantant contradictions throughout are hilarious to me) "Many versions of the bible exist, each reflects the limited scientific knowledge, personal beliefs of the writers/translators, and the social beliefs in the time period in which it was written/translated"
I think to myself why would any one follow something that is supposedly so singular but is not at all possible accurate?
Personally i think religeon is the downfall of man. After all those who follow religeon do not think for themselves, yet most do not question the authority of the religeon. They follow it blindly.
As for the middle man, there shouldnt be a middleman. That is why this song is bashing said middleman.

Just read the quote on the Opinion Homepage

the quote on the opinion homepage is from a fool. look, stop bashing bloody jesus. he died for you. he is god who died for you and allowed you to get into heaven when you died (though your body is wormfood!). there are no "agents", nor is there "thinking for yourself"...that is the gospel of satan controlling you, steering you away from the salvation that bloody jesus' near-death almost gave you! if anything, you should bash on ol' light bringer for failing to dethrone daddy white-beard (otherwise known as g-o-d). i mean, come on, what was the gameplan for that one? "hey, lets get a bunch of angels that are pissed off about that new creation, what was it called, 'man?', and overthrow pops!" not too smart. we should be pissing on ol' satan for being a straight-A dipshit. not bloody jesus. bloody jesus is god, though not really.
this song is about stupid moterfuckers that always bash on bloody jesus, and those stupid motherfuckers that are too stupid to realize that they cant think for themselves because they are stupid motherfuckers. the singer is saying "hey you stupid motherfuckers! hey!! yeah you!! listen, we both know you're too stupid of a motherfucker to think for yourself, so why dont you pass on those duties to me?!?! sound good? of course it does!" the singer is the only agent, and he is singing about himself and the coup that he performed when he convinced the millions (and millions!) of consumers to go out and buy his music and let themselves be programmed with his words. and if the brain-washing of the singer doesnt take with you, then the singer is recommending, through the religious references in the song, that you adhere to the one true faith, catholicism!
the way he see's it, you can either have his opiate, which is nice if youre prone to conspiracy's and space aliens and thoughts of inter-dimensional travel and massive drug consumption and self-alienation and mutilation; OR you can embrace the one true catholic faith. either way, youre a sheep (these are the singers own words), and so you need a shepherder! (or is it sheep-herder? oh fuck...)

[joshuacureton]

Originally posted by mstajduh
dude, no one's down with catholicism anymore...!!! now, protestants.. thats' the way to go! We're rebels man! The best things catholics brought to this world was naughty catholic school girls with long stalkings, short plaid skirts, white blouse, pig tails, and glasses.... Mmmmmm..

lunch time !

joshuacureton, the next fool martyr (http://www.emergentmind.org)
you are soooooooo wrong! put it this way: if bloody jesus were alive today, and looking for some pussy, what sort of pussy would he go for? catholic school girl pussy, or stank worm-ridden "daddy already deflowered me" protestant pussy?
when you go to a protestant church, its all gloom and doom, no tradition, no excitement. but with the catholics, its like a fucking rock show! plus they speak in a real language that you dont understand (latin) whereas the protestants mumble awya in giberish (tongues). the catholics have a hierarchy in which they know who is oppressing them (ie the pope, cardinal, bishop, priest) whereas the protestants dont have any of that shit. plus the protestants are the lazybones of religion! out of all religions, they are the only ones who will admit that you can do the worst crimes (ie george bush II) and can still sneak into heaven as long as you "accept christ into your heart". talk about bullshit! furthermore, what the fuck is protestantism anyways? 1600 years after the fact? why not be a mormon, or better yet, follow one of those supercool totemist paths? or why not magick? choosing protestantism is just as arbitrary as any of those others. if i were protestant, i would consider hanging myself. no, wait, first, if i were protestant, i would consider cutting my wrists open, and then hanging myself. and at that moment before death, i would "accept jesus as my personal lord and savior" and heaven here i come! yee-haw!
fuckinshitassbitchdamnfuckingshit! hallelujah! someone get me some drugs!!!!
(click on the fool martyr thing in my quote of what you said)

[FuckJesus]

ummm....religion is what people created when they didn't know what the hell lightning and thunder was. that is where the line " trust in faith...etc." comes from. people are scared. they depend on a fictional character (some depend on drugs) and they let that "person" guide them...fucking scared and hopeless people.

no offense to anyone is intended...just my opinion

[beebs]

thats a good point dude
i think the religion gives us a board, somewhat rules for us to live by and also trys and help us to be better people, it can be fake it can be real, its whatever the hell you want it to be. it gives some people a place to feel like the belong or just a place for comfort, but most of all, like i said, a set of guidelines to help themselves become better people.But whatever thats just my view.

[Peaceful Moments]

I think Maynard is talking about people like Osama Bin Laden. That guy is saying: "We must kill all americans". But God said to love your enemies. So he's just dumb like hell, somebody should shoot the man.

[ohshuashua]

as a christian i'm pretty frustrated with the church right now, i think it gives itself a bad name with all the legalism it forces on everyone. i go to a christian college with a strong legalistic ideal (that of works making you what you are as a christian). however i'm discovering this is a lie. christianity is not about what you do or do not do, it is merely believing that Jesus died for you and striving to live in a way that will please him. this living to please him is not living in fear of pissing him off, or living in an attempt to gain his favor to give you stuff you want, but instead, it's living with the gratitude of someone who's life/soul has been saved by another, and honoring the one who made the sacrifice for them.

simplistic, yes, and i think it's a shame that we christians are encouraged to rely on others, and are taught that questioning is wrong. it's only been through questioning that i've done of christianity, the people i see around me and their actions, my actions and motives for those as a christian that i feel i am reaching a meaningful life as a follower of Christ. doubtless i will screw up and judge others, but i'm always striving to do what would honor Jesus/God.

[BigCheese]

as a christian i'm pretty frustrated with the church right now, i think it gives itself a bad name with all the legalism it forces on everyone. i go to a christian college with a strong legalistic ideal (that of works making you what you are as a christian). however i'm discovering this is a lie. christianity is not about what you do or do not do, it is merely believing that Jesus died for you and striving to live in a way that will please him. this living to please him is not living in fear of pissing him off, or living in an attempt to gain his favor to give you stuff you want, but instead, it's living with the gratitude of someone who's life/soul has been saved by another, and honoring the one who made the sacrifice for them.


Good to know I'm not the only Christian who is upset with the way many Christians are acting.

Please, no one say that there shouldn't be fighting within the church. Because if we didn't, it could easily be interpreted as the ones in this song... deaf, blind, and dumb and born to follow.

[Peaceful Moments]

I see.. somewhat hypocritical.. Please refer to song "Jerk Off." You want a man (men) to be killed because he killed others, which probably he felt the same way as you did. So if you were to be that somebody and kill him, should we thereby kill you? then someone else kill us? endless, pointless cycle that needs to end.


You're right. Let God decide. If for that matter you believe in God

[ohshuashua]

Please, no one say that there shouldn't be fighting within the church. Because if we didn't, it could easily be interpreted as the ones in this song... deaf, blind, and dumb and born to follow.

good point. i think the biggest misenterpretation about christianity is that we are nothing but blind sheep. that said i think that christianity is being marketed right now (though not quite to the extent of catholocism in dogma) to where people join it because it's "cool" or "fun" or "what everyone else is doing." granted, they gain more attendence at church, but there is no discovery of a true christian life.

this is where scandals like those of many televangelists come from. they are in it for the money, corrupting God's temple and body, similar to that in the gospels, when Jesus goes on his rampage in the temple against the money changers. he was furious that people had taken Gods house to make money and extort others.

this is not true christianity, and anyone who thinks it is, or hates/disagrees with christianity should re-evaluate their conception of the church, and discover what true and basic christianity is.

[radmanics]

When I started reading joshuacureton's first post, I thought he was another pissed of catholic, but by his second, I found him very funny; he's pointing out some major issues with the church I feel. Well done, I think you understood the song =]

I think religion was made for 3 reasons: 1, to explain the unexplicable; explain what happened after you died (to stop most people going insane, as you have almost nothing to live with originally); and 2, to control people.

This song, after having read the Maynard quote, is about quite a few things with catholsism. The fact that preists have been currupt since a very long time, has virtually fucked the catholic church up the backside (and litterally in the case of some young boys - further proof of the state of the church is not a good one).

I think that Maynard could be taking on the persona of a catholic, and a preacher to some extent at various points in the song. When he is claiming that "we both want, to rape you", he is the preacher using his power for currupt purposes. When he is calling for "jesus christ, come save my life now", he is the follower, calling for Jesus or God, to save him (the follower) from the hell or Hell he will go to, for following a currupt priest.

And the "Think for yourself. Question Authority." quote: I think the whole point of making people chant that when they played Third Eye Live, is to show you how easily people can be made to follow something, no matter how important, insignificant, big or small it is. I also find it amusing, as I'm sure TOOL do themselves, how contradictory it is for people to take TOOL as their book of life (I would say bible, but this thread as shown it to be a little... useless as a book to live your life by ;) ).

Happy listening.

[lilypie]

"but with the catholics, its like a fucking rock show! plus they speak in a real language that you dont understand (latin) whereas the protestants mumble awya in giberish (tongues). posted by joshuacureton....man no one speaks latin anymore...it is a dead language. and just because you read it out of a book does not mean you know what it means. I must tell you that if you were a good Christian then you wouldn't speak to people like that no matter how much you disliked them or what they said. I don't believe in religion, but if I did, I wouldn't want to be a part of yours. I believe in spirituality. I have read the Bible many times, and there are some great stories in there...love, lust, betrayal, etc... now if ya want to see some latin here is some for you lets see if you can read it and translate it:
Civitas bellum sine causa bona aut propter iram gerere non debet. Si fortunas et agros vitasque populi nostri sine bello defendere poterimus, tum pacem conservare debebimus; si, autem, non poterimus servare patriam libertatemque nostram sine bello, bellum erit necessarium. Semper debemus demonstrare, tamen, magnum officium in bello, et magnam clementian post victoriam....Cicero

[AllforUnity]

Interesting entry. Where is that quoted?

[plastichippo]

I think the artwork on the cover of Lateralus would suggest that God is within you.... so in turn, do what you would do to honour yourself and others, as I see God as a paradox, a unification of polar opposites in a dualistic world.

Within you.. or perhaps it is that God is in your head/mind/brain - perceived and created by YOU and should be based on YOUR experiences alone ?

G$d is a hyped, misused, preached and commercialised word. These "agents" Maynard speaks of shouldn't need to convince others (while in fact, really convincing themselves!) that THEIR God exists, because if they truly held all the faith and knowledge they preach about, via their own experiences, that would just
- know- and that would be enough.

[AllforUnity]

Cool entry...l like the dancing thing too.

[Skinshifter01]

[QUOTE=sircorn]...but this ca't be helped because everything you think has already been thought of by someone else...

You know, that kind of makes sense, and i partially agree with you, but let me post question for you.

A very brilliant man by the name of Leonardo Di Vinci first thought of a flying machine, what we call the airplane. Okay. Well, if as you say, somone has already thought what you are thinking right now, then does that mean that someone thought of the plane before Di Vinci, and the person before him and the person before him? Does that mean that thought, the original thought does not exist, that there was no "first thought" because it was already thought? I don't know. And I don't expect you to. Just wondering, just thinking aloud.

And I realise that Di Vinci lived and died a long, long time ago. That doesn't mean that my thoughts have already been thought.

One more question for you : do vampires get AIDs?

[AllforUnity]

Yeah...l know what you mean...just like before Columbus, the Vikings explored America...they just didn't decide to claim it as their own like Spain did. So l know what you're talking about...l do believe in SOME ways of original thinking...but ideologically, l know what you mean.






Cool.

[IC]

-Jerk off

I find it funny that all of Tool's messages are transfered in imperative sentences. They tell me exactly what to do, and yet they tell me to not let anyone tell me what to do... Does anyone else see a bit of a contradiction, or some kind of problem in commanding people to not let anyone command them? No one can completely abide by this directive, and yet no one can completely disobey it either. Kinda spiffy...

Anyhow, to the point at hand. To arbitrarily decide that no one can legitimately speak a god's message is to unnecessarily limit the places where you can find truth. IF there was a god, and s/he decided that s/he wanted to show his/herself through a messenger, then that kind of assumption would fly against the truth. Granted that people try to tie their authority with a deity's by saying that the deity has authorized them to do so, but still... If you're searching for an untainted truth, you gotta look everywhere, even the places where people who don't think look.



Haha yeah, I thought that too.
But Im also glad people are starting to actually think about this song. Its sad becuase some are so willing to hate christianity, and then say that they have a free mind. Well, how can you have a free mind when you steriotype people? It doenst make sense. If you're pissed at fundementalist christains LIKE that Pat somethings guy (which I am, and I am a christian), then that means you're mad at them, for their SPECIFIC BEHAVIORS. This doesnt mean that christianity or christians are bad. Not all muslims are terrorists, and with that, its an embarassment to Islam, having those who practice their religion that negative way. It is essential, if you want to free your mind truely, to tolerate, and expose yourself to other ideas.

[AllforUnity]

lt's not bad to speak the word of God through your own mouth. Everytime l've ever been to church or anything, before they speak they will pray to God, and pray that His words shine through that person. lt's not exactly you speaking, "it's God." Supposedly.

[AllforUnity]

What kind of "agents" are you talking about?

[INNER_STRUGGLE]

I think its awesome that Maynard depicts himslef as one of gods.. recruiters if you will

[AllforUnity]

Why do you say so?

[Luna Galapogos]

Why do you say so?

Because just like agents, they want to rape you. "Is this love? This is MY love for you."

"If nothing else kills you, breathing will."

[AllforUnity]

That's why Maynard counts himself as a god? l'm confused.

[Luna Galapogos]

That's why Maynard counts himself as a god? l'm confused.

Rape isn't necessarily me sticking my dick into you. It could be a mental rape. Perhaps he is saying that just like a God, we believe in him, and when we do, he steals (rapes) our thoughts???

[AllforUnity]

Rape defined is acts of sexual things that one doesn't want to do but is forced to...for your mind it's not rape.

[Luna Galapogos]

Rape defined is acts of sexual things that one doesn't want to do but is forced to...for your mind it's not rape.

I understand that, but it could be used as a metaphor couldn't it. Do you believe that Stinkfist is about anal fisting? I'm not saying that's it, I just think that he could be using rape as a metaphor.

[AllforUnity]

Well yeah l supposed it could be...but never in the song is the word "rape" mentioned.

[BlooReflection696]

I know there is a God if by God I mean creator, but no point in questioning what cannot be answered, I think Jesus was a smart man who knew how to live life, jus distorted, Did say himself he walked on water, he could have if he was that lizard that does it, he was carpender maybe he invented something for the illusion.

[Luna Galapogos]

Well yeah l supposed it could be...but never in the song is the word "rape" mentioned.

My God's will
becomes me.
When he speaks out,
he speaks through me.
He has needs
like I do.
We both want
to "rape" you.

[Cutts]

The Bible was inspired by the Holy Spirit. It was written by men who experienced the things that they are writing about. The majority of the New Testament was written very shortly after Jesus's death and resurrection.

[mаynard]

I have word for word Maynard's Opinion on this song, this was said at concert in Houston...

"Ever heard of Jesus, or Buddah, Kristna (sp), or Muhamad, they had some pretty some good ideas. Then their agents, sorta trying to make some money on them, and fucked everything up. Never trust an agent. This song is about those agents" *Music Starts*

Once again another funny comment that is about a great song, which raises the question, are the agents he talking about preachers? I think they are...

I don't remember saying this.

[Esurient4Truth]

wow, Maynard was banned. Fuckin' Poser. AND IT WASN'T HOUSTON, IT WAS PHILADELPHIA PENNSYLVANIA. IF YOU HAVE THE "concert", IT WAS MISLABELED. Thank you www.collectiveunconscious.org

[hushypushy]

http://toolnavy.com/member.php?u=2 i m o

[evan sussman]

My favorite quote is the unifying message of Bawa Muhaiyaddeen: “You are a Christian because you believe in Jesus. You are a Jew because you believe in all the prophets including Moses. You are a Muslim because you believe in Mohammed as a prophet. You are a Sufi because you believe in the universal teachings of God’s love. You are really none of those, but you are all of those because you believe in God. And once you believe in God, there is no religion. Once you divide yourself off with religion, you are separated from your fellow man.”

[Inner_Eulogy]

My favorite quote is the unifying message of Bawa Muhaiyaddeen: “You are a Christian because you believe in Jesus. You are a Jew because you believe in all the prophets including Moses. You are a Muslim because you believe in Mohammed as a prophet. You are a Sufi because you believe in the universal teachings of God’s love. You are really none of those, but you are all of those because you believe in God. And once you believe in God, there is no religion. Once you divide yourself off with religion, you are separated from your fellow man.”

I like that quote a lot!