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GreenBudsGreenTea
06-07-2006, 06:40 AM
I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Here from the king's mountain view (I am on top of the world)
Here from the wild dream come true ( Its a dream come true)
Feast like a sultan, I do .... ( I love the excess)
On treasures and flesh never few ( money and women especially)


But I would wish it all, away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day (But I love you and would give it up)


The devil and his had me down ( I know a dark side of excess)
In love with the dark side I've found ( and I tended to like it )
Dabblin' all the way down ( I tried it all )
Up to my neck soon to drown. ( It was starting to be a problem)

But you changed that all for me ( but then you came into my life)
Lifted me up, turned me round ( and I realized you were more important)


So I, I would wish this all away ( So I would give it up)


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)


But I
I would
If I could
I would
Wish it away
Wish it away
Wish it all away
Wanna wish it all away ( I wanted to leave this life in a way)
No person could hold sway ( nobody could tell me to change)
Or justify my toe just a fine line (nobody could justify my being at the edge)
Giving away my center ( I was giving away my energy and love )


So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow, they'd take you away ( I realize now )


You're my piece of mind, ( your my focus )
my own (my own son)
my center (my new center of focus and love)
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day ( I am taking it day by day..like anyone else)


Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...
If they should compromise
A fulcrum (Damn them if they lead me to stray from the balance I have found)
Want and need; ( I need to be mindful of what I want -vs- what I need)
if I need, ( beacause if I need the excess )
Then I might as well be gone... ( I might as well not be here for you at all )


Shine on forever ( Let your love and spirit and who you are shine on forever)
Shine on benevolent son (my SON )
Shine down upon the broken ( Let it shine on me untill my two personas balance)
Shine on 'til the two become one (untill I find that balance through my love of son)


Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent son
Shine down upon the severed
Shine [on 'til / until] the two become one (see above)


Divide and wither away ( If I try to keep these aspects divided I wither away)
Divided, withering away
Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son. ( Let your love of your son heal you )


Breathe in union ( So let these two aspects of myself come together)

So, as one, survive (And as one person survive)
Another day and season (and it will get easier day to day ...season to season)
Silence legion save your poison (And temptation to slip dont speak)
Silence legion stay out of my way (And temptation to slip get out of my way)


I really feel like this is it.

A few things to keep in mind :

The whole Son/Sun thing and Jambi being a kingdom with a sultan in Indonesia is fine...Maynard loves the dual meanings....in between sniffs/sips of coke anyone ?

He talks in 10,000 days/Wings about the little light she gave to him he is going to let it shine to guide her home........hmmmm letting a light shine to heal and guide someone you love dearly..... (see above)

Also this song before 10k days/Wings makes sense in that it is about his relationship of focus with his future (son) into his relationship of focus with his past (mom)....nice transition in my opinion....

Of course I dont expect my interpretation to change the masses minds but I can relate...

I used to party everynight.....Wine Women and Song....I made a ton of money and spent it on everything from limos to keeping the party going well into the next morning......Then my son was born and I realized when I held him for the first time that my life was forever changed.....I gave up the life and took a less demanding new job where altough I make a little less money I have more time to spend with my son my new center of focus for 3 years now...

I still party here and there but in a much more subdued way and will gladly not go out if I can spend some quality time with my son.

He changed my life and now it is my job to change his.....

I think thats the spirit in which Maynard wrote this one.....

What do you think ?

TurdEye13
06-07-2006, 06:43 AM
that is great man

smirk
06-07-2006, 06:48 AM
Good stuff, I can relate. I have two sons, 15 and four months, and they do chage your prorities. This is a good analysis of the tune I think.

paraflux
06-07-2006, 06:49 AM
Of all the threads about Maynard's family I think this is perhaps the best one. One I can agree with.

GreenBudsGreenTea
06-07-2006, 06:56 AM
Thanks...I dig the fact that I am pretty new here and people with thousands of posts can get behind my idea

Pierre-Paul
06-07-2006, 07:08 AM
I think this is the best interpretation I've read from this song.

I'd even go as far as to say this is the "right" interpretation (as in "what Maynard intended").

However, even if you constructed the "skeleton" of the song doesn't mean it hasn't a whole lotta meat to chew on.

The wrong thing to do now would be to stop analysing the song because we've found "it".

As you said, Maynard loves dual meanings, and that's what makes poetry great: the poem doesn't mean the same for everyone, and we can discuss about it. And that's exactly what you did and I thank you for that.

paraflux
06-07-2006, 07:11 AM
Thanks...I dig the fact that I am pretty new here and people with thousands of posts can get behind my idea
Most threads about Maynard's family I dont even read past the first paragraph before rolling my eyes.

MoreTool
06-08-2006, 11:57 AM
good job!!

paraflux
06-08-2006, 11:58 AM
Yeah, I think this one deserved to be stickied, not because I happen to agree with it, but because there arent really any holes in it.

I do like this interpretation better than mine, though.

GreenBudsGreenTea
06-08-2006, 02:07 PM
Sticky ...............Sweet

:)

paraflux
06-08-2006, 02:08 PM
uh-oh... -10 for quoting def leppard lyrics though

BlindVisionary
06-08-2006, 02:10 PM
I think this is a great interpretation...

Getting kind of annoyed that Tool are supposed to be so different yet the lyrics are all about Maynard. None of the other band members get a chance. I'm sure they have some emotional/personal problems they'd like to get off their chest...

NoD
06-08-2006, 02:11 PM
This song is not about his son, it's about Jesus

A Spirit of Radio
06-08-2006, 05:04 PM
yeah so think about this. the lust that maynard wants to give up-that was bad for him -is also what is responsible for the creation of his son.
the talk box guitar solo represents lust to me in this song. when i hear it, it reminds me of sexual desire. right after that solo is a guitar part that reminds me of the actual act of sex and the end of it. that leads straight into the magnificent sun part which i believe is a double reference- to devo and to the sun which impregnated the fertile earth and gave rise to man.

any thoughts? dig deep

bellamadia
06-08-2006, 05:10 PM
This is a great interpretation. Even if TOOL didn't intend this to be the meaning, it fits well and is a great meaning to take away from this. Very, very nice!

Warartist
06-09-2006, 07:24 AM
It's good! I've also heard it in quite a few threads already. I don't think its about his son personally, and I'm sticking by "son" actually being (SUN). It just makes more since that way with out reading way to deep into things you don't know much about. Such as Maynard's personal life.
I also don't think it's about his mother with him referring to her as his shining sun. Now I know I am just throwing out another bias opinion like allot of people here, but I'm sticking by it being about a person who is battling with their own destructive wants that could fuck up the good life they already have. The grass is always greener thing that I've stated be for. That and if it does have to do with a person I would think it sounds more like it would be about his lady. Witch I've also said be for.
Any ways the point is to figure out what it means to you, and if for you it relates to a child in your life thats cool. You probably wont find out what it meant to Tool though.

Mandy

Krys Nyteshade
06-09-2006, 08:37 AM
Very good analysis.

Sasha
06-09-2006, 09:08 AM
Great thread and great contributions thus far.

This is what I envisioned somewhat of the song being about, but to this day I really haven't analyzed the lyrics thouroughly for any of the songs. I'm still letting the music, and the wholeness sink in first.

One thing worth mentioning as you said and a couple of others did is that like most of Maynard's writings, it has more than one purpose, more than one way, more than one interepretation. So with that in mind a more broader perspective could be dubbed in to include other members of the band. We know not much of their personal lives, but everyone living in this world has something that they hold on to more than anything in their life, something they treasure, with Maynard it's his son, and with Adam and Danny, and Justin it's something else. So to be bleak and point out that Maynard is being slefish (as someone did above in less words) is absurd. I'm 18, I don't have a child, and yet I relate to this song so emotionally and personally. The lyrics may seem as if they are presented in a Maynard-first-format, but that's because we know most about him than any other member in the band. He is the one that shared bands, one that was much more mainstream, and out there, and open, and he is also the lead member in majority's eyes of Tool, which puts pressure for a significant amount of information to be gathered about him. So, our aspects of viewing most songs through his eyes is because he is the writer, the speaker of the bunch, the source of their ideas. As well, this whole album has much more simpler lyrical content than say the previous two, and in that regard and in the regard that the Wings duo song is about his mother, and that the Rosetta Stoned journey has been witnessed only by him (according to Blair) makes it more obvious for our opinions to side with Maynard point of view, but any great writer gets everyone involved. So when Adam mentions that this project is the one most closest to him and most emotional, and when Danny proclaims that it is their "blues album" they're not lying, but saying that they get a lot from it as well. I sincerely don't think that Maynard would overtake an albums lyrical collective just to suit himself (and more importantly I don't think the rest of the band would allow it), and I don't believe that he is that egotistical as well to exlude everyone else and focus on himself and his troubles first and foremost. I think you guys that are taking this road are overlooking the very band that he's been with for 10+ years now, the same band that believes in this collective spirit, that we are all bound, the whole theme of Lateralus in becoming open and inviting with yourself and letting others in and being more patient, and calm and collected surely does lead to a change in lifestyle and a change in thoughts that would sure as hell not make him turn out to be some selfish prick.

Typical
06-10-2006, 02:33 PM
great interpretation. so far i haven't been able to come up with any interpretation that works better than this one, and you took it way further than my lazy ass ever would have.

JOK3R
06-10-2006, 03:23 PM
i definitely agree with this interpretation. this is what i was thinking it is about. nice post

und_keine_eier
06-14-2006, 05:14 PM
wow i have to admit i never looked at this song through a positive light the way you did. i always imagined the line "but i would wish it all away if i could loose you just one day" was maynard saying he WANTED this "thing" to leave (whatever it may be) i dont completely see this song the way you do...but i am glad to see another side of things...thanks!

HelenA
06-15-2006, 04:49 AM
I think this is a great interpretation...

Getting kind of annoyed that Tool are supposed to be so different yet the lyrics are all about Maynard. None of the other band members get a chance. I'm sure they have some emotional/personal problems they'd like to get off their chest...

You have to admire a guy that gets two whole bands to sing about his mother.

I mean it must be funny in rehearsals when he turns up and goes "Hey guys - I ve written a new song. Its about ..." and the whole band finishes with "Yeah, we know - its about your Mother".

Its so rich and awesome though, you can't help but admire his ability to mine down into the emotional depths and uncover so many layers of thought.

I should give so much thought to MY mother - I am sure she is equally awesome!

bellamadia
06-15-2006, 05:48 AM
I mean it must be funny in rehearsals when he turns up and goes "Hey guys - I ve written a new song. Its about ..." and the whole band finishes with "Yeah, we know - its about your Mother".


ha ha that gave me a hilarious visual.

TJP
06-15-2006, 04:29 PM
I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Here from the king's mountain view (I am on top of the world)
Here from the wild dream come true ( Its a dream come true)
Feast like a sultan, I do .... ( I love the excess)
On treasures and flesh never few ( money and women especially)


But I would wish it all, away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day (But I love you and would give it up)


The devil and his had me down ( I know a dark side of excess)
In love with the dark side I've found ( and I tended to like it )
Dabblin' all the way down ( I tried it all )
Up to my neck soon to drown. ( It was starting to be a problem)

But you changed that all for me ( but then you came into my life)
Lifted me up, turned me round ( and I realized you were more important)


So I, I would wish this all away ( So I would give it up)


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)


But I
I would
If I could
I would
Wish it away
Wish it away
Wish it all away
Wanna wish it all away ( I wanted to leave this life in a way)
No person could hold sway ( nobody could tell me to change)
Or justify my toe just a fine line (nobody could justify my being at the edge)
Giving away my center ( I was giving away my energy and love )


So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow, they'd take you away ( I realize now )


You're my piece of mind, ( your my focus )
my own (my own son)
my center (my new center of focus and love)
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day ( I am taking it day by day..like anyone else)


Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...
If they should compromise
A fulcrum (Damn them if they lead me to stray from the balance I have found)
Want and need; ( I need to be mindful of what I want -vs- what I need)
if I need, ( beacause if I need the excess )
Then I might as well be gone... ( I might as well not be here for you at all )


Shine on forever ( Let your love and spirit and who you are shine on forever)
Shine on benevolent son (my SON )
Shine down upon the broken ( Let it shine on me untill my two personas balance)
Shine on 'til the two become one (untill I find that balance through my love of son)


Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent son
Shine down upon the severed
Shine [on 'til / until] the two become one (see above)


Divide and wither away ( If I try to keep these aspects divided I wither away)
Divided, withering away
Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son. ( Let your love of your son heal you )


Breathe in union ( So let these two aspects of myself come together)

So, as one, survive (And as one person survive)
Another day and season (and it will get easier day to day ...season to season)
Silence legion save your poison (And temptation to slip dont speak)
Silence legion stay out of my way (And temptation to slip get out of my way)


I really feel like this is it.

A few things to keep in mind :

The whole Son/Sun thing and Jambi being a kingdom with a sultan in Indonesia is fine...Maynard loves the dual meanings....in between sniffs/sips of coke anyone ?

He talks in 10,000 days/Wings about the little light she gave to him he is going to let it shine to guide her home........hmmmm letting a light shine to heal and guide someone you love dearly..... (see above)

Also this song before 10k days/Wings makes sense in that it is about his relationship of focus with his future (son) into his relationship of focus with his past (mom)....nice transition in my opinion....

Of course I dont expect my interpretation to change the masses minds but I can relate...

I used to party everynight.....Wine Women and Song....I made a ton of money and spent it on everything from limos to keeping the party going well into the next morning......Then my son was born and I realized when I held him for the first time that my life was forever changed.....I gave up the life and took a less demanding new job where altough I make a little less money I have more time to spend with my son my new center of focus for 3 years now...

I still party here and there but in a much more subdued way and will gladly not go out if I can spend some quality time with my son.

He changed my life and now it is my job to change his.....

I think thats the spirit in which Maynard wrote this one.....

What do you think ?Cool thread dude.

Warartist
06-15-2006, 05:35 PM
You have to admire a guy that gets two whole bands to sing about his mother.

I mean it must be funny in rehearsals when he turns up and goes "Hey guys - I ve written a new song. Its about ..." and the whole band finishes with "Yeah, we know - its about your Mother".

Its so rich and awesome though, you can't help but admire his ability to mine down into the emotional depths and uncover so many layers of thought.

I should give so much thought to MY mother - I am sure she is equally awesome!

Your funny!
Ya Jambi isn't about mommy..... Well I don't think so anyways.

Omar Rodriguez-Mopez
06-15-2006, 06:55 PM
So how did he exactly get a kid? Marriage? Girlfriend? Adoption?

HelenA
06-16-2006, 01:52 AM
Your funny!
Ya Jambi isn't about mommy..... Well I don't think so anyways.

No - I don't think so either. I was just musing about how Tool rehearsals might be.

Warartist
06-16-2006, 05:20 PM
No - I don't think so either. I was just musing about how Tool rehearsals might be.

Ya dude I got it, seriously I thought it was really funny:)

#Notion
06-17-2006, 09:24 AM
Jambi Eyes....


Why the fuck did he say that?

Warartist
06-17-2006, 11:51 AM
I'm pretty sure he did it just to piss you off man...;)

#Notion
06-19-2006, 03:26 PM
I'm pretty sure he did it just to piss you off man...;)

Lol

Florida_Mike
06-19-2006, 06:06 PM
Another thought about this passages:

You're my peace of mind, my own
I said I'm just trying to hold on, one more day

It really sounds like he says "om" (phonetically). I thought ohm at first, but that makes absolutely no sense, as I don't think MJK is singing about impedence. A trip to our friend over at Wikipedia reveals that Om (or Aum) is particularly important in Hinduism and Buddhism.


An excerpt for those too lazy to actually read the Wiki:

Quote:
The symbol of Om contains of three curves, one semicircle and a dot. The large lower curve symbolizes the waking state; the upper curve denotes deep sleep (or the unconscious) state, and the lower curve (which lies between deep sleep and the waking state) signifies the dream state. These three states of an individual’s consciousness, and therefore the entire physical phenomenon, are represented by the three curves. The dot signifies the Absolute (fourth or Turiya state of consciousness), which illuminates the other three states. The semicircle symbolizes Maya and separates the dot from the other three curves. The semicircle is open on the top, which means that the absolute is infinite and is not affected by maya. Maya only affects the manifested phenomenon. In this way the form of Om symbolizes the infinite Brahman and the entire Universe and the world. Aum is made out of the three gods Shiva and Ganesh and Gayatri.


I realize that "my own" works just fine, but it's something to consider.

inSin
06-19-2006, 06:17 PM
nice work. you got me convinced.

ktrip
06-19-2006, 07:50 PM
greenbuds, i think you are right, but in my interp. i see him as telling his son to wait until his distractions are done with, so that they can "breathe in union"....

"...damn my eyes if they should compromise a fulcrum..." -nard cant focus on his son yet, because he still has important work with tool [and even maybe cadacues] to do, and needs to focus all his energy on that. and i think the song is about telling devo [his son] to wait for tool to be finished, so that he doesnt do a half assed job with tool and half assed job with devo.
"shine on... until the two become one" hes sayin to devo to shine on until the two things that are important two him, become one [i.e. tool breaking up *pause for tears*] and the end, "silence leech, and save your poison" [i just dont hear legion] nard sure does love his 'lachrymology' growth through pain... "silence leech, and stay out of my way" leave me alone, let me finish this, and then i can focus on you...

i dunno, im hell stoned and at school, i might not be making sense.

#Notion
06-21-2006, 03:08 PM
You can hear 'legion' real clearly, he almost sounds feminine on the -gion part the way he sings it, you should give it another listen. But I agree with your interpretation.

Warartist
06-21-2006, 09:42 PM
Ya, it's legion.

HelenA
06-24-2006, 12:15 AM
[i.e. tool breaking up *pause for tears*]

Don't even say it out loud!

njm
06-24-2006, 12:32 AM
Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...


Good interpretation dude. I like it too...

Doesn't anyone hear "jam my eyes"??

If that's what is heard, then I guess he is wishing that the vision he has (for whatever), that is expressed through his song has done this to him. Thus, if his eyes were jammed then the vision wouldn't be there, and the 'problem' would go away. Well, maybe anyway..

(Right now I am thinking of Space balls the movie, and the jam in the satellite dish!!)

njm
06-24-2006, 12:35 AM
I agree, since I made almost the same statement only not as good written. (Irony & Powerful thread).

It is fitting that you "not as good written" this thread in a thread with the title IRONY. OH, the irony! (or is it sarcasm?)

orangedarkblue
06-24-2006, 02:34 AM
Why the fuck did he say that?

'Jambi eyes'

who knows dude, you could argue that it's reference to the fear filled eyes of the good people of Jambi, when they saw the tsunami (http://www.geophys.washington.edu/tsunami/general/physics/meaning.html) coming, and in the context of the song it would then probably refer to Devo accidentally prying open the cellardoor and catching his daddy performing some really evol black magic stinkfisting on his mommy, possibly involving a pair of parrots and a winebottle Chateau Maynard, - this ritual of course has some Higher Meaning, but poor Devo doesnt get it and only sees the gritty material manifestation. -

Hence 'Jambi eyes'.

Then again, who knows?

farley
06-24-2006, 11:38 AM
Sticky, sweet job on the interpretation bro i am in full agreeance

RidetheRedshift
06-26-2006, 03:54 PM
Hey Green Buds. That shit about your son and you finding something more than just drugs/money in this world, fuck man. That's beautiful. I'm sure he's going to make you and you're going to make him, very proud. These sacrifices aren't for nothing. Your love has an effect on not only your son, but the kids at school he talks to and his mom, etcetcetc.

And also thanks for opening up personally. It's hard to do but "Those who mind don't matter, and those that matter don't mind" (dr. suess). Let your little light shine!!!

GreenBudsGreenTea
06-28-2006, 07:00 AM
Thanks for all the positive feedback.....I havent check on this post in a bit and am glad for the most part people can get behind it or at least see it as a definate option.....I never saw my idea on someone elses post or I certainly would have given you credit for at least forming the base of my idea....

Anyways.....I wanted to touch upon the Jambi eyes lyric and what I think it means...I wanted to edit the original post but dont think I can...But anyway.... I see Jambi not as a literal place or a genie but as a symbol

Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)

Jambi Eyes.... ( These eyes of mine that lead me away from my responsibility and lead me to the exotic and mystical experience)

Damn my eyes...

I certainly dont think that the exotic and mystical is "wrong" or "evil" I think within the context of my interpritation Maynard is saying that he needs to find a balance and damn his eyes ....his mystical seeking eyes ...that lead him to temptation.....I know you can obtain the Mystical and Exotic through other means but really how many of us obtain them through a real hardcore night of sex and drugs ?

If you go back and read the original post coupled with this new though I think you will get a good idea of where I am coming from.....

As always.....what are your thoughts ????

GreenBudsGreenTea
06-28-2006, 08:33 AM
Almost as if Jambi eyes were a sort of rose colored glasses

Rose colored glasses = Optimism

Jambi Eyes = Exotic experience loving or hedonistic behavior

The Dharma Bum
06-28-2006, 09:00 AM
In light of the fact that I just found out yesterday that I am going to be a father, I couldn't agree more with this inturpretation. Good Job.

The Dark Jester
06-28-2006, 04:58 PM
Definitely one of the better thought-out interpretations I've seen, and I tend to agree, I've kicked around the idea of this song reagarding to his son. Point to remember-->Jambi is the name of the genie from Peewee's playhouse, maybe Devo's a fan?

savelints8
06-30-2006, 10:13 AM
To the OP, nice thoughts on the song. I like your perspective.

Doubt
07-02-2006, 04:26 AM
Great interperation!

krizzzle
07-03-2006, 03:30 PM
Forgive me for the overwhelming praise,

But this is by far the most coherent, lucid, and deeply-rooted interpretation which I've seen thus far. It brings sence to the next two songs, in maynard's personal component of the album.

While there are some points which remain questionable, this is definitly an interp formulated to obscure any ambiguities. Well done, and I shall claim credit for you when I discuss this elsewhere.

Warartist
07-04-2006, 08:08 AM
I don't get why everyone here thinks this interpretation is so unique. There are a million post's like this already stating, just like it is here it's about the kid or the mom. What, other than trying to over relate Tool's music to your personal lives makes you think this song has any thing to do with Devo or his mom? I think it's pretty presumptuous. I'm not saying its bad to relate to the music in your own way, just that you shouldn't assume thats what was meant to be.
Also, just because the title is Jambi doesn't mean it's any where in the song. I don't hear a J. I'll go with dim maybe but I hear damn. It makes since, damn these eyes of mine for showing me the wants that could destroy my everything. Jam or Jambi just doesn't make since. It could be dim in the same context as damn like dim them to only show what is important and block the rest from my vision...
Anyways I'm not trying to piss any one off, but seriously this interpretation of the song seems bias to me. It has every time I've heard it.
M.

koolerthanjesus
07-06-2006, 04:24 PM
well said friends but...
i signed on today purposefully to suggest that the same change be made but for different reasons. Although I know little of his family (and wish to remain so oblivious to such matters since I feel I shouldnt bother to spend time 'dabbing' into his personal space- theres that fine line between artist and fanhood that, in most cases I'm sure, are where an artists' life seems most penetrated is by his very fans- with help, of course from the major media outlets) but following the pattern of his lyricism of the past, I've noticed the same in Maynard as with myself (and may be inherent in some of you)- his struggle with (or without) religion. In this case, benevolent "son" could mean or signify the end of that struggle and his final acceptance of Christ, son of God. (On the otherhand, he could be glorifing the belief of the coming of the antichrist, as depicted in films such as The Devils Advocate, where Keanu Reeves is to have sex with his sister to give birth to the son of Satan, Al Pacino.) Again, as is always the case concerning art, beauty's in the eye of the beholder. And the beauty here, need I point it out, is not in the words that accompany the sounds (or vice versa) but rather, its the mind of the individual writer, MJK, and mans constant struggle over the who, what, why, where, when, and how of his wonderful and wretched world. So, forgive me Lord for my blasphemy, the so-called 'unforgivable' sin, and (as a result of his witnessing the birth of his own son)...

Damn these eyes for what they've seen in the past...when the very truth has been there in front of me all along.

bmeason
07-06-2006, 04:36 PM
well said friends but...
i signed on today purposefully to suggest that the same change be made but for different reasons. Although I know little of his family (and wish to remain so oblivious to such matters since I feel I shouldnt bother to spend time 'dabbing' into his personal space- theres that fine line between artist and fanhood that, in most cases I'm sure, are where an artists' life seems most penetrated is by his very fans- with help, of course from the major media outlets) but following the pattern of his lyricism of the past, I've noticed the same in Maynard as with myself (and may be inherent in some of you)- his struggle with (or without) religion. In this case, benevolent "son" could mean or signify the end of that struggle and his final acceptance of Christ, son of God. (On the otherhand, he could be glorifing the belief of the coming of the antichrist, as depicted in films such as The Devils Advocate, where Keanu Reeves is to have sex with his sister to give birth to the son of Satan, Al Pacino.) Again, as is always the case concerning art, beauty's in the eye of the beholder. And the beauty here, need I point it out, is not in the words that accompany the sounds (or vice versa) but rather, its in the mind of the individual writer, MJK, and mans constant struggle over the who, what, why, where, when, and how of his wonderful and wretched world.

Completely. That is what enriches the lyrics, it is personal, and can be personal and helpful to you and yours via understanding. What it makes you think of, what the song is.

If we knew exactly what he meant by each song, then in all aspects, they wouldn't be ours. :)

koolerthanjesus
07-06-2006, 04:56 PM
Completely. That is what enriches the lyrics, it is personal, and can be personal and helpful to you and yours via understanding. What it makes you think of, what the song is.

If we knew exactly what he meant by each song, then in all aspects, they wouldn't be ours. :)

Yes, of course, but if you look closely at what I've done you'll notice that I've made the relation and connection between both interpretations and perpespectives and subsequently, an end to the matter at hand. No further room for discussion- the President has spoken and the faithful Press and media have delivered it as thus. Now go about your daily lives watching television and reading up on the latest gossup surrounding Hollywood as you grow fatter and fatter and fatter and fatter and....

njm
07-11-2006, 04:18 AM
I think this line:

"Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son"

doesn't fit with the interpretation you have offered. Why, or even how, would the personal son - the child - shine on upon the many? I really think this line is crucial, it suggests a more global feeling, rather than just between father and son.

It can very easily be interpreted as an ode to jesus if it weren't for all the pre-conceived notions that we (myself included) take into our interpretations. Personally I don't think this, but I can see how it could be interpreted that way. It is not healing love of one (the father) rather healing love for the MANY. It is not my path that is illuminated, it is OUR path.

So, hate to use the J word and throw people off! What I really mean is: Rather than the archetypal saviour that jesus has become - many times removed from the reality of the person - it could be about the personal relationship with God/spirit which is often seen as a father/son relationship. Sometimes this is personified by using jesus.

AARGh. I am slightly confused. Comments would be appreciated!

asdf25
07-14-2006, 09:28 PM
I thought the first post was pretty good, better than I had expected the "it's about his son" theory to be, although to me it's far from clear how that interpretation of the first half of the song relates to the lyrics in the second half. For one thing, "benevolent son" strikes me as a particularly bizarre phrase. I think certainly "benevolent sun" is a much less awkward interpretation (even beyond the "shine" attached to it), considering Tool's affinity towards that kind of mysticism and nature metaphors. Also "divide and wither away" and "shine down upon the broken, shine until the two become one" bring to mind Reflection and of course Right In Two.

So I guess my point is really that most (probably all) of the "sun" sentences in the song make very little sense if you substitute in "son"... regardless of how much Maynard's son has affected him, I don't see how it makes any sense lyrically to talk of him as some sort of savior of the universe/mankind, through the act of shining. To me, the whole second half of the song seems too general and mystical and tied in with themes from the rest of the album as well as Lateralus, to have the first half refer to any specific person.

win
07-16-2006, 05:01 PM
I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Here from the king's mountain view (I am on top of the world)
Here from the wild dream come true ( Its a dream come true)
Feast like a sultan, I do .... ( I love the excess)
On treasures and flesh never few ( money and women especially)


But I would wish it all, away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day (But I love you and would give it up)


The devil and his had me down ( I know a dark side of excess)
In love with the dark side I've found ( and I tended to like it )
Dabblin' all the way down ( I tried it all )
Up to my neck soon to drown. ( It was starting to be a problem)

But you changed that all for me ( but then you came into my life)
Lifted me up, turned me round ( and I realized you were more important)


So I, I would wish this all away ( So I would give it up)


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)


But I
I would
If I could
I would
Wish it away
Wish it away
Wish it all away
Wanna wish it all away ( I wanted to leave this life in a way)
No person could hold sway ( nobody could tell me to change)
Or justify my toe just a fine line (nobody could justify my being at the edge)
Giving away my center ( I was giving away my energy and love )


So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow, they'd take you away ( I realize now )


You're my piece of mind, ( your my focus )
my own (my own son)
my center (my new center of focus and love)
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day ( I am taking it day by day..like anyone else)


Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...
If they should compromise
A fulcrum (Damn them if they lead me to stray from the balance I have found)
Want and need; ( I need to be mindful of what I want -vs- what I need)
if I need, ( beacause if I need the excess )
Then I might as well be gone... ( I might as well not be here for you at all )


Shine on forever ( Let your love and spirit and who you are shine on forever)
Shine on benevolent son (my SON )
Shine down upon the broken ( Let it shine on me untill my two personas balance)
Shine on 'til the two become one (untill I find that balance through my love of son)


Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent son
Shine down upon the severed
Shine [on 'til / until] the two become one (see above)


Divide and wither away ( If I try to keep these aspects divided I wither away)
Divided, withering away
Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son. ( Let your love of your son heal you )


Breathe in union ( So let these two aspects of myself come together)

So, as one, survive (And as one person survive)
Another day and season (and it will get easier day to day ...season to season)
Silence legion save your poison (And temptation to slip dont speak)
Silence legion stay out of my way (And temptation to slip get out of my way)


I really feel like this is it.

A few things to keep in mind :

The whole Son/Sun thing and Jambi being a kingdom with a sultan in Indonesia is fine...Maynard loves the dual meanings....in between sniffs/sips of coke anyone ?

He talks in 10,000 days/Wings about the little light she gave to him he is going to let it shine to guide her home........hmmmm letting a light shine to heal and guide someone you love dearly..... (see above)

Also this song before 10k days/Wings makes sense in that it is about his relationship of focus with his future (son) into his relationship of focus with his past (mom)....nice transition in my opinion....

Of course I dont expect my interpretation to change the masses minds but I can relate...

I used to party everynight.....Wine Women and Song....I made a ton of money and spent it on everything from limos to keeping the party going well into the next morning......Then my son was born and I realized when I held him for the first time that my life was forever changed.....I gave up the life and took a less demanding new job where altough I make a little less money I have more time to spend with my son my new center of focus for 3 years now...

I still party here and there but in a much more subdued way and will gladly not go out if I can spend some quality time with my son.

He changed my life and now it is my job to change his.....

I think thats the spirit in which Maynard wrote this one.....

What do you think ?

I think this is a great interp. How does the title fit in?

Skeezer
07-19-2006, 12:25 PM
Great Ideas on this thread I'm sure others have similarly good exposition but this one is near the top and I'm too lazy to read the others. My two sense* Every good artist draws on personal emotion to create really identifiable art otherwise it would be too existential for others to be drawn to it. As such clearly Maynard's poetry is influenced by his own life and relationships he has, his other songs support that theory. To disregard that in my opinion is to negate the emotional impact and make his work sound pretentiuous and preachy. Maybe it's just me but I'd rather accept the idea that he is sharing from personal growth as opposed to relating some mystical, spiritual ideology. Secondly as to the chorus Jam my eyes could work in the context of Maynard's religious upbringing. Not to envoke the "J" word *laugh* but Matthew 18:9 "If your eye makes you stumble tear it out......." Which I think fits in the context of if they should compromise and ties better to the title at least phonetically. Although I still hear "Damn my eyes" so what do I know.


*on purpose

magdalena.
07-19-2006, 05:14 PM
There is, absolutely, positively, no jambi eyes in the lyrics. Jesus Christ. You people are deaf.

prescious lamb and martyr
07-20-2006, 07:30 PM
I really appreciate the time you put into all this and think that your interpretation of this song is awesome. I can relate also. Maynard is such a great writer.

catheterhero
07-21-2006, 05:30 PM
I think this is a great interpretation...

Getting kind of annoyed that Tool are supposed to be so different yet the lyrics are all about Maynard. None of the other band members get a chance. I'm sure they have some emotional/personal problems they'd like to get off their chest...


They do have a means to release emotional/presonal problems.....They do it with the music, not the lyrics-singing is maynards instrument.

Great post overall. As we all know it might not be the "right" meaning, but as long as you get something out it, that's all that really matters.

Go Go Catheter Go!!!

actualize_epiphanies
07-23-2006, 06:16 PM
So, hate to use the J word and throw people off! What I really mean is: Rather than the archetypal saviour that jesus has become - many times removed from the reality of the person - it could be about the personal relationship with God/spirit which is often seen as a father/son relationship. Sometimes this is personified by using jesus.

AARGh. I am slightly confused. Comments would be appreciated!

I get you here. Especially knowing the following two songs deal with an ascent to divinity.

I think that the easy answer for over-eager tool fans is that mjk is talking about the J man and G-Whiz (G-O-D), specifically here and in Wings I and II. but i think that these songs here capture the more universal concepts of spirituality and divine purpose.

it's definitely "about the personal relationship"; mjk screamed "fuck your god" (apc) but now he's talking about his.

phatfela1
07-26-2006, 09:13 PM
hey good post man. seems like if you put a little effort into describing something in a good way like that, people catch on. i agree with you except for one part: I think he is saying "Shine on forever, benevolent SUN." I think he is referring to the Sun as the source of divine energy. "Shine down upon the broken...until the two become one." At first i couldn't figure out the song because he starts out talking about him and his son, and then he goes on to sing about the divine healing energy that is available to all, no matter who you are. but i think it does make sense now because instead of saying "shine down forever on ME, and change me from my self-indulgent ways," he is not being selfish and says "shine down upon the MANY" (him as well as everyone else).

So i think it makes sense that he is asking the divine to heal him, and that goes along with the rest of the song in which he states his desire to change for his son, so elegantly put by greenbuds. but then there's something wierd..."shine down until the two become one" (desiring unity) followed by "divide and whither away" (desiring separation." i don't get it. and what's all this two and one business. this is just like "Right in Two." the one splitting into two is definitely a theme of this album and i think it has greater signifigance than just a reprsentative of people splitting. there's some numerology or something in it. God dammit i'm pissed off now, late

PS i'm pretty positive that it is SUN, i'll bet all of you a million bucks that it will say that when he submits the lyrics. he's used this idea of the "Sun" more than once in his previous work, APC as well as Tool.

Caduceus11
07-26-2006, 10:19 PM
Son/Sun....its a pun.

Terry21
07-27-2006, 02:28 AM
Son/Sun....its a pun.

It's a trap. The whole CD is a trap. I own the TV / Eye on the TV, Eyeballs, Youballs, Maynard is just fucking kidding us.

fabienne78
07-30-2006, 02:33 PM
Maynard should put in his dentures when he records the songs, his mumbling get's worse with every new record.

hehe ;)

Terry21
07-30-2006, 07:36 PM
No, no, AEnima was pretty badass.

Inner_Eulogy
07-30-2006, 07:51 PM
Definitely one of the better thought-out interpretations I've seen, and I tend to agree, I've kicked around the idea of this song reagarding to his son. Point to remember-->Jambi is the name of the genie from Peewee's playhouse, maybe Devo's a fan?

No offense but, I've said it once and I'll say it again....any of you people relating the Jambi genie from Pee-Wee's playhouse should be executed. That is the lamest fucking idea ever created by mankind.

<edit> What I get from the song is that it's a combination of things (as all his songs are, hence stinkfist>. I take from it that it's about exactly what the original post in this thread states (giving up his rockstar lifestyle to be a better person for his son). I think H. is quite similar in that sense. But it's also reflection on the division of the indonesian providence Jambi and the sultan that let his greed overcome him. I'd also have to say that as much as this interpretation feels that it fits, I agree in contrary with njm's post that some lines definately make it seem like it is more expandant than just his own son. Then again, as for almost all of Maynard's lyrics, we will probably never know the "exact" intent his songs had for him personally, however, this is part of what draws us fans so much with an intelligent drive to "dig deeper" is within the fact that he writes his music in such a multi-layered way so that we can all get something out of it that fits us each individually. This is one of the reasons that I have grown to be damn near obsessed with Tool is the fact of the intelligence, hard work, thought and soul put into their art form. I'm the most die hard fan out of everyone I know, my fiance thinks I'm crazy but it's like she just doesn't even understand or care to what it's all about. I think Tool is the modern day Beethoven, Bach or Mozart in a sense. There are many great ideas posted in these forums and I hate to discredit any of them...except for you fuckers that are somehow forgetting to put down the crack pipe and thinking that Jambi has anything to do with the retarded genie on Pee-Wee's Playhouse...you guys should still be executed, yeah. Ok I'm done.

paraflux
07-31-2006, 06:09 AM
There is, absolutely, positively, no jambi eyes in the lyrics. Jesus Christ. You people are deaf.
You have not seen them live yet. I dont even have to ask. Because if you had, you would not have made this post.

Warartist
07-31-2006, 08:37 AM
I have seen them live... Forth row back... I didn't hear "jambi eyes".

Inner_Eulogy
07-31-2006, 09:37 AM
I have seen them live... Forth row back... I didn't hear "jambi eyes".

I heard it loud and clear....or check out www.distortiononline.com and you can hear a live version of it. I'm not saying I'm right but I definateky hear "Damn my eyes, jambi (pronouncec jam-bye) eyes, dim my eyes.

Warartist
07-31-2006, 12:57 PM
You are indeed saying your right, if you weren't you wouldn't say you definitely hear it. You couldn't be definite about any thing unless you believe you are right.
I definitely hear Damn my eye's... Possibly one dim my eyes, I can understand people hearing that any way, though I think its just in the way he pronounces damn.
So, do you also believe that the tittle is pronounced jam-bye? If not why would they (allegedly) say it that way in the song? I think it's pronounced Jom-bee.
M.

Warartist
07-31-2006, 01:01 PM
I do agree with you that it has nothing to do with pee wee's genie. I don't understand what other reason unless you believe it has to do with pee wee you would think it's in the lyrics though...

slicknickshady
08-01-2006, 06:46 AM
H is about maynards son imo. This imo is also.

paraflux
08-01-2006, 07:15 AM
Yes, because we all know Maynard's son was considerately killing him.

weesper
08-01-2006, 07:37 AM
You have not seen them live yet. I dont even have to ask. Because if you had, you would not have made this post.

We've gone over this already; there isnt a single point in this song where he says Jam-Bye! You know why? Cuz its not pronounced Jam-Bye!

Look it up on any live recording where he announces the song and you'll hear it clearly (and dont get me started on the not having heard them live, I think only the koreans and the Maya population have not heard them live and they'll have covered half of that section in a bit as well)

paraflux
08-01-2006, 07:47 AM
All I need listen to is the middle part, man. Sorry. He can pronounce the song how he wants to, he can make an album title "AEnima" with the title track "AEnema," he can do whatever he wants to, including sing Jam-Bi eyes in the middle part, which he clearly does in the recordings I have heard. Yes, they are available to those who look.

Warartist
08-01-2006, 08:36 AM
Yes, because we all know Maynard's son was considerately killing him.
Ha! Yes we all know that...

Inner_Eulogy
08-01-2006, 09:45 AM
You are indeed saying your right, if you weren't you wouldn't say you definitely hear it. You couldn't be definite about any thing unless you believe you are right. .

No moron, that means I definately believe that is what "I" hear. That doesn't mean I'm stating fact of the correct words.

I definitely hear Damn my eye's... Possibly one dim my eyes, I can understand people hearing that any way, though I think its just in the way he pronounces damn. So, do you also believe that the tittle is pronounced jam-bye? If not why would they (allegedly) say it that way in the song? I think it's pronounced Jom-bee..

And I'm well aware of this....everybody is....yes, it sounds like "jam-bye" what he says in the song...and the actual indonesian providence is pronounced "jom-bee". Here's a sticker and a pat on the head for being the special little boy that paid attention. The reason for the difference, nobody knows as of yet. Nobody knows if it IS Jambi that he says for sure. That's my interpretation and I'm entitled to it until otherwise proven wrong.

Inner_Eulogy
08-01-2006, 09:46 AM
H is about maynards son imo. This imo is also.

Isn't that what I just said in my previous post?

blair's man sausage
08-01-2006, 09:51 AM
H is about maynards son imo. This imo is also.

sorry your pussy died nick but H.'s meaning is pretty well established and it's not mjk's son

tiryth
08-01-2006, 09:54 AM
Its cool. i always thought it was about Jesus tho but it could be both or neither - thats the beauty!

Warartist
08-01-2006, 07:19 PM
No moron, that means I definately believe that is what "I" hear. That doesn't mean I'm stating fact of the correct words.

Ummm... Chill out, Asshole. The point I made was exactly that you believe what you believe, just like you said... This time.


And I'm well aware of this....everybody is....yes, it sounds like "jam-bye" what he says in the song...and the actual indonesian providence is pronounced "jom-bee". Here's a sticker and a pat on the head for being the special little boy that paid attention. The reason for the difference, nobody knows as of yet. Nobody knows if it IS Jambi that he says for sure. That's my interpretation and I'm entitled to it until otherwise proven wrong.

Where’s the sticker? Don’t lie. You don't have one. I'm not a special little boy, I am a special 23 year old women.
No one said you can’t have your opinion, you can. So can I, My opinion is your opinion is wrong. Until proven wrong. I'm also entitled to argue my point of view where ever the hell I feel it's necessary in this forum since it exists to discuss such matters. You should tone down the hostility, it’s uncalled for...

seanos
08-02-2006, 04:21 PM
:D
first post ever, so here goes...

First of all, nice interpretation... rang true throughout.

...I don't think its about his son personally, and I'm sticking by "son" actually being (SUN). It just makes more since that way with out reading way to deep into things you don't know much about. Such as Maynard's personal life.

Can't it be both? ;D

IMO there's a few things being alluded to in this song, one of which i'm now convinced is indeed maynard's son. Before reading this post i had a rather undefined idea floating around in my head going something like this:

Maynard's drive, ambition, passion to succeed in his chosen career is all down to a part of his persona which he detests...

'I would wish it all away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day'

it's not the best interpretation ever, ill admit.. but i really didnt put much effort into it. ;p I guess thats why im here, reading the Jambi forum.

The 'benevolent (sun/son)' bit is wiiiide open to interpretation - the benevolence could be describing say, a higher power, 'shining down' from above, denoting SUN as the word used. It could also referring to the naturally kind nature of a child. With no official lyrics to go by, it seems to be more fun to play with the possible meanings. It's for this reason that i dont care if they're ever released (but hey, if they are, ill be as curious as the next person). Just one of the many things i love about this band.

And as someone mentioned, while it is true that, at least on the surface, most of the lyrics seem to be all about maynard and no one else...

...but any great writer gets everyone involved.

And Maynard is indeed a great writer.

(and now comes my own clumsy way of introducing myself)

It's been my opinion for along time now that a TOOL album is designed to tell a story, of sorts. While most songs seem lyrically to have little continuity from one song to the next, certain themes are explored before others, leading to a "logical order" from song to song. The deeper one looks, the more obvious this becomes. The interpretations people come up with are varied, but most people can agree on a common set of themes that TOOL allude to in their music (spirituality, the mind, human evolution, etc)... From Aenima to 10k these themes have been repeatedly explored - even if each album does stand completely separate from the others (which IMO they do, admirably). Its as if they are trying to tell us something, even if they're not 100% sure what that "something" is. After years of TOOL fandom, and indulging my curiosity in some of the themes explored by the band, i can totally dig where they are coming from (as im sure alot of you do too). Whatever that "something" is, it sure is magnificently grand in scope.

...Definitely worthy topics of exploration. :)

Warartist
08-02-2006, 07:13 PM
It can, I personally just don't get a feeling from this song of someone talking about their child. I haven't seen any evidence that points to it.
Happy first post to you!
M.

Inner_Eulogy
08-03-2006, 06:22 AM
The 'benevolent (sun/son)' bit is wiiiide open to interpretation - the benevolence could be describing say, a higher power, 'shining down' from above, denoting SUN as the word used. It could also referring to the naturally kind nature of a child. With no official lyrics to go by, it seems to be more fun to play with the possible meanings. It's for this reason that i dont care if they're ever released (but hey, if they are, ill be as curious as the next person). Just one of the many things i love about this band.

Unfortunately, even the "official" lyrics won't necessarily give away the exact interpretation intended by Maynard either. Again, as I said in another post....the intention is supposed to be so that each individual can get out of his lyrics what fits them.

Terry21
08-03-2006, 08:23 AM
All I need listen to is the middle part, man. Sorry. He can pronounce the song how he wants to, he can make an album title "AEnima" with the title track "AEnema," he can do whatever he wants to, including sing Jam-Bi eyes in the middle part, which he clearly does in the recordings I have heard. Yes, they are available to those who look.

The question is not what Maynard is allowed or able to do. We have the audio recordings at trying to figure out something. We try to think about what is possible through rational thinking, with a fully working brain. I can't see why Maynard would fucking sing "Jambi eyes", because the word "Jam-bye" doesn't exist. And Maynard pronounced the song as "Jum-bee". The only possibility left for "Jambi" is a joke. Or that it sounds like Jambye and that's why they came up with the title. And by the way, what are you talking about in the last sentence? Live he clearly sings "damn / dim my eyes". No wait... this sounds like "dimp my eyes"???

Warartist
08-03-2006, 07:54 PM
. I can't see why Maynard would fucking sing "Jambi eyes", because the word "Jam-bye" doesn't exist. Live he clearly sings "damn / dim my eyes". No wait... this sounds like "dimp my eyes"???

Now that's using your noggin! :)

M.

Inner_Eulogy
08-04-2006, 09:27 AM
The question is not what Maynard is allowed or able to do. We have the audio recordings at trying to figure out something. We try to think about what is possible through rational thinking, with a fully working brain. I can't see why Maynard would fucking sing "Jambi eyes", because the word "Jam-bye" doesn't exist. And Maynard pronounced the song as "Jum-bee". The only possibility left for "Jambi" is a joke. Or that it sounds like Jambye and that's why they came up with the title. And by the way, what are you talking about in the last sentence? Live he clearly sings "damn / dim my eyes". No wait... this sounds like "dimp my eyes"???

I agree, that does make perfect sense. Goddamn official lyrics need to come out. I think I'm going to tackle him to the ground, give him a wet willy and tell him to release the lyrics when I see him here at the Chicago show.

<shane>
08-05-2006, 11:58 PM
I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Here from the king's mountain view (I am on top of the world)
Here from the wild dream come true ( Its a dream come true)
Feast like a sultan, I do .... ( I love the excess)
On treasures and flesh never few ( money and women especially)


But I would wish it all, away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day (But I love you and would give it up)


The devil and his had me down ( I know a dark side of excess)
In love with the dark side I've found ( and I tended to like it )
Dabblin' all the way down ( I tried it all )
Up to my neck soon to drown. ( It was starting to be a problem)

But you changed that all for me ( but then you came into my life)
Lifted me up, turned me round ( and I realized you were more important)


So I, I would wish this all away ( So I would give it up)


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)


But I
I would
If I could
I would
Wish it away
Wish it away
Wish it all away
Wanna wish it all away ( I wanted to leave this life in a way)
No person could hold sway ( nobody could tell me to change)
Or justify my toe just a fine line (nobody could justify my being at the edge)
Giving away my center ( I was giving away my energy and love )


So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow, they'd take you away ( I realize now )


You're my piece of mind, ( your my focus )
my own (my own son)
my center (my new center of focus and love)
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day ( I am taking it day by day..like anyone else)


Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...
If they should compromise
A fulcrum (Damn them if they lead me to stray from the balance I have found)
Want and need; ( I need to be mindful of what I want -vs- what I need)
if I need, ( beacause if I need the excess )
Then I might as well be gone... ( I might as well not be here for you at all )


Shine on forever ( Let your love and spirit and who you are shine on forever)
Shine on benevolent son (my SON )
Shine down upon the broken ( Let it shine on me untill my two personas balance)
Shine on 'til the two become one (untill I find that balance through my love of son)


Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent son
Shine down upon the severed
Shine [on 'til / until] the two become one (see above)


Divide and wither away ( If I try to keep these aspects divided I wither away)
Divided, withering away
Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son. ( Let your love of your son heal you )


Breathe in union ( So let these two aspects of myself come together)

So, as one, survive (And as one person survive)
Another day and season (and it will get easier day to day ...season to season)
Silence legion save your poison (And temptation to slip dont speak)
Silence legion stay out of my way (And temptation to slip get out of my way)


I really feel like this is it.

A few things to keep in mind :

The whole Son/Sun thing and Jambi being a kingdom with a sultan in Indonesia is fine...Maynard loves the dual meanings....in between sniffs/sips of coke anyone ?

He talks in 10,000 days/Wings about the little light she gave to him he is going to let it shine to guide her home........hmmmm letting a light shine to heal and guide someone you love dearly..... (see above)

Also this song before 10k days/Wings makes sense in that it is about his relationship of focus with his future (son) into his relationship of focus with his past (mom)....nice transition in my opinion....

Of course I dont expect my interpretation to change the masses minds but I can relate...

I used to party everynight.....Wine Women and Song....I made a ton of money and spent it on everything from limos to keeping the party going well into the next morning......Then my son was born and I realized when I held him for the first time that my life was forever changed.....I gave up the life and took a less demanding new job where altough I make a little less money I have more time to spend with my son my new center of focus for 3 years now...

I still party here and there but in a much more subdued way and will gladly not go out if I can spend some quality time with my son.

He changed my life and now it is my job to change his.....

I think thats the spirit in which Maynard wrote this one.....

What do you think ?i think he's singing to king solomen

Godin
08-06-2006, 07:09 PM
I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)



Here is the correct translation of the above verse, as incorrectly ;-) paraphrased by GreenBuds:

Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn:
Dusk is when the light of day disappears. Dawn is when it reappears. The disappearance of light is universally symbolic for the onset of "darkness" or confusion in one's life. The dawn is universally symbolic of the return of "light" or happiness and understanding once again. So, during the time when Maynard assumedly entered a "dark" phase of his life he spent the whole time in prayer, like someone who dies for their beliefs, like a martyr. Maynard was living a life that was contrary to the interests of his worldly flourishing, and he did so on purpose for the sake of a greater cause, or so he believed at the time. By including the word "martyr" in this line, that is what is implied.

Beg like a hooker all night long:
Even martyrs who die for their beliefs lose their resolve at times. During the dark phase of Maynard's life, he was begging to get out of that dark phase like a hooker. He didn't want to be there, but then again he DID want to be there on some level because he admits in the last line that he "got what he wanted all along". So, what we have is a conflict of interests within him. He willed himself into darkness, but simultaneously -like a hooker would do anything for sex- he would have done anything to end the darkness. It's possible that he touches upon this experience in the lyrics for "Prison Sex".

Shout to the devil with my song:
To "shout" in this line means "to complain". You could almost take this line literally, if you assume that at one point Maynard was writing songs about his own self-pity. If not literally, it just means he had a hard time maintaining the vision that his suffering was for a good purpose. He complained to himself occasionally. Self-pity is by most considered to be the cause of a "darkened" spirit. Maynard's song of self-pity is something that only would appeal to the devil. God is not known for listening to complainers.

And got what I wanted all along:
The tortured existence that he describes in the previous three lines is something that he actually sought for. He was living VICARIOUSLY off of his own tragic life, off of his own sense of self-pity. He was glorifying his tragic circumstances to himself. He believed his suffering was for some higher purpose. This is something I believe many of us do. I certainly have. If you do it, remember before you start that there is no such thing as turning back, and it gets increasingly DIFFICULT.


This entire verse is about purposefully seeking out tragedy for yourself. It enriches the song tremendously. By including this verse in the song, Maynard acknowledges that he just as relievedly departed from living vicariously off of his own tragedy as he did from the painful experiences of what any of the other beginning verses in this song describe. This is just another pattern of behavior that the subject of this song, whoever it is, redeemed him of.


"Damn my eyes, Jambi!"

Jambi was a wishing genie that Pee-wee Herman went to for help with various things. Maynard pleading for Jambi to damn his eyes is like a humorous take on Dante pleading to the greek god appollo to gain poetic insight. In both cases, in Maynard's and Dante's, they are pleading to their respective benefactors in order to gain "heavenly" insight to help those that they believe need help.

When your eyes are "damned", figuratively speaking, you no longer can see outwardly and so are left to turn inwardly and reflect on the nature of your own psychology. Being in such a lofty position as Maynard explicitly says he is in during the first verse of this song, the only purpose to wish for your eyes to be damned would be to gain the psychological insight needed to light the way of others who are lost and need help, whether that person be his son or the troubled listeners who have supported him throughout. Both of them have provided a "fulcrum" of power and inspiration for Maynard to do positive things in his life with.

This song is an acknowledgement by Maynard that something or someone was pivotal in redeeming him from a place that he didn't want to be, and that Maynard could now not conscientiously abandon that person after all that person has done for him. The song in and of itself does not provide much for specificity as to who exactly Maynard is referring to. I like to believe (because of what is stated in other songs throughout this album and previous ones) that he is referring to his fans; "the damaged and broken met along this tedious path [he's] chosen here"(The Patient). If not for those people, the fans he meets along the way, he "certainly would have walked away by now", as he explicitly says during that song on the Lateralus album. Therefore, we know he feels a debt of gratitude to help out his damaged and broken fans. Also, his son (I believe his name is Devo) will always automatically be in Maynard's life because they are family, and I'm sure Maynard is not purposefully anticipating their separation. Tool's fans, however, the band might go stray from if there style progresses too far from its origins. This is a dilemma any band faces as they try to progress musically, but without alienating the ones who started them out in success. They want to grow without abandoning.


btw, Tool fans.. If I AM right with my understanding of this song, then I would ask you to give this band a mandate for experimenting HOWEVER they see fit with their albums. They have certainly earned my trust from their performance up to date. If they felt compelled to start playing Big Band music, with trombones and cymbals and stuff, I'd be genuinely and unconditionally intrigued as to why they made that decision. I would give them their absolute freedom, and would always pay respects to their creations (unless they really did suck bad).



"Shine on forever, Benevolent SUN."

This lyric could not be "son". A "sun" COULD actually shine on forever, hypothetically speaking, but a "son" could only shine on for about 80-90 years at most, and a "son" could certainly not shine upon EVERYBODY... unless Maynard is referring to the son of god.

-Godin

spacemonkeyadb
08-06-2006, 08:31 PM
Wow. Good post Godin. Very well thought out.
But I'm going to disagree with you on a few points...


He was living VICARIOUSLY off of his own tragic life, off of his own sense of self-pity ... By including this verse in the song, Maynard acknowledges that he just as relievedly departed from living VICARIOUSLY off of his own tragedy as he did from the painful experiences of what any of the other beginning verses in this song describe.

A minor point perhaps, but you seem to have misused the word "vicariously" here. To live vicariously doesn't mean just to feed on tragedy, it means to live through events that happen to OTHER people. Kinda like living by proxy. So it is impossible to live "vicariously" off ones OWN tragedy/life. But I do like your general idea here.


This song is an acknowledgement by Maynard that something or someone was pivotal in redeeming him from a place that he didn't want to be ... I like to believe that he is referring to his fans ... Also, his son (I believe his name is Devo) will always automatically be in Maynard's life because they are family, and I'm sure Maynard is not purposefully anticipating their separation.

"But I would wish it all, away... If I thought I'd lose you just one day"
Would Maynard wish away all his success to avoid losing his FANS for just one day? I think this line shows that the target of the song is someone close to him that he has a very personal relationship with. Probably his son IMO but maybe someone else.
And I don't think the song shows him to be "purposely anticipating" any separation. He's not saying he fears an ACTUAL separation from his son (or whoever), but just that he loves him so much he'd give away everything not to ever lose him.


"Shine on forever, Benevolent SUN."

This lyric could not be "son". A "sun" COULD actually shine on forever, hypothetically speaking, but a "son" could only shine on for about 80-90 years at most, and a "son" could certainly not shine upon EVERYBODY... unless Maynard is referring to the son of god.


Definitely COULD be "son". I think it's a deliberate pun using "son/sun" to link the sun imagery to his son. And a son's achievements can certainly shine on after he has died (Maynard's music is likely to shine on beyond his lifespan). And he doesn't say "everybody" at all, only "Shine upon the MANY". Tool's music has certainly reached the ears of "many", couldn't he be hoping for his son to have a similar widespread positive influence?

Godin
08-07-2006, 09:37 AM
A minor point perhaps, but you seem to have misused the word "vicariously" here. To live vicariously doesn't mean just to feed on tragedy, it means to live through events that happen to OTHER people... So it is impossible to live "vicariously" off ones OWN tragedy/life...

If I have misused the word, then my overall point is not tarnished. I would just need to replace "vicarious" with another word. But, here is a justification as to why I used "vicarous", and why I CAPS LOCKED it.

We live vicariously through characters when we read or watch narrative stories. All myths are narrative stories, so we live vicariously through them as well. Carl Jung and Joseph Campbell not only said that myths reside over an entire culture in each individual's collective unconsciousness, but they also claimed that each individual lives according to their own PERSONAL MYTH; a personal myth which is basically a nuanced version of the more universal myth which resides over the entire culture.

The verse that I paraphrased in detail above would be the personal myth of Maynard. He envisioned himself as suffering like a martyr for some greater cause (I like to think it was the greater cause of gaining insight through suffering to help his fans). When we perceive the events of our life in a removed story-like fashion as Maynard suggests he was doing here, we view ourselves as merely a character in that story; as the main character in our personal myth. Since we project the real events of our life into a fictional story-like scenario inside of our minds, and we consider ourselves as a character inside of that story (a mental recreation of our actual selves) then we may live vicariously through the mythical version of ourselves which is shielded from reality by living inside of our minds.

People who live according to some conception of a personal myth, whether they realize it or not, actually process all of their experiences through the context of that personal myth and so experience their lives second-hand, as if they were living out a pre-written narrative. This is my justification for using the word "vicarious" with the above post. Far-fetched though it is, I believe it is psychologically sound.

I caps locked "vicarious" because I think this more personal definition of vicariously living through your own personal myth of suffering is what Maynard was truly alluding to with "Vicarious" the song. It would explain the "part vampire, part warrior" lyric in the song, since the individual living out his own personal myth would be doing so by feeding off of his own blood while simultaneously doing it for a heroic/warrior-like reason. He would be doing it for some perceived greater cause, just like Maynard implies he was like a "martyr" for his own cause.


"But I would wish it all, away... If I thought I'd lose you just one day"
Would Maynard wish away all his success to avoid losing his FANS for just one day? I think this line shows that the target of the song is someone close to him that he has a very personal relationship with.


Aha. It's starting to make sense:


"No pressure could hold sway, or justify my giving away my center...

...Damn my eyes, if they should compromise a fulcrum.
[When] wants and needs divide me thin, then I might as well be gone...

Shine on forever. Shine on, benevolent sun/son.
Shine on upon the severed, shine on 'til the two become one. (till wants and needs merge into one)
Divide and I'm withering away."


This song is about orienting yourself so that you want what you need, so that the two overlap and are organic to each other. It could apply to his son, but more importantly it applies ambiguously to the feeling of wanting and needing themselves. This was the initial impression I got with this song.. that it was an ambiguous message which was directed at the feelings inside the man and not at the particular people or objects that the feelings arise from. I didn't want to at first believe it was ambiguous like this, but now that I understand it more profoundly I think it's actually a very beautiful ambiguous notion captured in song. :-) Props, MJK.

-Godin

Inner_Eulogy
08-07-2006, 09:48 AM
Shout to the devil with my song:
To "shout" in this line means "to complain". You could almost take this line literally, if you assume that at one point Maynard was writing songs about his own self-pity. If not literally, it just means he had a hard time maintaining the vision that his suffering was for a good purpose. He complained to himself occasionally. Self-pity is by most considered to be the cause of a "darkened" spirit. Maynard's song of self-pity is something that only would appeal to the devil. God is not known for listening to complainers.


Um, too bad it's "tempted the devil with my song"....the rest of that was nonsense

Godin
08-07-2006, 09:51 AM
"Damn my eyes, Jambi!"

...When your eyes are "damned", figuratively speaking, you no longer can see outwardly and so are left to turn inwardly and reflect on the nature of your own psychology...to gain the psychological insight needed to light the way of others...

While I still feel the above quote of mine is interesting, I'm starting to think that "damn my eyes" is more suggesting the following:

"So that I may not look outwardly away from my center, so that I do not look to want anything other than my needs, damn my eyes from being teased with temptation for anything other than maintaining my center".

-Godin

Caduceus11
08-07-2006, 09:19 PM
....however, most of the posts here fail to recognize the root word of "Jambi" in latin! Jamb is (like a door jamb) a post used for supporting something else....and you should all know what 'bi' means....2 pillars of support....a dual system, jambi-eyes could mean "pry open both of my eyes and prop them open so I don't blink and miss something" or something to that extent....its something I've considered....by all means not something I'm set on yet....
but I do think that the 2 jambs are key...

that said, just because he calls the song "jam-bee" doesn't neccessarily mean that he doesn't pronounce it differently within the song....

ktdude
08-08-2006, 03:19 AM
Then again, as for almost all of Maynard's lyrics, we will probably never know the "exact" intent his songs had for him personally, however, this is part of what draws us fans so much with an intelligent drive to "dig deeper" is within the fact that he writes his music in such a multi-layered way so that we can all get something out of it that fits us each individually. This is one of the reasons that I have grown to be damn near obsessed with Tool is the fact of the intelligence, hard work, thought and soul put into their art form. I'm the most die hard fan out of everyone I know, my fiance thinks I'm crazy but it's like she just doesn't even understand or care to what it's all about. I think Tool is the modern day Beethoven, Bach or Mozart in a sense. There are many great ideas posted in these forums and I hate to discredit any of them....

This is how I feel as well. I love reading the different interpretations. It's the beauty of Tool and of Maynard's absolute genius with words. I don't really mind what the song is ACTUALLY about as long as I can spend time thinking about it, discussing it, looking at different interpretations... There are so few bands you can actually do that with, and it's an awesome feat that any piece of music can make you WANT to go into so much depth and explore every layer. It's amazing. So I am really enjoying this thread, well thought out interpretations are great to read.

spacemonkeyadb
08-08-2006, 03:58 AM
I caps locked "vicarious" because I think this more personal definition of vicariously living through your own personal myth of suffering is what Maynard was truly alluding to with "Vicarious" the song.


Cool. I understand how you're using the word now, and it does make sense. It's definitely a reasonable way of looking at this song.
But I think you'd be very wrong to apply this idea to the song "Vicarious" itself. It seems pretty clear that in that song he's referring to feeding off OTHER people's tragedy through the media.


This song is about orienting yourself so that you want what you need, so that the two overlap and are organic to each other. It could apply to his son, but more importantly it applies ambiguously to the feeling of wanting and needing themselves ... I didn't want to at first believe it was ambiguous like this, but now that I understand it more profoundly I think it's actually a very beautiful ambiguous notion captured in song. :-) Props, MJK.


Yup. With you totally here. That's the genious of Maynard's lyrics. How he's able to take something very specific and personal and distill it down to something general enough that we can all relate to it, without losing any of the original emotional power. Amazing song.


While I still feel the above quote of mine is interesting, I'm starting to think that "damn my eyes" is more suggesting the following:

"So that I may not look outwardly away from my center, so that I do not look to want anything other than my needs, damn my eyes from being teased with temptation for anything other than maintaining my center".


Yeah, I think that's an improvement too. Though I think it's actually "DIM my eyes (x3)" it would have exactly the same meaning.
Also, consider that to "compromise a fulcrum" would be to upset a balance (a fulcrum provides a balance), i.e. a balance between wants and needs.

My take on these lyrics:

"DIM my eyes if they should compromise OUR fulcrum
(If) want and need divide me then I might as well be gone"

<shane>
08-08-2006, 06:14 AM
I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Here from the king's mountain view (I am on top of the world)
Here from the wild dream come true ( Its a dream come true)
Feast like a sultan, I do .... ( I love the excess)
On treasures and flesh never few ( money and women especially)


But I would wish it all, away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day (But I love you and would give it up)


The devil and his had me down ( I know a dark side of excess)
In love with the dark side I've found ( and I tended to like it )
Dabblin' all the way down ( I tried it all )
Up to my neck soon to drown. ( It was starting to be a problem)

But you changed that all for me ( but then you came into my life)
Lifted me up, turned me round ( and I realized you were more important)


So I, I would wish this all away ( So I would give it up)


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)


But I
I would
If I could
I would
Wish it away
Wish it away
Wish it all away
Wanna wish it all away ( I wanted to leave this life in a way)
No person could hold sway ( nobody could tell me to change)
Or justify my toe just a fine line (nobody could justify my being at the edge)
Giving away my center ( I was giving away my energy and love )


So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow, they'd take you away ( I realize now )


You're my piece of mind, ( your my focus )
my own (my own son)
my center (my new center of focus and love)
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day ( I am taking it day by day..like anyone else)


Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...
If they should compromise
A fulcrum (Damn them if they lead me to stray from the balance I have found)
Want and need; ( I need to be mindful of what I want -vs- what I need)
if I need, ( beacause if I need the excess )
Then I might as well be gone... ( I might as well not be here for you at all )


Shine on forever ( Let your love and spirit and who you are shine on forever)
Shine on benevolent son (my SON )
Shine down upon the broken ( Let it shine on me untill my two personas balance)
Shine on 'til the two become one (untill I find that balance through my love of son)


Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent son
Shine down upon the severed
Shine [on 'til / until] the two become one (see above)


Divide and wither away ( If I try to keep these aspects divided I wither away)
Divided, withering away
Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son. ( Let your love of your son heal you )


Breathe in union ( So let these two aspects of myself come together)

So, as one, survive (And as one person survive)
Another day and season (and it will get easier day to day ...season to season)
Silence legion save your poison (And temptation to slip dont speak)
Silence legion stay out of my way (And temptation to slip get out of my way)


I really feel like this is it.

A few things to keep in mind :

The whole Son/Sun thing and Jambi being a kingdom with a sultan in Indonesia is fine...Maynard loves the dual meanings....in between sniffs/sips of coke anyone ?

He talks in 10,000 days/Wings about the little light she gave to him he is going to let it shine to guide her home........hmmmm letting a light shine to heal and guide someone you love dearly..... (see above)

Also this song before 10k days/Wings makes sense in that it is about his relationship of focus with his future (son) into his relationship of focus with his past (mom)....nice transition in my opinion....

Of course I dont expect my interpretation to change the masses minds but I can relate...

I used to party everynight.....Wine Women and Song....I made a ton of money and spent it on everything from limos to keeping the party going well into the next morning......Then my son was born and I realized when I held him for the first time that my life was forever changed.....I gave up the life and took a less demanding new job where altough I make a little less money I have more time to spend with my son my new center of focus for 3 years now...

I still party here and there but in a much more subdued way and will gladly not go out if I can spend some quality time with my son.

He changed my life and now it is my job to change his.....

I think thats the spirit in which Maynard wrote this one.....

What do you think ?
You are entitled to your wrong opinion

spacemonkeyadb
08-08-2006, 06:37 AM
^ Did you have to quote the entire original post just to say you disagree? How about saying WHY you disagree!

Godin
08-08-2006, 07:38 AM
...I think you'd be very wrong to apply this idea to the song "Vicarious" itself. It seems pretty clear that in that song he's referring to feeding off OTHER people's tragedy through the media.

Thanks for your feedback. It's obvious to me why you or anyone would think that "Vicarious" is exclusively about "feeding off OTHER people's tragedy through the media". I welcome you to comment further on this subject in the "Vicarious" message base. I think I'll start a thread in there about the possibility for an alternate definition of the song. I am taking it as a personal challenge to justify why I'm so compelled to believe the song is not exclusively about suffering as focused upon in the media. If I fail, then at least I'll have shaved off my false understanding of the song.

-Godin

A Spirit of Radio
08-08-2006, 10:11 AM
suffering here, suffering there, suffer suffer everywhere.

how much difference does it make? if we feed on our own-are we not programmed for suffering as little christians? does not most of the world sit around waitng for jesus and the second coming to make it right?

the image that comes to me from the guitar at the end of the song after the lines, much better you than i.... is of jesus being nailed to the cross one arm at a time- and then trying to pull himself off (the steps up the scale) to being nailed again.....and again....

because that's what so many want to do nowdays. just leave it all up to jesus to solve. we don't have to be responsible for the environment, god will fix it all soon.
i read an interview with maynard where he bascially said he tried to educate people in lateralus but most are not ready/unable to understand so to hell with them and that is what the much better you than i line is about. but i like the jesus take on it. and i can interpret the way i choose. just like you all can interpret the way you will. and it's all good.

but there is no good in the world where there is not bad as well. so it is. so it's always been.

Godin
08-08-2006, 09:59 PM
...consider that to "compromise a fulcrum" would be to upset a balance (a fulcrum provides a balance), i.e. a balance between wants and needs.

Well, fulcrum's are "the support on which a LEVER rests or turns (def)". Levers potentially provide increased power. Just as I intuitevly thought, a fulcrum is just the thing that sits on bottom of the see-saw set-up. The word does not imply balance. We know, though, that a fulcrum can create balance or it can increase or decreese leverage.

So, with this more ambiguous definition, the fulcrum could be to achieve a balance between want and need or to achieve the leverage from his fans to spread his art into the world. I suppose, if the lyrics really are "wants and needs divide me thin, etc" then I'd say the fulcrum refers to balance. If the lyrics are something else, then the fulcrum could potentially refer to the providing of increased power just as well. At this point I think the "want and need" lyric is right.

-Godin

spacemonkeyadb
08-09-2006, 04:30 AM
^ I realise this. I didn't mean to suggest this was the ONLY interpretation, just that it was a good one given the wants Vs needs theme that we both seem to agree is an important part of this songs meaning.


"wants and needs divide me thin, then I might as well be gone..."


I don't think there are enough syllables in this part of the song for this to be correct. It has to be either "divide me THIN" or "divide me THEN", but it can't be both. This seems pretty certain as he spits out each monosyllabic word one at a time with emphasis on each one. I'm going with "THEN".

Pness
08-10-2006, 11:28 AM
maynard was obviously raised catholic.

It is 'son' and not sun.

he is talking about bible verses.

Caduceus11
08-10-2006, 04:36 PM
yea, you know everything....

Inner_Eulogy
08-10-2006, 06:33 PM
maynard was obviously raised catholic.

It is 'son' and not sun.

he is talking about bible verses.

Wrong....he was raised southern baptist STOOPID

Inner_Eulogy
08-10-2006, 06:35 PM
Um, too bad it's "tempted the devil with my song"....the rest of that was nonsense

I have to retort this statement....as many times I've heard this song and heard "tempted the devil" today I was listening again in my car on the way home from work and whaddya' know, I fucking hear "shout to the devil"....I'm officially baffled

Pness
08-11-2006, 09:51 AM
Yeah im fucking wetaded. me sowwy for not fucking knowing everything. Im only right 99.9% of the time. =)


I bet you knowing more about maynard then me, makes you think like your lifes a success.
WRONG, your still living in your moms basement scraping by with the help of welfare, jacking off to kiddie porn munching on cheetohs I bet your dumb ass's think your living good.
be jealous, you should be.

Caduceus11
08-11-2006, 04:40 PM
I'll bet your not-knowing things about Maynard, and just getting defensive, and quite imaginative as well, rather than RESEARCHING facts, makes you more ignorant....

Try to minimize the insults and keep on task here....

fractal.being
08-12-2006, 06:59 AM
that is great man

Ditto that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !

My Jr. just turned four and I have learned more about myself since he came into my life than I could have ever known before.

I might add a bit of a karmic twist - something like I have given life to him and that may suggest I need to be at one with him, in order to harmonize, to fulfill a prerequsite need to grow... and vice-versa. We are part of the same, and we need each other more than we know (but we are learning every day...)

~fractal.b

Godin
08-12-2006, 11:39 AM
I have to retort this statement....as many times I've heard this song and heard "tempted the devil" today I was listening again in my car on the way home from work and whaddya' know, I fucking hear "shout to the devil"....I'm officially baffled

I appreciate your confession, but either way I don't think it changes the meaning of the verse. To "shout to the devil" or to "tempt the devil" with your "song" would produce the same effect.. in both cases it could be said that you are TEMPTING, or appealing to, the devil to come and relieve you of your self-willed darkness.


"begged like a hooker [by shouting to, or tempting, the devil] all night long"

I know that you said my whole translation of this verse was "nonsense", but if you were to allow for it temporarily NOT to be "nonsense" then the following would be a valid point:

If you self-will yourself "like a martyr" into darkness within your life (assumedly for some cause greater than yourself, since that's what martyrs do), then to "beg like a hooker all night long" in order to prematurely relieve yourself of your life's dark phase would only be satisified by an act of the supposed "devil". You are sacrificing yourself like a martyr for the sake of God in some way, and to end it early would be an evil intervention by the devil. So, whether you shout to the devil or tempt the devil makes no difference. They both attempt to achieve the same result of ending your godly sacrifice.

-Godin

Louis_116206
08-13-2006, 10:11 AM
nice interpretation man keep em coming

peace

Inner_Eulogy
08-14-2006, 12:06 PM
Yeah im fucking wetaded. me sowwy for not fucking knowing everything. Im only right 99.9% of the time. =)


I bet you knowing more about maynard then me, makes you think like your lifes a success.
WRONG, your still living in your moms basement scraping by with the help of welfare, jacking off to kiddie porn munching on cheetohs I bet your dumb ass's think your living good.
be jealous, you should be.

I'm sorry to say but, you're wrong again genius. For one, if anyone were to feel as if they were a sucess due to their knowledge about Maynard or Tool in general they would not be mentally fit for the real world. It's unfotunate that you feel I may be living by your standards but alas, I am 29yrs old with a 3yr old son and fiance and I own my own house and have lived on my own since I was 16 with a full time job, sometimes 2. So when all is said and done and you retort with your empty insults you will find yourself still jacking off to your own little kiddie porn in your mothers basement with and empty cheeto bag the sad sad realization may finally sink in. You may even have an epiphany and move on to becoming a glamorous street hooker, who knows? Good luck with that.

DamnageD
08-16-2006, 12:25 PM
You are entitled to your wrong opinion

nice....you listen yet you miss the point of the message TooL provides.

whatever...even you're entitled to your opinion, even if I think its wrong.

anyway

As a father I IMMEADEATLY recognized this to be a relationship based song, but not about lovers...it was deeper than that. Every time I listen to it I think of my sons and the sacrifices I would make if anything were to happen to them. I understand the core feeling of desire to meet with their souls after we leave this rock.

I weep as I write this because the feeling surrounding the lyrics is so powerful to ME.

Keeping with the general theme of parent to child loss and reflection of a parent to their child about this loss, this song signifies TO ME the powerful bond of a parent to their child...at least for those who are/were blessed with quality parents/parenting skills.

A Spirit of Radio
08-17-2006, 09:13 AM
i understand your feelings damaged.
nice post.

ObiJohnKenobi
08-17-2006, 09:33 AM
<----[lprevious page, dammit]---- i concur.

there may be other, more veiled meanings here, but my initial reaction to this song was to picture the positive influence that someone else had broght into my life. this wasn't immediately my son, but both he and my wife.

kellymc12415
08-17-2006, 05:08 PM
I think that you have a great interpretation, but, I do have one question. How do we know that Maynard actually was loving the "excess"? Do we know of any excess to speak of? It seems to me that unless you are a close personal friend of Maynard, (and who knows, you very well might be), then it is hard to make a statement on his lifestyle.

Inner_Eulogy
08-18-2006, 09:44 AM
I think that you have a great interpretation, but, I do have one question. How do we know that Maynard actually was loving the "excess"? Do we know of any excess to speak of? It seems to me that unless you are a close personal friend of Maynard, (and who knows, you very well might be), then it is hard to make a statement on his lifestyle.

IMO..it's a combination of the whole rockstar thing. He spends so much time with his music and now the touring for us crazy ass fans which I'm quite sure he's tired and annoyed of but he'd give it all up for his son if it came down to it.

Another thing in which you are questioning above with the "excess" is the fact that Maynard has stated in the past that he's meddled with an assortment of drugs and he's sometimes gotten to that bottomless hole but was always able to climb right out when needed. So you put those things together and it makes sense to me anyways....He's got all these temptations and demons to fight being the star that he is but, deep down inside his son is his world "his fulcrum, his center"

....at least that's what I get out of it and it's probably because I totally relate to that exact feeling at times...

metpetnet
08-27-2006, 03:40 AM
I can understand why someone who believes in Jesus would say that this song is about him but I don't think it is.
Based only on what I have seen and heard about Maynards beliefs, I don't think that he would write a song about Jesus. I personally agree with the song being about his son. Based on my own beliefs, I think that we should all have faith in ourselves and those we care about and not in a man that lived over 2000 years ago. If you don't agree that's fine. I am not trying to tell anybody what to believe. I just feel good having people in my life that I can trust and I don't feel like I need Jesus in my life to feel this way.

<shane>
08-31-2006, 09:32 PM
nice....you listen yet you miss the point of the message TooL provides.

whatever...even you're entitled to your opinion, even if I think its wrong.

anyway

As a father I IMMEADEATLY recognized this to be a relationship based song, but not about lovers...it was deeper than that. Every time I listen to it I think of my sons and the sacrifices I would make if anything were to happen to them. I understand the core feeling of desire to meet with their souls after we leave this rock.

I weep as I write this because the feeling surrounding the lyrics is so powerful to ME.

Keeping with the general theme of parent to child loss and reflection of a parent to their child about this loss, this song signifies TO ME the powerful bond of a parent to their child...at least for those who are/were blessed with quality parents/parenting skills.
I'm not trying to be a dick, and i'm Not missing ''the message''. I just think that sun is spelled s-u-n not s-o-n. If you see Tool live, pay attention to the lighting during Jambi...

Inner_Eulogy
09-04-2006, 08:30 PM
I'm not trying to be a dick, and i'm Not missing ''the message''. I just think that sun is spelled s-u-n not s-o-n. If you see Tool live, pay attention to the lighting during Jambi...

I would agree that it says "sun" as well but, that doesn't in any way mean that the song is still not about a parent/child relationship. He could still be referencing his SON as his SUN, ya' know. All in all, I'm sure it's about a combination of things from the actual sultan in the indonesian providence to the connection between a parent/child. As I posted a few weeks back on this thread, my take is his son but that's because that's what I get from it having a 3yr old son that's means the world to me and yet at times I falter into certain darkness but he is my center, my fulcrum.

spacemonkeyadb
09-05-2006, 04:39 AM
I'm not trying to be a dick, and i'm Not missing ''the message''. I just think that sun is spelled s-u-n not s-o-n. If you see Tool live, pay attention to the lighting during Jambi...
If it is "son" then it's clearly a play on words and is also using the sun as a metaphor, i.e. Shine on (like a sun) benevolent son. So the lighting effects when performed live would be equally relevant either way, and consequently don't really prove anything with respect to "sun" Vs "son".

Inner_Eulogy
09-14-2006, 09:49 AM
If it is "son" then it's clearly a play on words and is also using the sun as a metaphor, i.e. Shine on (like a sun) benevolent son. So the lighting effects when performed live would be equally relevant either way, and consequently don't really prove anything with respect to "sun" Vs "son".

Yeah, kinda sorta basically EXACTLY what I just said.

Syd
09-15-2006, 09:12 AM
I took this song to be about Maynard's actual son from the very first time I heard it. That overall impression has not changed although I think he very cleverly weaved a lot of different threads into it so I have picked up on some other concepts/meanings as well, some of those are similar to those written here, but ummm, some of you have thought about this WAAAAYYYYY more than I have.

I really think Maynard is saying "Jambi" once in the part that everyone claims is Dim my eyes or Damn my eyes. I don't think it is "Jambi eyes" thought. Just Jambi, sung kind of drawn out. Calling for Jambi, the genie. I've listened to this CD on headphones a lot at work and it always sounds like that!

I think he got the "Shine On" idea from Pink Floyd "Shine on you crazy diamond" wrote about Syd Barrett. Funny though, Syd is not the SUN and yet he "shines" in this song. (Like Maynard's son does in his eyes maybe?)

Also, at the end, I think he has switched and is singing to the obnoxious fans who cross the line and he is letting them know, don't f*k with me or my family, I won't put up with it. Umm, obnoxious fans, you mean like those throwing bottles at the man when he is singing.

Well there is my 2 cents, or 4 – whatever.

SoItIsSoItsAlwaysBeen
09-19-2006, 01:38 PM
This is great. I don't have the ability to interperate poetry that well, so hearing what you all think helps bring new meaning of Tools songs to me. I've always liked this song, but I love it even more now. Nice work.

Syd
09-20-2006, 09:00 AM
This is great. I don't have the ability to interperate poetry that well, so hearing what you all think helps bring new meaning of Tools songs to me. I've always liked this song, but I love it even more now. Nice work.

I'm with you on that! I can't figure out poetry either, and with music, although I pay attention to the lyrics, it is always the music that really sets the tone for me and tells me what it is about. Sometimes I can see what a performer says a song is about and I just think, well, not for me anyways. Like when you don't know the exact words and you just come up with it yourself and then a long time later you find out what they were really saying and you were way off…does it really change it for you? For me, it changes the words, but somehow not how I feel about the song and the meaning. So after I posted on this part of the site I kind of thought it was silly of me because it doesn't really matter exactly what Maynard was thinking of or even the exact words or spelling of them, we all take from it what we will. However, this forum gives great ideas, things I would never have thought of, people research crazy stuff I have never heard of and I think it is pretty cool. Like the link about the "mountain view" with the photos. Too cool. Its too bad so many people play the meaning Nazi and act like it's their way of the highway. It kind of makes me not want to say much – especially being new to posting in the forum.

Forever In Debt
10-17-2006, 02:19 PM
You hit it right on the head GreenTea, nice job.

Phorty
10-17-2006, 02:28 PM
awesome thread. good work

_colin_
10-17-2006, 07:57 PM
i was actually discussing this with a few friends the week the abum came out but they did not see it and so i did not think that it was worthey to be posted but i am glad i am not the only person that thinks this

base metal
10-19-2006, 07:02 PM
Good analysis, I agree witcha.

TGangsta
11-21-2006, 06:25 AM
I don't think it's about being "right", it's simply about inspiring a thought and an idea. But I was thinking along the same lines as you, your analysis is right where my vision was!




I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Here from the king's mountain view (I am on top of the world)
Here from the wild dream come true ( Its a dream come true)
Feast like a sultan, I do .... ( I love the excess)
On treasures and flesh never few ( money and women especially)


But I would wish it all, away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day (But I love you and would give it up)


The devil and his had me down ( I know a dark side of excess)
In love with the dark side I've found ( and I tended to like it )
Dabblin' all the way down ( I tried it all )
Up to my neck soon to drown. ( It was starting to be a problem)

But you changed that all for me ( but then you came into my life)
Lifted me up, turned me round ( and I realized you were more important)


So I, I would wish this all away ( So I would give it up)


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)


But I
I would
If I could
I would
Wish it away
Wish it away
Wish it all away
Wanna wish it all away ( I wanted to leave this life in a way)
No person could hold sway ( nobody could tell me to change)
Or justify my toe just a fine line (nobody could justify my being at the edge)
Giving away my center ( I was giving away my energy and love )


So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow, they'd take you away ( I realize now )


You're my piece of mind, ( your my focus )
my own (my own son)
my center (my new center of focus and love)
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day ( I am taking it day by day..like anyone else)


Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...
If they should compromise
A fulcrum (Damn them if they lead me to stray from the balance I have found)
Want and need; ( I need to be mindful of what I want -vs- what I need)
if I need, ( beacause if I need the excess )
Then I might as well be gone... ( I might as well not be here for you at all )


Shine on forever ( Let your love and spirit and who you are shine on forever)
Shine on benevolent son (my SON )
Shine down upon the broken ( Let it shine on me untill my two personas balance)
Shine on 'til the two become one (untill I find that balance through my love of son)


Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent son
Shine down upon the severed
Shine [on 'til / until] the two become one (see above)


Divide and wither away ( If I try to keep these aspects divided I wither away)
Divided, withering away
Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son. ( Let your love of your son heal you )


Breathe in union ( So let these two aspects of myself come together)

So, as one, survive (And as one person survive)
Another day and season (and it will get easier day to day ...season to season)
Silence legion save your poison (And temptation to slip dont speak)
Silence legion stay out of my way (And temptation to slip get out of my way)


I really feel like this is it.

A few things to keep in mind :

The whole Son/Sun thing and Jambi being a kingdom with a sultan in Indonesia is fine...Maynard loves the dual meanings....in between sniffs/sips of coke anyone ?

He talks in 10,000 days/Wings about the little light she gave to him he is going to let it shine to guide her home........hmmmm letting a light shine to heal and guide someone you love dearly..... (see above)

Also this song before 10k days/Wings makes sense in that it is about his relationship of focus with his future (son) into his relationship of focus with his past (mom)....nice transition in my opinion....

Of course I dont expect my interpretation to change the masses minds but I can relate...

I used to party everynight.....Wine Women and Song....I made a ton of money and spent it on everything from limos to keeping the party going well into the next morning......Then my son was born and I realized when I held him for the first time that my life was forever changed.....I gave up the life and took a less demanding new job where altough I make a little less money I have more time to spend with my son my new center of focus for 3 years now...

I still party here and there but in a much more subdued way and will gladly not go out if I can spend some quality time with my son.

He changed my life and now it is my job to change his.....

I think thats the spirit in which Maynard wrote this one.....

What do you think ?

O.G.T.92
12-28-2006, 03:51 PM
Yeah, that pretty much sums it up, i do think the lyrics are pretty straightforward though on this one. Now that I think about it the whole 10,ooo days album is much less cryptic than the previous ones. Not that theres anything wrong with that.

opiated
01-04-2007, 01:14 PM
. . . "silence leech, and save your poison" [i just dont hear legion] . . . "silence leech, and stay out of my way" leave me alone, let me finish this, and then i can focus on you . . .

Oh, it's "Legion." Make no mistake about that. You're implying that Maynard would call his own son a "leech" -- the son in which this song could have been dedicated to. If I were writing a positive song, I wouldn't waste it on a "leech."

Inner_Eulogy
01-08-2007, 10:55 AM
Oh, it's "Legion." Make no mistake about that. You're implying that Maynard would call his own son a "leech" -- the son in which this song could have been dedicated to. If I were writing a positive song, I wouldn't waste it on a "leech."

Take a minute and smack yourself really hard. Now stop and think about what you've just said. (You're implying that Maynard would call his own son a "leech"). I just said this on a different thread as well: HE IS NOT IMPLYING HIS SON IS A LEECH OR LEGION!! That statement in the song is directed at the negative things and/or people in life that would interfere with him and his son. Whether it be "leech" or "legion" it should be more than obvious he's not calling his son either one of those.

What do you think? He's saying', "Shutup Kid, save that talk"?. NO! He's saying shutup you (silence legion/leech and) spare me the bullshit..I don't need this negative interference in my life.

McButterpants
02-15-2007, 10:00 AM
I think this is the best interpretation I've read from this song.

I'd even go as far as to say this is the "right" interpretation (as in "what Maynard intended").

However, even if you constructed the "skeleton" of the song doesn't mean it hasn't a whole lotta meat to chew on.

The wrong thing to do now would be to stop analysing the song because we've found "it".

As you said, Maynard loves dual meanings, and that's what makes poetry great: the poem doesn't mean the same for everyone, and we can discuss about it. And that's exactly what you did and I thank you for that.

Yay! Intelligence on aesthetic criticism! That's about the first I have seen on this site (in my yet brief time) other than simply repeating Maynard's plea for us to be open-minded.

redjenova
02-18-2007, 07:39 PM
I really think Maynard is saying "Jambi" once in the part that everyone claims is Dim my eyes or Damn my eyes. I don't think it is "Jambi eyes" thought. Just Jambi, sung kind of drawn out. Calling for Jambi, the genie. I've listened to this CD on headphones a lot at work and it always sounds like that!


I can understand where you're coming from on this, but I've always heard "Damn my eyes", and I've heard that phrase before (normally in kind of an "old-timey" atmosphere, I remember hearing it once or twice in the movie O Brother Where Art Thou, the phrase is a bit archaic, but has still been used of course). Plus, wouldn't he be saying 'Jambi if they should compromise..." "Damn my eyes if they should compromise" seems to be more fitting.

Also, "damn my eyes" would work if this was really about his son and keeping himself from the distractions of, er... "fame and all its decadence"... Using the phrase to say, "damn my eyes if they should compromise my ability to care for my son... blah blah blah... so on and so forth". Et cetera, Et cetera, Et cetera.

balrog
04-12-2007, 06:46 PM
I agree, that'a nice to have a dad like, you look so devoted to your child.

bassmaster
04-13-2007, 04:33 AM
That's a great interpretation, and one I believe to be close to the mark, if not spot on. Kudos.

Tezcatlipoca
04-13-2007, 01:22 PM
I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Here from the king's mountain view (I am on top of the world)
Here from the wild dream come true ( Its a dream come true)
Feast like a sultan, I do .... ( I love the excess)
On treasures and flesh never few ( money and women especially)


But I would wish it all, away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day (But I love you and would give it up)


The devil and his had me down ( I know a dark side of excess)
In love with the dark side I've found ( and I tended to like it )
Dabblin' all the way down ( I tried it all )
Up to my neck soon to drown. ( It was starting to be a problem)

But you changed that all for me ( but then you came into my life)
Lifted me up, turned me round ( and I realized you were more important)


So I, I would wish this all away ( So I would give it up)


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)


But I
I would
If I could
I would
Wish it away
Wish it away
Wish it all away
Wanna wish it all away ( I wanted to leave this life in a way)
No person could hold sway ( nobody could tell me to change)
Or justify my toe just a fine line (nobody could justify my being at the edge)
Giving away my center ( I was giving away my energy and love )


So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow, they'd take you away ( I realize now )


You're my piece of mind, ( your my focus )
my own (my own son)
my center (my new center of focus and love)
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day ( I am taking it day by day..like anyone else)


Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...
If they should compromise
A fulcrum (Damn them if they lead me to stray from the balance I have found)
Want and need; ( I need to be mindful of what I want -vs- what I need)
if I need, ( beacause if I need the excess )
Then I might as well be gone... ( I might as well not be here for you at all )


Shine on forever ( Let your love and spirit and who you are shine on forever)
Shine on benevolent son (my SON )
Shine down upon the broken ( Let it shine on me untill my two personas balance)
Shine on 'til the two become one (untill I find that balance through my love of son)


Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent son
Shine down upon the severed
Shine [on 'til / until] the two become one (see above)


Divide and wither away ( If I try to keep these aspects divided I wither away)
Divided, withering away
Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son. ( Let your love of your son heal you )


Breathe in union ( So let these two aspects of myself come together)

So, as one, survive (And as one person survive)
Another day and season (and it will get easier day to day ...season to season)
Silence legion save your poison (And temptation to slip dont speak)
Silence legion stay out of my way (And temptation to slip get out of my way)


I really feel like this is it.

A few things to keep in mind :

The whole Son/Sun thing and Jambi being a kingdom with a sultan in Indonesia is fine...Maynard loves the dual meanings....in between sniffs/sips of coke anyone ?

He talks in 10,000 days/Wings about the little light she gave to him he is going to let it shine to guide her home........hmmmm letting a light shine to heal and guide someone you love dearly..... (see above)

Also this song before 10k days/Wings makes sense in that it is about his relationship of focus with his future (son) into his relationship of focus with his past (mom)....nice transition in my opinion....

Of course I dont expect my interpretation to change the masses minds but I can relate...

I used to party everynight.....Wine Women and Song....I made a ton of money and spent it on everything from limos to keeping the party going well into the next morning......Then my son was born and I realized when I held him for the first time that my life was forever changed.....I gave up the life and took a less demanding new job where altough I make a little less money I have more time to spend with my son my new center of focus for 3 years now...

I still party here and there but in a much more subdued way and will gladly not go out if I can spend some quality time with my son.

He changed my life and now it is my job to change his.....

I think thats the spirit in which Maynard wrote this one.....

What do you think ? Sounds good. The Cool thing about Maynard and his lyrical writing , I think is that he leaves it open to many different forms of interpretablity. You have found an angle in Jambi that you can most easily relate to the growing relationship with your boy , and in doing so can then relate that very same situation to Maynard and his boy. I can see how you can get to conclusion of it being about his boy , but there could possibly be another angle yet to be seen .

Matt8
04-14-2007, 01:33 PM
sounds pretty much like thats it.

Hannibal
04-15-2007, 10:42 PM
this is the best song on the album, ***.

and I love this interpretation, but I'm still iffy on some of the lyrics, and I hope they release the official ones soon. I was listening to this earlier today in my car on my way to work, really loud, and I swear he says "Damn my life" twice, and then Damn My Eyes.

I seriously hear "life" an F sound the first two times, and its definitely "damn my eyes" the third time.

arg. but yeah, excellent song. One of my favorites by them.

fretforyourfigure462
05-02-2007, 10:36 AM
I feel like an idiot. I never ever thought of it that way. That is great man. That song really makes sense now that I look at it that way. But still, one question I have. Yeah the song is about his son probably, but why is the song called Jambi?

Inner_Eulogy
05-03-2007, 09:37 AM
I feel like an idiot. I never ever thought of it that way. That is great man. That song really makes sense now that I look at it that way. But still, one question I have. Yeah the song is about his son probably, but why is the song called Jambi?

Dunno, Jambi the Pee Wee genie, Jambi the divided penninsula, Jambi the iambic meter...perhaps all 3 and more...who knows

amze
05-04-2007, 04:18 PM
This song is not about his son, it's about Jesus

Go listen to Opiate, or Eulogy *Which can swing two ways* or Jerk Off and come back, then you'll know Manard isn't to hot on religion or jesus.


I mean you can dissect other songs, like this one and say hes "Pro" religion or Jesus but Opiate flat out 100% counters any of that talk , its very straight foward and has some of the smartest lyrics I've ever heard. You got your head in your ass if you think Tool is a "pro" religious/jesus band. Think about it.


Awesome write up though, to the creator of this thread, way to break it down. Makes good sense to me

Inner_Eulogy
05-07-2007, 09:30 AM
Go listen to Opiate, or Eulogy *Which can swing two ways* or Jerk Off and come back, then you'll know Manard isn't to hot on religion or jesus.


I mean you can dissect other songs, like this one and say hes "Pro" religion or Jesus but Opiate flat out 100% counters any of that talk , its very straight foward and has some of the smartest lyrics I've ever heard. You got your head in your ass if you think Tool is a "pro" religious/jesus band. Think about it.


Awesome write up though, to the creator of this thread, way to break it down. Makes good sense to me

Yeah, it definately takes a little bit of ignorance to think this song is about Jesus

Treve
05-07-2007, 03:55 PM
Thats a great interpretation. Never thought of it that way but it makes sense.

the white
05-11-2007, 01:45 AM
very interesting interpretation, well thought

sylph
05-21-2007, 02:13 AM
greenbuds, i think you are right, but in my interp. i see him as telling his son to wait until his distractions are done with, so that they can "breathe in union"....

"...damn my eyes if they should compromise a fulcrum..." -nard cant focus on his son yet, because he still has important work with tool [and even maybe cadacues] to do, and needs to focus all his energy on that. and i think the song is about telling devo [his son] to wait for tool to be finished, so that he doesnt do a half assed job with tool and half assed job with devo.
"shine on... until the two become one" hes sayin to devo to shine on until the two things that are important two him, become one ...





I completely disagree with this comment. Basically to paraphrase, it sounds to me as if you think in this song that Maynard is saying, "Hey Devo, Look mate, I understand that your growing up and I don't seem to be able to be around and be a positive and active part of your life right now, but, hell, you've just gotta understand that Ive got way more important things in my life than you. One day I'll have time for you, just not now. Harden up! Put your needs on hold until I have time for you."


Now, I don't know Maynard, and don't know very much about him or any or the other members of Tool's personal lives, but Id like to think he's not that much of a cock. ;)

Inner_Eulogy
05-21-2007, 09:23 AM
I completely disagree with this comment. Basically to paraphrase, it sounds to me as if you think in this song that Maynard is saying, "Hey Devo, Look mate, I understand that your growing up and I don't seem to be able to be around and be a positive and active part of your life right now, but, hell, you've just gotta understand that Ive got way more important things in my life than you. One day I'll have time for you, just not now. Harden up! Put your needs on hold until I have time for you."


Now, I don't know Maynard, and don't know very much about him or any or the other members of Tool's personal lives, but Id like to think he's not that much of a cock. ;)

No kiddin, especially when he's saying he'd wish it all away. That guy did not think his post through very well.

insectpinsNR
05-24-2007, 06:41 PM
I think that this song is about how Maynard was on the brink of a problem with excess and he changed for his son....Beacause his son changed him....


Here from the king's mountain view (I am on top of the world)
Here from the wild dream come true ( Its a dream come true)
Feast like a sultan, I do .... ( I love the excess)
On treasures and flesh never few ( money and women especially)


But I would wish it all, away
If I thought I'd lose you just one day (But I love you and would give it up)


The devil and his had me down ( I know a dark side of excess)
In love with the dark side I've found ( and I tended to like it )
Dabblin' all the way down ( I tried it all )
Up to my neck soon to drown. ( It was starting to be a problem)

But you changed that all for me ( but then you came into my life)
Lifted me up, turned me round ( and I realized you were more important)


So I, I would wish this all away ( So I would give it up)


Pray like a martyr dusk to dawn ( Worshipped excess all night long)
Beg like a hooker all night long ( begged for it...loved it...lived for it )
Shout to the devil with my song ( My Music got me all the excess)
And got what I wanted all along ( And I got all I wanted and more)


But I
I would
If I could
I would
Wish it away
Wish it away
Wish it all away
Wanna wish it all away ( I wanted to leave this life in a way)
No person could hold sway ( nobody could tell me to change)
Or justify my toe just a fine line (nobody could justify my being at the edge)
Giving away my center ( I was giving away my energy and love )


So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow, they'd take you away ( I realize now )


You're my piece of mind, ( your my focus )
my own (my own son)
my center (my new center of focus and love)
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day ( I am taking it day by day..like anyone else)


Damn my eyes! (damn these temptations I see all the time)
Jambi Eyes....
Damn my eyes...
If they should compromise
A fulcrum (Damn them if they lead me to stray from the balance I have found)
Want and need; ( I need to be mindful of what I want -vs- what I need)
if I need, ( beacause if I need the excess )
Then I might as well be gone... ( I might as well not be here for you at all )


Shine on forever ( Let your love and spirit and who you are shine on forever)
Shine on benevolent son (my SON )
Shine down upon the broken ( Let it shine on me untill my two personas balance)
Shine on 'til the two become one (untill I find that balance through my love of son)


Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent son
Shine down upon the severed
Shine [on 'til / until] the two become one (see above)


Divide and wither away ( If I try to keep these aspects divided I wither away)
Divided, withering away
Shine down upon the many, light our way,
Benevolent son. ( Let your love of your son heal you )


Breathe in union ( So let these two aspects of myself come together)

So, as one, survive (And as one person survive)
Another day and season (and it will get easier day to day ...season to season)
Silence legion save your poison (And temptation to slip dont speak)
Silence legion stay out of my way (And temptation to slip get out of my way)


I really feel like this is it.

A few things to keep in mind :

The whole Son/Sun thing and Jambi being a kingdom with a sultan in Indonesia is fine...Maynard loves the dual meanings....in between sniffs/sips of coke anyone ?

He talks in 10,000 days/Wings about the little light she gave to him he is going to let it shine to guide her home........hmmmm letting a light shine to heal and guide someone you love dearly..... (see above)

Also this song before 10k days/Wings makes sense in that it is about his relationship of focus with his future (son) into his relationship of focus with his past (mom)....nice transition in my opinion....

Of course I dont expect my interpretation to change the masses minds but I can relate...

I used to party everynight.....Wine Women and Song....I made a ton of money and spent it on everything from limos to keeping the party going well into the next morning......Then my son was born and I realized when I held him for the first time that my life was forever changed.....I gave up the life and took a less demanding new job where altough I make a little less money I have more time to spend with my son my new center of focus for 3 years now...

I still party here and there but in a much more subdued way and will gladly not go out if I can spend some quality time with my son.

He changed my life and now it is my job to change his.....

I think thats the spirit in which Maynard wrote this one.....

What do you think ?


if we knew less about the members personal lives ,like they would like, we wouldnt know what the lyrics are ment to be about like this ..but very nice and good

FashionablyLame'
05-27-2007, 07:57 PM
It could definitely see as being about Maynard's son. I think it really is about analyzing the importance of the relationships you have with those who you truly love and want around you, and your disgusted with your own apathy towards maintaining those connections. There is a lot of apprehension and desperation in this song as well, you know cause he's

" just tryingta hold on one more day..."

and it sort of a realization of how many and how strong the demons are that you have to fight to get back to where you first were, and the determination based on the love to restore once again.


It reminds me of myself.

God I love you MJK


Miss Lame'

felix45
06-23-2007, 07:27 PM
it doesn't mean the same thing to me (it being the song) but the meaning to me is very similar. instead of my son (what seeing as I dont have a son) I consider it to be someone else I love. dont really feel like going into that but yeah very nice interp I look forward to your future posts :)

GoLoBuLouS
06-28-2007, 02:40 PM
Why the fuck did he say that?

Because his eyes are Jambi (Peewee Herman genie), what he wants, he gets.

It's like that kid in the Twilight Zone video.

GoLoBuLouS
06-28-2007, 02:49 PM
Another thought about this passages:

You're my peace of mind, my own
I said I'm just trying to hold on, one more day

It really sounds like he says "om" (phonetically).


In yoga, Om is the sound of the universe. It usually follows at the end of a session. This period of the session is the one which leaves you relaxed, calm and (ideally)de-stressed.

I really like the Om idea... especially since it fits so well with Peace of Mind.

mukoh
08-10-2007, 10:28 PM
I think this is a great interpretation of the lyrics, I love it. Makes sense

Angel on the Sideline
09-19-2007, 05:15 AM
I completely agree with your interpretation. It's the same one I hold.

nitoro
09-19-2007, 08:41 AM
spot on. thanx.

guitarguru85
12-14-2007, 04:19 PM
GreenBudsGreenTea,

I really appreciate your interpretation of this song. I had been mulling it over in my head for about a week and had a couple of ideas that had come to me. I suppose that it would be helpful to actually know more facts about Maynard's life in order to gain a better understanding of his words. I'm getting there.

The first idea that I had about this song was that it was related to the death of his mother and that he was trying to wish her back. Bargaining is a step in the grieving process and I thought perhaps this was his account of trying to bargain for the life of his mother.

The second interpretation that came to me was inspired when I started to think of it relation to his other works, particularly the song "Judith" by APC. I have always thought of this song as a sort of vent for Maynard's frustration at his mother's devotion to a religion that never helped her. It is as if he was holding it over her head that she had been a good Christian and God had rewarded her with paralysis. The words seem as if he is chastising her, questioning her, and attempting to talk her out of her faith, as if he is the one who sees the truth. The Devil's greatest fault was his vanity. He chose to reign in hell rather than serve in heaven. In "10,000 Days" Maynard references his own arrogance and that he is stuck in it and that the burden of proof is placed on the believers. I interpreted the "Devil" that Maynard refers to all throughout "Jambi" as his own arrogance and that upon his mother's death, he was regretting his arrogance. I think that while he may have never understood or shared his mother's beliefs, that upon losing her, he gained and admiration for her devotion. I think that the "benovelent sun" is his mother Judith. He does make multiple references to her being a light throughout the rest of the album. I think that in the end, he realized how important his mother was to him and that he really did need her in his life. It was my interpretation toward the end of the song he is calling for her guidance, her love, her help to show him something. I don't think that he has "found religion" by any means, but I think that Maynard would like to beileve in something as fervently as his mother did. In this interpretation I saw the "silence Legion" lines as his arrogance creeping back into his mind and him trying to shut it out and ignore it.

While I realize that this is a bit of a strecth, this was my initial reaction to the song. I love music on this track, and Adam's guitars are sounding bettter with every album in my opinion. I also want to commend everyone who is posting to this website and discussing Tool's art. I am pretty new to the site and amazed at the level of insight that so many of you offer. I look forward to reading your thoughts and hopefully sharing some of mine with you.

Zosimos
03-26-2008, 01:47 PM
nice, i could see this. All though we will never know. But i like how you were able to relate to this song as i do, but in a different way...With the lyrics of tool being so cryptic, i like hearing peoples own interpretaion, but i dont like when some of the fans bash each others ideas...lets just keep in mind that the music is cryptic for the exact reason...so we all can identify with it in our own ways. peace

dxs
05-02-2008, 12:22 PM
Well, you just may be right.

panther5547
12-08-2008, 12:26 PM
I doubt this will get read, as I'm pretty late to the party. I've had a list of favorite songs and there has always been a contingent of tool in that list but until the past couple of months I didn't get it. I've since been playing catch up and I must say tool has completely ruined many other bands for me. (most recently the new guns album) other stuff just sounds recycled and retarded with nothing deeper to say.

Ok, on to Jambi:

I've read in many articles with Maynard where he talks about letting the music speak to us before trying to decipher meaning from the lyrics. I've been a musician/songwriter for as long as I can remember and recently playing with a band where they would write alot of the music and I would later put my vocals and lyrics to it. I say that because I wonder how much the "music" is put together before Maynard writes his parts (as it really does affect the song writing process and feeling)

Jambi first struck me musically as a dream........don't know how to explain that better. I just felt swept into a dream in listening to the song, struggle, push and pull, and how dreams can change theme yet remain intact as a whole.

This song will also carry a special place in my life as about two weeks ago I found out my wife was having a baby. I have a son who is 14, but I was so young (19) that I was totally separated from the experience. I was against having any more children because my life has been so fruitful, I can do what I want when I want. To suddenly and without planning have that taken away was a shock. I went to take a shower to think and figure out how I feel about this and Jambi came on....the words suddenly made sense. Many of you have done such a great job of debating and digging into meaning of the song, I don't want to recreate the wheel. I just want to say that I understand the great love and connection, willingness to change what has been a very easy life for something great, yet being conflicted by the choice. Feeling like a martyr...even though it's for your own and feeling dirty "like a hooker" for wanting your own needs met. That struggle for balance of selfish want and need to be better and do better. In that moment I could decide to keep it or deny it. I could be on bored or fade into the backround and dive into my own selfishness...in that moment I decided to be on board.

To sum up, the song came on, I realized that this child deserved the opportunity to shine and Maybe it should be named "Jambi" although I doubt mom will go for that.

thanks

Inner_Eulogy
12-08-2008, 02:55 PM
I doubt this will get read, as I'm pretty late to the party. I've had a list of favorite songs and there has always been a contingent of tool in that list but until the past couple of months I didn't get it. I've since been playing catch up and I must say tool has completely ruined many other bands for me. (most recently the new guns album) other stuff just sounds recycled and retarded with nothing deeper to say.

Ok, on to Jambi:

I've read in many articles with Maynard where he talks about letting the music speak to us before trying to decipher meaning from the lyrics. I've been a musician/songwriter for as long as I can remember and recently playing with a band where they would write alot of the music and I would later put my vocals and lyrics to it. I say that because I wonder how much the "music" is put together before Maynard writes his parts (as it really does affect the song writing process and feeling)

Jambi first struck me musically as a dream........don't know how to explain that better. I just felt swept into a dream in listening to the song, struggle, push and pull, and how dreams can change theme yet remain intact as a whole.

This song will also carry a special place in my life as about two weeks ago I found out my wife was having a baby. I have a son who is 14, but I was so young (19) that I was totally separated from the experience. I was against having any more children because my life has been so fruitful, I can do what I want when I want. To suddenly and without planning have that taken away was a shock. I went to take a shower to think and figure out how I feel about this and Jambi came on....the words suddenly made sense. Many of you have done such a great job of debating and digging into meaning of the song, I don't want to recreate the wheel. I just want to say that I understand the great love and connection, willingness to change what has been a very easy life for something great, yet being conflicted by the choice. Feeling like a martyr...even though it's for your own and feeling dirty "like a hooker" for wanting your own needs met. That struggle for balance of selfish want and need to be better and do better. In that moment I could decide to keep it or deny it. I could be on bored or fade into the backround and dive into my own selfishness...in that moment I decided to be on board.

To sum up, the song came on, I realized that this child deserved the opportunity to shine and Maybe it should be named "Jambi" although I doubt mom will go for that.

thanks

*applaude* I know exactly how you feel my man. Went through the same feelings and emotions too, worried about my own selfish wants and needs but I gave those up when I was only 23, my son is now 5yrs old and I chose the right path too.

Loosen
08-08-2009, 06:21 PM
Yea it was his addiction to money and women..... I think the song is about having one's head up one's ass for a little too long. And if they don't pull it out soon they'll just be a hazard to others. ...GREAT JOB!

Silence Legion
08-10-2009, 02:13 AM
"Silence, Legion, save your poison
silence, Legion, stay out of my way."

Keenan has never ended a song in a better way.

SlaveNoMore
10-06-2010, 01:46 PM
Isn't it funny that so many of us can lead lives of shallow debasement for so long without a care to physical, mental and spiritual damage, yet decide to change and grow so suddenly when the care of another life is put into our keeping? Love is indeed the most powerful force in all of Creation. Bless you and your's, my friend, and the choices that you make.

F1ugtier
07-02-2011, 12:40 AM
I doubt this will get read, as I'm pretty late to the party. I've had a list of favorite songs and there has always been a contingent of tool in that list but until the past couple of months I didn't get it. I've since been playing catch up and I must say tool has completely ruined many other bands for me. (most recently the new guns album) other stuff just sounds recycled and retarded with nothing deeper to say.


This is so true.

Angel on the Sideline
09-06-2011, 05:32 AM
First of all, the guys in TOOL are substantially older than 27. They're around 50. Furthermore, I can assure you Jambi has absolutely nothing to do with Kurt Cobain.

Inner_Eulogy
09-06-2011, 10:46 AM
First of all, the guys in TOOL are substantially older than 27. They're around 50. Furthermore, I can assure you Jambi has absolutely nothing to do with Kurt Cobain.

lol

chaosmosis
11-05-2011, 10:09 AM
this looks like a good interpretation to me, BUT i would subsitute the figure of son for wife/partner.

upon the mountain- vastening of consciousness

treasures and fleash- its good to be alive and the abilities of enlightenment here are treasures to be found in life.

you see, jmk's attitude to religion WAS one of dismisal and he followed his shadow (jung) down and down dealing with only the dark side. however jmk these days is far more spiritual - enlightened - so now he says i need a centre, i need to stand in the light as well as the dark. to balence his personality. this quality of change in jmk's lyrics is evident and i feel he would gladly give up his lopsided yin yang enlightend and vast consciousness if that dark side ever troubled his love life.

he says damb my eyes if i should compromise as a statement of intent. to shut down if the darkness in creation should overwhel him after years of a godless Dionysus.

the search for enlightenment can be a perilous journy and i think here he is saying that the female, the anima, and the male, animus, must be formed around his centre and it seems a new love in anyone's life can lead to a rejection of occult FOR the Divine.

the original post gets close to looking at the meaning but without the yin yang, anima animus stuff it fall short of a full study.

Mohandas_Rand
01-19-2012, 03:31 AM
I always viewed this song about not wanting to cheat on his girlfriend while on the road.

I guess son works too.

Doesn't really matter to me, since it means neither of those to me.

Inner_Eulogy
01-20-2012, 02:59 PM
heh heh N00Bz

I Feed On Life
01-24-2012, 07:01 PM
I always thought it was about his mother dying, sort of as a prelude to the following song. I see where you are coming from, though.

ACSD
06-10-2014, 01:16 PM
Great, interpretation, explanation, articulation...