riff @ 7:04 exactly..

[revolution9]

When i hear people saying that they don't see the meshuggah influence in this album, i point them towards this riff. This has got to be the most ridiculous synchopation that they've pulled off. It's in 4/4, but the accents throw it all over the place. Am i still one of the few that can actually see where meshuggah's influence has left their mark on Tool?

[Spaceman Spiff]

I'll have to listen again for that particular part, but I can hear some bits in "Jambi" that remind me of Meshuggah as well. Though I haven't heard too much of them - I've mostly just listened to Catch 33, though.

[5th Eye]

15/4.

[toocooltool]

This is overwhelming.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Oh yeah. I see what you're talking about.

[StereoScopicLenses]

All hail Meshuggah. Thank god there's people out there that can hear that influence. Shit I can hear parts in vicarious (drum break down part), jambi, & RS. Not exactly like Meshuggah but definately influenced parts.. I love it. But that's cuz I listen to Meshuggah alot anyways.

[Bassmingo]

Noticed it on my first listen, its my fave part of the song, in this months rhythm magazine danny says something like "my left foot is playing 4, my right foot 5, and 6 with my hands"

Its got Hakke all over it.

[Spaceman Spiff]

All hail Meshuggah. Thank god there's people out there that can hear that influence. Shit I can hear parts in vicarious (drum break down part), jambi, & RS. Not exactly like Meshuggah but definately influenced parts.. I love it. But that's cuz I listen to Meshuggah alot anyways.
Agreed.

[Systolic]

Youre wrong.

Its in 3.

Just count from when the phrase starts... the little ticking sound gives it away.

[CaseLogic]

Yeah it's definitely in 3

[hbynoe]

i dont know much about synchopation..but yes...it is definitely stunning

[Bassmingo]

Youre wrong.

Its in 3.

Just count from when the phrase starts... the little ticking sound gives it away.

you calling a six foot seven drum beating motherfucker a liar? is danny carey gonna have ta choke a bitch?

[revolution9]

is danny carey gonna have ta choke a bitch?

lmfao

[revolution9]

the little ticking sound gives it away.

I thought that was my heart stopping.

[Meter Minorca]

danny didn't say in the interview that 7:04 was the part he was talking about, that part is definately in 3, but its a 5 bar phrase so its a bit confusing upon first listen, i would love to know when that part is, my guess is the outro

[champion]

Right. In 3, five-bar phrase, equaling 15/4.

[mike09]

it's awesome

[undertoes]

messugah can kiss my ass

[AguirreWrathOfTool]

Ok....the rhythm is a composite of 2 rhythmic motives (riffs) happening simultaneously.


-Motive #1 is is in 5. Now Tool writes a lot of their motives symmetrically, meaning that one can cut the measure in half (or just cut the duration of the beat you are counting in half) and it will yield two identical measures, so it doesn't really matter if you think of it in 5/4, 5/8 or 5/16 (after 5/16 it can no longer be symmetrically dissected), because either way you think about it it will work. The motive is comprised of a repetition of a little "cell" lasting 5 16th beats in duration. To make my online notation clear, a "0" stands for a beat when a note is hit and a "-" stands for a beat when a note is not hit. So this little cell of 5 16th beats goes like so: (0-0--). So if we were in 5/16, the notes would be hit on counts 1 and 3. But this cell is repeated continuously, making larger, but symmetrical, musical statements out of those repetitions which, logically, take place in larger measures. So if we were in 5/8, the cell is played twice and if we are in 5/4 it is played four times. Need help figuring it out? It's the "let go" motive from The Grudge exactly, and also it is the exact rhythm at which the accented words in the section "strapped down in my bed, feet cold, eyes red...) are sung.

-Motive #2 is in 3/4, consisting of a hit on beat 3 and nothing more (rest, rest, 3 /rest, rest, 3 / rest, rest, 3 / ...you get the picture).


------So, when you play both of these rhythmic ideas AT THE SAME TIME, you get the rhythm of Danny and Justin in the section of Rosetta that we are discussing. The complete rhythmic statement lasts 15 "quarter note value" beats (5 X 3 is 15, so both intersecting motives can start over together once the combined rhythm has completed its cycle)

You can think of the rhythm as being in 5/4 and lasting 3 measures, or you can think of it as being in 3/4 and lasting 5 measures. Personally, it's easier for me to think of it as in 3/4, but that's a personal choice rather than a definite "right" or "wrong."

As for the accuracy of this analysis, go ahead and try for yourselves. Tap the "let go" 5 motive on your leg while that section plays and see if Danny and Justin don't play something on your every hit. Eerie, huh? Then do the same thing with the third beat motive in 3 (rest, rest, hit / rest, rest, hit / rest, rest, hit / ) and see if your hits don't coincide with every "high" note that Justin plays. Now try tapping the 5 motive on your left leg and the 3 motive on your right leg...a little harder.

Because Tool are great composers, this idea is heard more than once in Rosetta Stoned; Danny plays it during the second "strapped down...shit the bed" section and during part of the finale "don't know, won't know..." Combined with Adam's 13/4 and Justin and Maynard's 5/8, it's pretty crazy.

Thanks for reading.