Questions, questions...

[Atratus]

It seems to me as though the person who sings The Patient has forgotten why he had chosen 'this tedious path'. Indeed, he repeats almost Mantra-like "i must keep reminding myself of this" near the end of the song.
Had he not, it seems as though he surely wouldn't have been tired of spending his energy pursuing it.

This makes me wonder why he forgot or doubted the reasons or rewards of his path in the first place anyway. And wether the reasons he started on it (which might be found in the grudge) are the same as the rewards that make him stay.

Also, he still may leave. Then what about the rewards? Will he keep them, or lose them, or forget them? Won't he keep reminding himself?
I don't know for sure wether the tracks lateralus follow like a story, but assuming they do, does The Patient stick with his path as he heads into Mantra (which i'd say so), or does he change, ever? Perhaps not until after reflection?

To realize the possibility to leave early or to complete any given path is often very reassuring to me, and gives me the confidence and strength, the energy really, to pursue it. Unfortunately, this hasn't proven me to be free; it seems i can't as easily change directions in life as i'd like to. Or maybe i just wouldn't like to and have 'forgotten'. I don't know...

Anyway, it doesn't always feel exactly like a "loving embrace" to me - actually... I just realize it does, on my own part most often. It's as though i'm embracing someone or something else, like a sport or an instrument.

I'd even say i'd be healing them if i wouldn't come off too arrogant. I don't like i make that good music, but it seems everyone gets off on it. If you liked my post, and learned something from it, i'm glad; believe me it's my first post here and there are many times i've stopped writing

Perhaps it's no coincidence then that when i actually finish one it's about The Patient.

[paraflux]

Like I think Aenima actually starts with Eulogy, I think Lateralus starts with Mantra/Schism. The Grudge and The Patient are like introductions, or prequels to the rest of the record, just like I see Stinkfist being the intro to AEnima. Schism addresses the problem we face (also the first single) by being humans in this age, how we need to reconcile our polarities. The rest of the record explains why. It shows through example what is possible when we move our egos aside (lateral us) and become what is our birthright.

The patient is the speaker (not necessarily Maynard, thank you so much for making that distinction) just going through the trials he must endure, similar to Jesus. Jesus wondered why he had to do what he had to do, even though he could have activated his merkaba and winked out of this dimension. Its a tribulation song, a tribute to those messengers who spend their earthly lives trying to help fellow humans open up and see what could be in store for them.

[Atratus]

Further random thoughts:
Coming right after an instrumental song with Apocalypse in the title, i suppose The Patient might be from a post-apocalyptic perspective: a new beginning of a slow rebuilding, which might proceed in mantra and sound like a familiar theme listening to Schism. This would also mean that the Grudge is the beginning of the end, Apocalypse being the very end.

When i first became somewhat aware of what The Patient might be about (listening to the lyrics, etc.), i immediately felt the strangest sense of boredom, impatience, tedium. It wasn't like what you get watching a TV commercial, because i was enjoying the music. But then again it was, because of the relatively slow, rythmic, repetitive nature of the song. Also, i always feel people who make the most boring commercials know how i feel about them (annoyed), and then accept it and mock it by making a typical brainwash and -fabric softener. Kinda feels like TOOL made the song annoyingly repetitive just to get the point across, (and then to get the money.)

The difference is, when i'm trying to figure out the point Tool might be attempting to get across, i feel like singing the patient. When i bother to figure out the lecherous minds that make up those wash commercials, i feel like Ticks&Leeches. But, that may not be wisdom.

Also, if Lateralus means with regard anything to, say, processes other than those pertaining to humans or human consciousness, then i'm curious what place The Patient would take.

The image that keeps recurring to me is that of a pot of water freezing or boiling over. I vaguely recall that when the pot of water freezes, or in other words the water undergoes a change of fase (ehm, translate anyone?), All of the water must reach the same temperature before Any of it will begin to freeze. Is this right?
And after that, you can cool or heat the freezing/boiling water, but it's temperature won't change until All of it has either turned to ice or boiled away. Then the temperature of ice or gas may change further. Right?

So if you'd be looking at the temperature, you wouldn't see the water slowly changing to steam, but if you were looking at the structure of the water, you wouldn't see the temperature rise, and would probably be surprised as it would suddenly start deconstructing into steam.

Also, i'm curious to know what happens during those final moments when the water changes from one state into the other, and how that might be translated to the experience of a change in consciousness. But maybe all this has nothing to do with The Patient, so i'll be interested to hear what you think of all this.

[Atratus]

Hey thanks for the reply. I read a couple of posts. Always good stuff! You're probably familiar with alot of what i say, but feel free to ask. Also feel free to correct my mistakes.

You're likely very right about where Lateralus begins, but one thing bothers me. Aside from the point that each song has it's own beginning, one could easily say it begins with the Grudge, no?

So, "Lateralus starts with Mantra/Schism." Why would you say this then? Here's how i'd make sense of it.

The thing that bothers me is that The idea of an earthly messenger considering his existence on earth, seperate from the heavens, appeals to me. However, this guy speaks as though he's halfway on a path. For what you said to be true, his choice to either stay or leave would have to be a new beginning. But then what kind of new beginning?

Well, it makes a little bit more sense when i tie it in with the Tree of Life, which i hope you all can tell me alot about. If i'm not careful this will stretch on forever, raising more and more questions. But here's what i'd do:

The first three songs i'd say correspond with the Supernal Sefirot of Kether, Chokmah and Binah. The first one below the abyss and accesible to human incarnation would be Chesed, or Mantra.

Chesed is often associated with love and memory ("loving embrance" - "must remind myself of this").
If The Patient corresponds to Binah, then Mantra would be Chesed. However, this line of reasoning becomes more difficult to uphold as the album progresses. And already the second song seems difficult to correlate to Chokmah. If, considering the Crowley, seperation is pain, and if god initially split himself into two and therewith created the world, i can see how that might hurt enough to call it an apocalypse. But other than Chokmah as the idea of 'anotherness' emerging,

Still, The Patient corresponds nicely to Binah. With Binah emerges of the concept of measure and individuality. An earthly existence as an individual human being for heavenly messengers implies a heavenly existence as... something else. This could indeed be a tribute to those who choose to cross the abyss and descend from Binah to Chesed.

So, did i sense make of it? Well at least i'm glad i've written this stuff down for a change.

[paraflux]

You know more about the tree of Sephirot than I do.
Forgive me, but I dont get the same concepts that you do when I hear the song. I think when he says he may leave it means he still might walk away from the path of the prophet, the path of the teacher and healer. Where he might go is anyone's guess. Its not the point; the point is the teachers and healers and prophets of today and yesterday all felt this desire to leave the tedious task of trying to help humans. Humans never learn, we are stubborn, we do not provide a very accommodating environment for them.

[Atratus]

Originally posted by paraflux
You know more about the tree of Sephirot than I do.
Forgive me, but I dont get the same concepts that you do when I hear the song.

That's alright. I asked about Tol partly to understand the Patient, and partly because i wanted to learn about Tol, but it might not fit together much.

I think when he says he may leave it means he still might walk away from the path of the prophet, the path of the teacher and healer. Where he might go is anyone's guess. Its not the point; the point is the teachers and healers and prophets of today and yesterday all felt this desire to leave the tedious task of trying to help humans. Humans never learn, we are stubborn, we do not provide a very accommodating environment for them.

Yes, point taken, and i agree. It doesn't matter where he might go so that would be asking the wrong questions, as far as lateralus concerned. I'll keep it in the back of my mind for some other time.