Am I the only one?

[ATO]

It seems as if everyone on this board either takes Stinkfist literally (Fisting) or they ignore the fisting metaphor, but still take the lyrics to literally. Everyone in this second group of people seems to see that the meaning of th song is that as humans we must have stimulation and interaction and input in order to survive, thrive and ultimately evolve. Now this is not a horrible interpretation, but it does seem a bit short sited.

My interpretation is almost entirely opposite of this. The way I see it is that Stinkfist is not advocating stimulation and input as a way of evolution, it is in fact stating the opposite. When I listen to Stinkfist, I see it more as a cry for help. It is coming from the point of view that our society has become too reliant on constant input (TV, music, movies and games) and has become addicted. Lyrics such as "constant over stimulation numbs me and I wouldn't have it any other way" or "I don't want it, I just need it" or "desensitized to everything. what became of subtelty?" all seem much more like the words of one addicted to this over stimulation, than one seeking it. It is an addicts cry for help, he is addicted to the world around him and most take a step away to see what the is truly important.

Most of the lyrics have always seemed cynical/sarcastic to me, such as "Boredom's not a burden anyone should bear". This line seems to be extremely saracastic in its wording and I find it hard to believe that so many of you take it as seriously as you do. Especially considering Tool's long known love of humor and of fucking with their fans.

Am I entirely off base here, or is Stinkfist more about a need to find something deeper than stimulation? It is not the stimulation that is needed, instead what is needed is to take a step back and look at onesself rather than the outside world.

[replica]

very well stated my tool loving friend.
now i am not saying that i agree with you, nor am i saying that i disagree with you.
what you said was very thought out and intelligent. i especially liked the part about how tool loves to fuck with there fans. its the blind leading the blind.
i was at a tool concert about a month ago and at the end of it danny was throwing out his drum heads to the crowd and maynard was about to throw his water bottles out. maynard went to one side of the stage and pumped a underhand throw to the crowd, you know to make the audience ready to catch the bottle. after a couple of more fake throws he let it go in the crowd, except he threw it to the crowd on the other side if the stage, while he sat there staring, maybe even smiling at the crowd that he just fucked with. it was fucking great.
anyway as far as stinkfist goes, great fucking song. it makes me feel nauseated , happy and enlightened all at the same time. and i wouldn't have it any other way.

[wuphat]

I'm definitely getting on the bus with you here.

I just recently read an interview with Maynard where he says that one of the best ways we can all become better people is to "turn off the television for a year or so." I have always seen this song as an attack on the media. Especially, news agencies and MTV. Human nature is always to want more, that's obvious, but it's the news agencies and music mogals who constantly try to shove their ideas of what is interesting or newsworthy down our throats and society as a whole swallows it all without question and asks for more.

When the song says, "something has to change" I see it as we need to end this system of canned news and force-fed crap that MTV calls music not as a cry of more of the same tired shit just intensified another notch.

Take "Jackass" for example. Do we really need this shit? Is this what we've come to that we need to watch people puking on themselves and riding in shopping carts to be entertained? I hope not. It's one thing to demonstrate obsurdity by being obsurd (satire) or to shock someone, but to do something with no agenda behind it other than to make money and potentially harm people is just not right. Sure, Tool makes money from what they do, but at least they try to enlighten.

[Badg]

Something kinda sad about the way that things have come to be/desensitized to everything/what became of subtlety?

In my opinion the song's narrator is just stating how things are and how this all is a part of human nature or a state of being.

From buddhanet.net:
(Description of one of the six realms of existence according to buddhism)"If ego decides it likes the situation, it begins to churn up all sorts of ways to possess it. A craving to consume the situation arises and we long to satisfy that craving. Once we do, a ghost of that craving carries over and we look around for something else to consume. We get into the habitual pattern of becoming consumer oriented. Perhaps we order a piece of software for our computer. We play with it for awhile, until the novelty wears out, and then we look around for the next piece of software that has the magic glow of not being possessed yet. Soon we haven't even got the shrink wrap off the current package when we start looking for the next one. Owning the software and using it doesn't seem to be as important as wanting it, looking forward to its arrival. This is known as the hungry ghost realm where we have made an occupation out of craving. We can never find satisfaction, it is like drinking salt water to quench our thirst."

When I read that, I instantly thought about Stinkfist.

I do not claim that the song has anything to do with buddhism or vice versa, but at least they seem to be about the same phenomenon.

You can read the whole introduction to buddhism article here: http://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/intro_bud.htm

[pink gentile]

i agree with a lot of what you say. although, i think in some instances he is talking about that the fact we have had so much of one thing, that we have to find something else to satisfy. for instance, if we find something ridiculously funny, eventually we will tire of it and then have to find something new. well, keep thinking. later

[scorpioali]

that is exactly the way that i have always thought about this song. we are being fed all of these images of violence and sex, and it's just so much, we do become desensitized to things. we just need to relax and rest our minds after having to deal with all of that bullshit, and that's what i think that song is all about.

[llewdargssor]

tool has won again. we are living irony here guys. the words, we're analysing and at the same time we are actually acting them out , and its funny, coz we've just been fistfucked by tool.

(but isn't that we all want llewdarg???)

[doubleyewdee]

Originally posted by wuphat
When the song says, "something has to change" I see it as we need to end this system of canned news and force-fed crap that MTV calls music not as a cry of more of the same tired shit just intensified another notch.

Here's the thing though.. I don't believe that MTV is "force fed." You have every opportunity to not watch MTV, not put up with The Wide World of ClearChannel Inc., not accept what is given to you just because it's the most readily available option. You can watch or not watch MTV as you please, you can turn your radio off and go find a book to immerse yourself in or some long-forgotten or put off project to work on.

I think that what needs to change is not the perennial opiate of the masses (pop entertainment) but the perception by those intelligent enough to know better that there is something wrong with *it* and not with *them*. The bottom line is that you are only a slave to popular culture as long as you allow yourself to be. Popular culture is not going away. It keeps 99% of the people who partake in it docile and distracted. It does what it is designed to do.

"Boredom is not a burden anyone should bear." It is up to *you* not to bear this burden. If you are bored then you need to do something about it, not complain that the machine is holding you back -- it most certainly is not.

I just turned on the song and had a thought.. what if it was some sort of 'internal dialogue'? The softer voice is the voice you know you're supposed to be listening to, the one that tells you to "turn around." The louder is the voice of the plebian, the slave to the bread and circusses. In the end of course you have to balance the two. You have to engage yourself, but you have to let go. You need to embrace your ability to extend yourself, but you also need to embrace the desire to be a jackass sometimes. There's nothing wrong with turning your brain off every now and then, as long as you know that you are the one responsible for this and the decision to do either is in your hands.

Then again, maybe it's 5:40am and I'm just a rambler. ;) YMMV.

[Meuterei]

I'd have to say I agree with some of your points, especially the inherent sarcasm in the "Boredom..." line.

As far as the addiction standpoint, the borrowed Elvis lyrics from "Suspicious Minds" that Maynard would sometimes sing when playing the song live ("caught in a trap... I can't walk out... because I love you too much, baby...") would certainly seem to support that...

I wonder...

[Hyatir]

"The bottom line is that you are only a slave to popular culture as long as you allow yourself to be."

The problem i have is with a close friend of mine who is a slave to the mass media and the popular opinions (homophobic, degrades women, emulates gangsters, uses "***" or "gay" a lot) He's a good kid inside and im trying to bring that out; unfortunately the rot of society runs deep and hes still being corrupted because either hes too scared to go agaisnt public opinion or he doesnt want to. Does anyone else have a similar situation? or Any ideas on ways to help would be GREATLY appreciated. Thank You.

[loser00]

i've been in the same situation as you before. if you can find a context relavent to him (in his view of the world) explain it to him how you see it, and, i guess, open his mind in a way (take a step back from his distractions), then he might be able to go from there, like understanding this quote from aeonblue on the stinkfist thread:

"Using the ocean as a metaphor for the field encompassing all music, tool is like the deep, dark trenches of the ocean that no one can truly ever see or reach, and we can only really guess as to what's actually going on; whereas, all the other music never quite reaches that depth, and the majority of it lies upon the shallow shorelines where herds of fat fucking human viruses can tap into its pulse and fully comprehend its base, fucking neanderthal meaning, if there is one. "

You'd be the only one to know what to say, since you actually know him.

im trying hard as i can not to sound like a psychologist tryhard, control freak, or just another wanker that wants to post something and use quotes, but sometimes my brain fails me in attempts to word my thoughts.

hope ive helped you Hyatir

by the way, i wouldve sent you an email, but ive got no idea how to work this forum jazz

[larips]

having never met this guy i can't really comment authoratively, but a wise man once said; someone who is nice to you but a jerk to the waiter is still a jerk.
I've been in similar situations. Used to work at dominos (the shame) and ended up as a manager (hte shame, the SHAME!). I was working with kids a few years younger than me, and watching them progress through various stages of consumer pop culture. I tried to take them under my wing, because I could see that they were nice and intelligent (really) and I felt that they deserved better. It was a lost cause. Save yourself the heartache and the pain. They need someone strong to guide them, and as much as I hate to say it, the billions of dollars involved in buying their minds and accessing their disposable incomes are stronger than me, and, I suspect, you.

On a related note, my faith in humantiy has increased significantly since I quit my pizza job. Seriously guys, if you ever feel that your life is fucked, the simplest and only way to adress it is to change something. It doesn't matter what. I know this probably sounds like so much corny crap, but it worked for me (and i'm not a born again christian, i swear).

Just occured to me that his also applies to the song stinkfist . Something isn't right. The singer is digging deeper and deeper to try and solve the problem. He is shoulder deep up someboby's ass looking for a solution. Perhaps he needs to take a hint and realise that a complete change is needed. If he hasn't found what he is looking for by the time his fist is coming out some poor bastards mouth, perhaps it is time to move on.

[ObviousParadox]

perfect, I read an interview with MJK and a professor, and he talks about it exactly as you did. In a world of instant gratification we almost demand things to be fast and easily accesable, we become numb to individual thought, so he'll keep trying to get you to feel something, it might hurt a little bit, but you'll get used to it.

[ObviousParadox]

whoops that should read Perfect ATO

[queenoftears]

Does anyone else have a similar situation? or Any ideas on ways to help would be GREATLY appreciated. Thank You. [/B][/QUOTE]

Usually it's just a lost cause. I have met some very nice girls here at work that are totally trendy, go along with anything and everything thats "in" people. I have tried to introduce them to Tool and tell them about things that I'm into and they don't care to even listen. There is only one girl that is open enough to tolerate it all and she's the only person I have maintained a personal relationship with. It's really hard when you get in that situation because you think you've met some nice people to hang out with or whatever and then the music they listen to and everthing they do is the most annoying thing EVER! I really don't understand why and how for that matter people can like that shit music. Yuck! It doesnt even mean anything. Anyway, now I'm rambling, I hope your friend is open minded enough to listen just a little bit, somehow you can get in.

[Counterpoint]

I do not mean to offend with what I am going to say but, why are you all sitting analysing the song? What is there to say that the song is merely to be taken at face value, or that it is not about one specific thing , but of lots of ideas put into one. I still think that we as listeners should not attempt to guess what MJK was intending with this song, or any of his songs for that matter. They are his songs, with his meanings, it is not or place to try and get into his thoughts.
The song can hold personal relevance but it may not actually be what the song is about.
I love this song purely because on first hearing it, it gave me goosebumps.
If I want a song that for ME has underlying meanings, I will write my own.

[bfusion]

I face the same frustration when talking to some of my friends that like tool. They like the song because they think it is about porno and fisting. I entirely agree with the fact that stinkfist was a song written about the desensitization of America. " Boredom is not a burden anyone should bear", is a saracastic statement mocking our culture and its addiction. In Choke Chuck Palahniuk states that everyone here is an addict. They are addicted to something, whether it be shopping of meth. Our obsessive behaviors are evident in every aspect of our expansion. Think about how we create, use up, abandon. We multiply uncontrollably unitl we use up all the resources, then we move. Over stimulation is just leading to more obsessive tendencies. A sort of downward spiral.

[holy reality]

I agree with the above, most of us are probably Tool addicts....

I see "boredoms not a burden anyone should bear" as meaning two things. First of all, it is sarcastic, it is making fun of the things you all describe. However if you think about it, it is also very true. You should never be bored, you have everything you need to alleviate boredom located right inside your head, but you are so numbed by things such as tv and games that you don't know how to use them.

I mean sometimes I can sit aorund and just think for a long time and not be bored, I don't need to be playing anything, or listening to anything, I just sit there and let my mind roam, I do this a lot in school when there is nothing to do, sometimes it works, sometimes "it's not enough, I need more" .....

So we should not have to bear boredom, because as intelligent beings capable of just about anything, we should be abole to find ways to be content and occupy our time, whether it be by doing something productive, or just sitting back and relaxing and thinking about things.

On the other hand, by taking the meaning of the sarcasm, people act like being bored is a sin and they need to be entertained and stimulated 24/7 by something artificial, tv, games, music, movies, drugs.

I myself love TV (it's select few good shows) and games and yes sometiems I do find myself wanting more, but I feel that I am maintaining a balance.

[Hyatir]

Originally posted by queenoftears
Usually it's just a lost cause. .

Bullshit. No such thing.

[xXlotusXx]

Originally posted by Counterpoint
I do not mean to offend with what I am going to say but, why are you all sitting analysing the song? What is there to say that the song is merely to be taken at face value, or that it is not about one specific thing , but of lots of ideas put into one. I still think that we as listeners should not attempt to guess what MJK was intending with this song, or any of his songs for that matter. They are his songs, with his meanings, it is not or place to try and get into his thoughts.
The song can hold personal relevance but it may not actually be what the song is about.
I love this song purely because on first hearing it, it gave me goosebumps.
If I want a song that for ME has underlying meanings, I will write my own.

when you enter this section of the site, it says that it is OUR interpretations, which is why we sit here and analyze the songs. i think it is great, and amazing how people have looked at these songs, tried to pck them apart with the meanings, and especially stinkfist, because it is such a symbolic song. sure, they are his songs and his thoughts, but i think it IS our place to try and "get into his thoughts"...if he did not want us to, then he would not be putting the music out on store shelves. he would be putting it on burned cds and keeping it on his own shelves.

i can see the relevance of this song to society, and how much is numbs us. but i still dont see how the lines "tell me that you love me and that we belong together, relax, turn around and take my hand." anyone have suggesttions?

this has got to be one of my personal favorites of tool. though i never even thought of it as being sexual, i always thought of the "finger deep" "shoulder deep" parts meaning, digging into a pile of junk and tyring to find something, and never really finding anything. realizing that, spending all the time trying to find something to stimulate your brain has been wasted, at least when trying to find it in the media, or society, or even a person that you think has some iota of intelligence or wisdom, but is just carrying a burdon of boredom. eh, i dont know. its late, and im tired. hopefully, i've made sense to someone.

[Endelicht]

Originally posted by Counterpoint
I do not mean to offend with what I am going to say but, why are you all sitting analysing the song? What is there to say that the song is merely to be taken at face value, or that it is not about one specific thing , but of lots of ideas put into one. I still think that we as listeners should not attempt to guess what MJK was intending with this song, or any of his songs for that matter. They are his songs, with his meanings, it is not or place to try and get into his thoughts.
The song can hold personal relevance but it may not actually be what the song is about.
I love this song purely because on first hearing it, it gave me goosebumps.
If I want a song that for ME has underlying meanings, I will write my own.

Even so, if he didn't want us to probe his thoughts, why make them public like he does?

[Lachrymologist]

Originally posted by loser00


"Using the ocean as a metaphor for the field encompassing all music, tool is like the deep, dark trenches of the ocean that no one can truly ever see or reach, and we can only really guess as to what's actually going on; whereas, all the other music never quite reaches that depth, and the majority of it lies upon the shallow shorelines where herds of fat fucking human viruses can tap into its pulse and fully comprehend its base, fucking neanderthal meaning, if there is one. "



Who's to say that the deepest part of the ocean is the most beautiful, or even better than the shallow part. Just because it is easy to understand doesn't mean that it isn't good music.

[Druzzel Dermgo]

tool has won again. we are living irony here guys. the words, we're analysing and at the same time we are actually acting them out , and its funny, coz we've just been fistfucked by tool.

(but isn't that we all want llewdarg???) [/B][/QUOTE]

How could you say that? Tool isn't looking to WIN anything. What would they need to win? Granted they have fans, fans who overanalyze their music...but I think that's some of what they want - that and the money - but really, I think that they would play their music to no one. They would go to a stadium and jam. Even if no one wanted to hear any of their music. Then again, I think that they want to tour - they wouldn't tour for two years if they didn't.

As for stinkfist, it could be about television, about being over blasted with television, but if it was, they wouldn't say things like, "I can help you change tired moments into pleasure. Just say the word and we'll be well upon our way." or, "bend and balance pain and pleasure till you won't want me any other way."

I don't know EXACTLY what I think this song is...but I think it's a cry for help, and an answer. Like a friend or girlfriend, or mother, or brother calling for help. Being over desensitized, and needing pulled out. If not, then I'm wrong. Tool's too spiritual - too real - ...to make a song disowning MTV. They're part of MTV.

[Druzzel Dermgo]

or Any ideas on ways to help would be GREATLY appreciated. Thank You.

Look, with most people who listen to pop music, or atleast the music that is "popular", they won't listen to Tool. It'll stike a chord in them, and they'll be afraid, so they'll shun it. I've seen it all to often. People who like Slipknot, or even Linkin Park, they won't listen to Tool, and if they do, not often, and they call Tool "Okay, I guess". So, it's pretty useless to try to change people's views today. All you can do is show them.

I have a friend. When we first met, she listened to...pop music, and Marylin Manson. She was a really angry/depressed person, so I told her to listen to Tool. She had heard schism, even seen the video (I hadn't at the time...didn't see it for almost a year and three quarters) and she didn't really like them that much. so I let her borrow Lateralus - she's the biggest Tool fan other than myself that I know personally. We have really spiritual conversaitions based around Tool...

So yeah, you can only influence the open...

[Druzzel Dermgo]

I love this song purely because on first hearing it, it gave me goosebumps.
If I want a song that for ME has underlying meanings, I will write my own.

I can't agree with you there. Loving the songs - that's great - but...Tool's music, it's not all about themselves. They want people to hear it.

Justin on an interview with the radio station I listen to, on the Tool Disectional Segment that they did (Hard Drive, it's called) said that they love to hear new bands. They pick up good sounding bands and ask them to open for them, so that they can help them get into the music buisness...but he also that he in particular ejoys hearing people say that their music has helped them out incredibly...they like to hear that people are helped by them.

So...tool wants to affect people. They don't want you to write your own songs if you want songs with meaning...