Maynard talks to the mirror

[orangedarkblue]

Alright, flame away...


I actually think Nard is pointing the finger at himself in this song.

Taking drugs (weeping shades of chosen indigo, due to self inflicted lemon juice in one's high eye) and jumping to conclusions on Religion at large, based on drug experiences and prejudice - ('When you pissed all over my black kettle' [a possible reference to chief Black Kettle *], 'kangaroo done hung the guilty with the innocent') Keenan concludes he must've been... high'

'Foot in mouth and head up ass
so whatcha talking bout
difficult to dance round this one
till you pull it out boy'

If you think of 'Foot in mouth and head up ass' as the figure on the Aenima disc; as long as you don't put the CD-player out and keep that disc spinning, it's kinda difficult to dance around, i.e. see the other side of it, and it remains this monolithic statement that can easily pass off as True...

'Liar, lawyer - mirror, show me what's the difference?'

Sounds to me like a bit of MJK soul searching, as if he's trying to define a new personal attitude towards religion. See also recent interviews.



-----------------------------------

* MJK could be referring to Southern Cheyenne chief Black Kettle (??-1868) . (Remember that the track following this one is actual native American chanting).

Chief Black Kettle was sort of a native American Gandhi, or Jesus Christ type of guy. His repeated efforts to secure a peace with honor for his people, despite broken promises and attacks on his own life, speak of him as a great leader with an almost unique vision of the possiblity for coexistence between white society and the culture of the plains.

Custer attacked Black Kettle's village on November 27, 1868, in a _misled attempt at revenge_, well within the boundaries of the Cheyenne reservation and with a white flag flying above the chief's own tipi. He must have been high.

"Both the chief and his wife fell at the river bank riddled with bullets," one witness reported, "the soldiers rode right over Black Kettle and his wife and their horse as they lay dead on the ground, and their bodies were all splashed with mud by the charging soldiers." Custer later reported that an Osage guide took Black Kettle's scalp.

[NawnimNonNomen]

Wow, this is almost exactly what I've been thinking for the past week. Driving for hours in the car with 10k spinning repeatedly, I noticed how The Pot follows right after Wings I and II, and my first thought was that maybe this song was Maynard's mom as a persona, calling him out near the end of her time here. By the fifth or sixth repetition, that didn't make as much sense anymore--because if she was that solidly founded in a humble, forgiving spirit, such an act (and the venom in the voice) would be a bit inconsistent. Besides, if it ran chronologically, then she'd be yelling after her death. Then I thought how it would make more sense for now-Maynard to be yelling at then-Maynard, and everything clicked. How many times has he been eyeholes deep or out of his head (drugs, maybe his own arrogance)?

The thing that hammered it down for me was the mirror reference. Notice how in the sleeve pic of Maynard, the Maynard holding out booze to the viewer has the fake mohawk. When he did "Opiate," he had the mohawk going, and when he did "Judith," he had the wig on: then-Maynards, presented the drunken rock-and-roller to his fans. Meanwhile, the bald Maynard in the mirror is the one being held by the woman--has a sort of new-born quality to it. And the two Maynards are looking away from eachother, as though they've both said their pieces and are turning their backs on eachother. Then two, the album is sort of split down the middle around Lipan, with the early part being mostly about Maynard's mother (Vicarious excepted) and the second part being drug-influenced and trippy (Right in Two excepted). It's like a yin-yang album, joined together by a call for protection.

Ok, so I've blown the thing way up in my head, but at least someone else is hearing something similar in "The Pot."

[loadedmemory]

i'm buying this theory.

nice posts!!

[RidetheRedshift]

yep works for me. but one thing to add. rather that just yin/yang ..what about wings (not the song but the flying kind)? like I see a grounded bird shakes the icicles off his left wing and then his right....and takes flight.

[weak&weary]

yep works for me. but one thing to add. rather that just yin/yang ..what about wings (not the song but the flying kind)? like I see a grounded bird shakes the icicles off his left wing and then his right....and takes flight.
What a metaphor! It would make sense in the context of Tool's thematic progression for the band to take wing after the promised loftiness of "Lateralus". Very nice thread here... I've been going nuts trying to see a link in the songs, an overall theme, and these posts have really helped out. Thanks!

[Lachrymologist]

I'm pretty sure "piss all over my black kettle" is simply referring to "the pot calling the kettle black" furthering emphasizing the whole hypocrisy idea.

[Alcawhorlick]

I'm pretty sure "piss all over my black kettle" is simply referring to "the pot calling the kettle black" furthering emphasizing the whole hypocrisy idea.

I agree.

He very well could be pointing the finger at himself though.

[Dredg]

I have Maynards Mommy Thread still up and runing if anybody wants to check that out.

[æmoeba•°·.]

hm/.//..///...////.....

[PriceisRight]

wow....I was gonna flame...but after reading that I think it's the most sense I've seen on this site in a while.

10 e-props to you my good sir.

[orangedarkblue]

I'm pretty sure "piss all over my black kettle" is simply referring to "the pot calling the kettle black" furthering emphasizing the whole hypocrisy idea.

Alright! Thanks for the support guys.

As to black kettle, you are right of course, at 1st glance. Tool have repeatedly stated that their lyrics are multi layered. At the same time they are known to downplay the significance of what MJK sings in interviews. For instance around the release of Lateralus, MJK has stated that he's not too much into astrology, whereas, if you read the lyrics astrologically - Holy Fucking Shit. He was in way over his head at the time...

Now if you google 'black kettle', the very first thing that pops up is the nice guy chief. Seems to me an obvious next layer, also in connection to what I copy-pasted about the man above. 'You pissed all over my black kettle' could be sort of MJK taking the stance of 'Religion', and saying to himself hey, stop throwing stones at this fragile cardhouse here man.

[Warartist]

Alright, flame away...


I actually think Nard is pointing the finger at himself in this song.

Taking drugs (weeping shades of chosen indigo, due to self inflicted lemon juice in one's high eye) and jumping to conclusions on Religion at large, based on drug experiences and prejudice - ('When you pissed all over my black kettle' [a possible reference to chief Black Kettle *], 'kangaroo done hung the guilty with the innocent') Keenan concludes he must've been... high'

'Foot in mouth and head up ass
so whatcha talking bout
difficult to dance round this one
till you pull it out boy'

If you think of 'Foot in mouth and head up ass' as the figure on the Aenima disc; as long as you don't put the CD-player out and keep that disc spinning, it's kinda difficult to dance around, i.e. see the other side of it, and it remains this monolithic statement that can easily pass off as True...

'Liar, lawyer - mirror, show me what's the difference?'

Sounds to me like a bit of MJK soul searching, as if he's trying to define a new personal attitude towards religion. See also recent interviews.



-----------------------------------

* MJK could be referring to Southern Cheyenne chief Black Kettle (??-1868) . (Remember that the track following this one is actual native American chanting).

Chief Black Kettle was sort of a native American Gandhi, or Jesus Christ type of guy. His repeated efforts to secure a peace with honor for his people, despite broken promises and attacks on his own life, speak of him as a great leader with an almost unique vision of the possiblity for coexistence between white society and the culture of the plains.

Custer attacked Black Kettle's village on November 27, 1868, in a _misled attempt at revenge_, well within the boundaries of the Cheyenne reservation and with a white flag flying above the chief's own tipi. He must have been high.

"Both the chief and his wife fell at the river bank riddled with bullets," one witness reported, "the soldiers rode right over Black Kettle and his wife and their horse as they lay dead on the ground, and their bodies were all splashed with mud by the charging soldiers." Custer later reported that an Osage guide took Black Kettle's scalp.

Oh no, there it is again "nard":( Oh well guess I'm gonna have to let that one go.

It sounds OK i guess, but ultimately I still think this song being about our government is the best theory. In that case him saying black kettle being reference to this chief still makes since. Thats just another fuck up on the American government the whole genocide with the native Americans being worse than anything Hitler and his Nazi army's did. However it can mean at the same time the pot calling the kettle black, as Tool's music is very versatile and able to imply many meanings at once. Then theres the kangaroo court reference, witch makes me lean even more toward the idea that he's talking about the hypocrisy of the government and the control they have to get what ever outcome they choose while pulling the wool over the eyes of its own people and making them believe the control is in their hands. I just don't believe this song is about drugs, but you know it could be partially with the multiple meanings of tool songs you never can tell. From what I've heard tho Maynard's songs that do speak about drugs are usually his take on the experiences of people he knows and not his own. He has dabbled a bit but he's never been a junkie or to the point where he feared he would fuck his life up with it, and really from some of the info I've gathered I'm pretty sure his dabbling days are long gone.
So thats my 2 cents, nice post tho you seem to have put allot of thought into it.
Mandy

[NawnimNonNomen]

yep works for me. but one thing to add. rather that just yin/yang ..what about wings (not the song but the flying kind)? like I see a grounded bird shakes the icicles off his left wing and then his right....and takes flight.

That is a great metaphor. In keeping with my tendency to blow simple ideas up into huge ones, the last few seconds of Viginti Tres sound like something taking off to me--more of a jet engine sound than bird, but it's flight. Anyone else hear that?

Warartist, I see your point, and I think it has some bearing on government. But that doesn't mean it can't be personal and spiritual and conceptual at the same time. MJK's lyrics always seem to have a certain level of ambiguity and pointed references that make a number of meanings possible.

Now to take RedShift's bird image way the hell out there . . . http://www.abardoncompanion.com/BardonPraxis/msg01823.html

I ran across Bardon system when I noticed the word "anima" on a number of chakra drawings and started searching it with the other words on the drawings like "prakamya" and "mahima." I thought at the time that "anima" and "Aenima" made a lot of sense together--anima being about minuteness and (-) ions sounding as though I was sitting at the center of an atom, listening to the ions whirl by.

anima--minuteness--Aenima
mahima--magnitude--Salival (expanded consciousness, building off of 3rd eye's repetition)

garima--Gravity--I'm not sure how this would link to Lateralus, but
laghima--Lightness--"the power underlying the phenomenon of levitation" seems to tie in with the wings imagery in 10k days.

Yeah, I know that's over the top, and some "herm-lol-<3-muhaha" guy is going to jump in now and remind me "its jest music, dude." But, there it is.

[orangedarkblue]

anima--minuteness--Aenima
mahima--magnitude--Salival (expanded consciousness, building off of 3rd eye's repetition)

garima--Gravity--I'm not sure how this would link to Lateralus, but
laghima--Lightness--"the power underlying the phenomenon of levitation" seems to tie in with the wings imagery in 10k days.




yup, more will always be revealed....

[Artistic Sickness]

Lovely thoughts on the subject... i never noticed the lack of mohawk in the mirror image... very interesting...

[bellamadia]

WOW, I hadn't thought of this, but I think this makes so much sense!! WONDERFUL interpretation! REALLY. I can't wait to get out of work and listen to the song again with this is mind.

[bellamadia]

I'm pretty sure "piss all over my black kettle" is simply referring to "the pot calling the kettle black" furthering emphasizing the whole hypocrisy idea.

Yes, but I think (in accordance with the person that started this thread) that means he might possibly be hypocrital himself.

[Lysanderdarkstar]

...

anima--minuteness--Aenima
mahima--magnitude--Salival (expanded consciousness, building off of 3rd eye's repetition)

garima--Gravity--I'm not sure how this would link to Lateralus, but
laghima--Lightness--"the power underlying the phenomenon of levitation" seems to tie in with the wings imagery in 10k days.



IMO the first 11 tracks of Lateralus are pretty much about being dragged down just look into the lyrics if you need help let me know but i saw it pretty instantly... btw i love your idea...

[Lysanderdarkstar]

Alright, flame away...

i'ts REALLY hard to flame somthing that makes this much sense... lol genius man...

[orangedarkblue]

It sounds OK i guess, but ultimately I still think this song being about our government is the best theory.
.......

So thats my 2 cents, nice post tho you seem to have put allot of thought into it.

Mandy

Thanks for the thoughts Mandy,

I don't think there is a problem though, these lyrics have many underlying significances, and your interpretation doesn't have to bite mine. The beauty of all great art, poetry, religion etc. is that everybody gets tot get struck in their own personal way. Your feelings and mine are always valid, even if the creator never put them in the work of art in the first place.

[Warartist]

Oh no, there it is again "nard":( Oh well guess I'm gonna have to let that one go.

It sounds OK i guess, but ultimately I still think this song being about our government is the best theory. In that case him saying black kettle being reference to this chief still makes since. Thats just another fuck up on the American government the whole genocide with the native Americans being worse than anything Hitler and his Nazi army's did. However it can mean at the same time the pot calling the kettle black, as Tool's music is very versatile and able to imply many meanings at once. Then theres the kangaroo court reference, witch makes me lean even more toward the idea that he's talking about the hypocrisy of the government and the control they have to get what ever outcome they choose while pulling the wool over the eyes of its own people and making them believe the control is in their hands. I just don't believe this song is about drugs, but you know it could be partially with the multiple meanings of tool songs you never can tell. From what I've heard tho Maynard's songs that do speak about drugs are usually his take on the experiences of people he knows and not his own. He has dabbled a bit but he's never been a junkie or to the point where he feared he would fuck his life up with it, and really from some of the info I've gathered I'm pretty sure his dabbling days are long gone.
So thats my 2 cents, nice post tho you seem to have put allot of thought into it.
Mandy

Quote me entirely if you intend to do it.

I didn't "bite" you, but perhaps I should have. Obviously you don't think my thought's are very valid or you wouldn't have deleted them in your quote. Yes every one experiences it their own way me being one of them, this is an opinion board if you don't want to hear opposing ideas don't start a thread.
I didn't even come close to saying your idea was shit, simply that I don't agree with it.
You are right, "many underlying significances" just as I stated in my post that I've put back up for you to read since you seem confused about what I said the first time.

How about this time... You try to read between the lines....

M.

[Warartist]

Nawnimno....um.. long name:)
I totally agree as I said its very possible there are many meanings. Tool does that. Just for me it makes more since my way, but the point is to find how it relates to yourself and gather your own meaning from it. Right? So ya I have no idea what Tool meant I just know how it feel's for me.
mandy

[Warartist]

Anima-Latin for soul, secondary life, spirit, mind....

Anima Jung's term for archetype of femininity within the psyche of every man.

Jung equates this with the soul.

Animus the personification of all psychological masculine tendencies in a female.

Anima-mans unconscious women.
Animus- womens unconscious man.

enema-flushing of the bowels........ Are you clean inside?

Aenima-Tool for flushing of the soul.

[orangedarkblue]

Oh no, there it is again "nard":( Oh well guess I'm gonna have to let that one go.

It sounds OK i guess, but ultimately I still think this song being about our government is the best theory. In that case him saying black kettle being reference to this chief still makes since. Thats just another fuck up on the American government the whole genocide with the native Americans being worse than anything Hitler and his Nazi army's did. However it can mean at the same time the pot calling the kettle black, as Tool's music is very versatile and able to imply many meanings at once. Then theres the kangaroo court reference, witch makes me lean even more toward the idea that he's talking about the hypocrisy of the government and the control they have to get what ever outcome they choose while pulling the wool over the eyes of its own people and making them believe the control is in their hands. I just don't believe this song is about drugs, but you know it could be partially with the multiple meanings of tool songs you never can tell. From what I've heard tho Maynard's songs that do speak about drugs are usually his take on the experiences of people he knows and not his own. He has dabbled a bit but he's never been a junkie or to the point where he feared he would fuck his life up with it, and really from some of the info I've gathered I'm pretty sure his dabbling days are long gone.
So thats my 2 cents, nice post tho you seem to have put allot of thought into it.
Mandy

Hey chill, I just shortened it for convenience. There you have uit in full, lady. :)

[orangedarkblue]

Anima-Latin for soul, secondary life, spirit, mind....

Anima Jung's term for archetype of femininity within the psyche of every man.

Jung equates this with the soul.

Animus the personification of all psychological masculine tendencies in a female.

Anima-mans unconscious women.
Animus- womens unconscious man.

enema-flushing of the bowels........ Are you clean inside?

Aenima-Tool for flushing of the soul.

Yup, right again. flushing the soul from beneath, - as in entering via the subconciousness - , I might add. :)

[Warartist]

Hey chill, I just shortened it for convenience. There you have uit in full, lady. :)

Sorry,I have a few people jumping down my throat lately for having a different perspective on some things guess I'm a little on guard. Sorry:)

[Warartist]

Yup, right again. flushing the soul from beneath, - as in entering via the subconciousness - , I might add. :)

Right on:)

[NawnimNonNomen]

Anima-Latin for soul, secondary life, spirit, mind....

Anima Jung's term for archetype of femininity within the psyche of every man.

Jung equates this with the soul.

Animus the personification of all psychological masculine tendencies in a female.

Anima-mans unconscious women.
Animus- womens unconscious man.

enema-flushing of the bowels........ Are you clean inside?

Aenima-Tool for flushing of the soul.

Thanks for posting that one. I'm aware of the Jung-inspired breakdown--just a bit tired of it myself (mostly because years back it locked most discussions of lyrics into Jungian analysis, and things got repetitive).

I'm actually a bit leery of the anima+enema=aenema explanation (though I think there's certainly something to it). All the accounts I've heard have MJK stating that was the meaning at a final July concert on the Aenima tour, then explaining that it described a practice of divination from the remains of an enema . . . like reading tea-leaves. Talk about eye-hole deep in muddy water! The official term would be "spatilomancy," but I wonder if the whole thing was a joking reference to "scatology"--making it the second -ology discussed by Tool (and we all know how that first one turned out) and casting an album that begins with "Stinkfist" goes on to "Hooker with a Penis" and ends with "Third Eye" as scatological. You never know with these guys.

My anima/mahima thought is really just my way of reinvesting my energy in some of Tool's albums, sort of a "this changes everything" epiphany. And while I'm thinking it, why not go apostate and maybe get others buzzing? (Eventually, I'll probably get around to the Aenima forums to talk about how the songs deal a lot with getting tiny.) Plus, I like the idea that Tool would have at least four more distinctly different albums before they hop into their flying machines and leave.

At any rate, this isn't to dismiss your post or even argue with it, just to say: Isn't it cool how many different layers different folks can see?

[implandnoises]

Oh no, there it is again "nard":( Oh well guess I'm gonna have to let that one go.


I think Nard is a great shortening. Lets do it for the others. Dam, Tin, Ny and Nard.

Or how about Am, Stin, Ee and Ard. Well 'ard!

[Warartist]

I think Nard is a great shortening. Lets do it for the others. Dam, Tin, Ny and Nard.

Or how about Am, Stin, Ee and Ard. Well 'ard!

NNNnnnooooooooo!!!!! Please.. PLEASE STOPIT!! please, please I, I'm begging you dont.....No no,.... NO I'll do what ever you... PLease Oh Fuck Oh...Fuck..NNNOoooo... AAAAAHHHhhhhh aa ahhhhh ...........

[Warartist]

Thanks for posting that one. I'm aware of the Jung-inspired breakdown--just a bit tired of it myself (mostly because years back it locked most discussions of lyrics into Jungian analysis, and things got repetitive).

I'm actually a bit leery of the anima+enema=aenema explanation (though I think there's certainly something to it). All the accounts I've heard have MJK stating that was the meaning at a final July concert on the Aenima tour, then explaining that it described a practice of divination from the remains of an enema . . . like reading tea-leaves. Talk about eye-hole deep in muddy water! The official term would be "spatilomancy," but I wonder if the whole thing was a joking reference to "scatology"--making it the second -ology discussed by Tool (and we all know how that first one turned out) and casting an album that begins with "Stinkfist" goes on to "Hooker with a Penis" and ends with "Third Eye" as scatological. You never know with these guys.

My anima/mahima thought is really just my way of reinvesting my energy in some of Tool's albums, sort of a "this changes everything" epiphany. And while I'm thinking it, why not go apostate and maybe get others buzzing? (Eventually, I'll probably get around to the Aenima forums to talk about how the songs deal a lot with getting tiny.) Plus, I like the idea that Tool would have at least four more distinctly different albums before they hop into their flying machines and leave.

At any rate, this isn't to dismiss your post or even argue with it, just to say: Isn't it cool how many different layers different folks can see?

Ha, I like it. Flying machines:) Ya its cool man,that's what we have brains for right? Please dint think I was at all trying to attack your theory either. Truly you just never know with Tool. By all means, make em buzz if you wanna.