Vicarious, a very solid track now, will likely improve in context of album

[guitarpete987]

I don't really come on the boards that often, but as a tool fan who has been listening to them since before Undertow was released I must say that Vicarious is truly a great piece of music that will only grow in value to us listeners.

First of all, no piece of music by tool has really ever knocked my socks off at first listen. I usually can respect the level of musicianship and thought put into the song and over the course of the song realize how much that piece of music could only come from this band. It is only over time that the structure really begins to make sense and the real craftsmanship behind the song is revealed.

I used to think that Third Eye was meandering and disorganized, but I then saw the brilliance in the juxtaposition of the different parts and how what at first didn't seem to go together actually did work quite well in the context of what came before and after. I also used to think Parabola was simplistic and boring. It was only after repeated listens that I understood the larger arc of the song and why each part was exactly as it was written. That's one of the key elements of their sound.

And without question, Vicarious is unquestionably tool-ish, if you will. Meshuggah this, Opeth that... I'm hearing comparisons to all other sorts of bands, but this is without a doubt a tool song.

The other positive side of the coin is that the delivery of the vocals really makes sense to me in relation to the music. I've heard many people already mention how they didn't like how far in the mix the vocals were. Is this really anything new? Maynard has had the vocals, except for a few songs, always deep in the mix since Undertow.

The effect when the soaring climax comes makes the less-audible vocals from the earlier parts of the song all the more appropriate. And complaints I've read that tool has gotten lazy because the different parts of Vicarious sound like they are inspired by previous songs from the band are simply unfounded to me.
Every song from tool has elements of the band's sound within it. They have never really reinvented themselves -- they've only evolved from one sound to another. Undertow had elements of Opiate; and Aenima had elements of Undertow and Opiate; and Lateralus had elements of Aenima, Undertow and Opiate -- the band is just expanding it's palette.

Based on what I've heard so far -- which granted isn't much -- the thing 10,000 days will bring to the table is a new emphasis on telling it like it is. I think tool has done all they could do with mysteriousness and metaphors and is going to hit us in the face with bluntness on this one. I might be speaking for myself, but at this point if anything on the new album was thematically too close to anything that came before it, I would have thought it redundant.

Besides, lets all keep in mind that this is only one song off the new record. For me, there isn't one tool song that makes complete sense outside of the album's context.

[eddie75]

I don't really come on the boards that often, but as a tool fan who has been listening to them since before Undertow was released I must say that Vicarious is truly a great piece of music that will only grow in value to us listeners.

First of all, no piece of music by tool has really ever knocked my socks off at first listen. I usually can respect the level of musicianship and thought put into the song and over the course of the song realize how much that piece of music could only come from this band. It is only over time that the structure really begins to make sense and the real craftsmanship behind the song is revealed.

I used to think that Third Eye was meandering and disorganized, but I then saw the brilliance in the juxtaposition of the different parts and how what at first didn't seem to go together actually did work quite well in the context of what came before and after. I also used to think Parabola was simplistic and boring. It was only after repeated listens that I understood the larger arc of the song and why each part was exactly as it was written. That's one of the key elements of their sound.

And without question, Vicarious is unquestionably tool-ish, if you will. Meshuggah this, Opeth that... I'm hearing comparisons to all other sorts of bands, but this is without a doubt a tool song.

The other positive side of the coin is that the delivery of the vocals really makes sense to me in relation to the music. I've heard many people already mention how they didn't like how far in the mix the vocals were. Is this really anything new? Maynard has had the vocals, except for a few songs, always deep in the mix since Undertow.

The effect when the soaring climax comes makes the less-audible vocals from the earlier parts of the song all the more appropriate. And complaints I've read that tool has gotten lazy because the different parts of Vicarious sound like they are inspired by previous songs from the band are simply unfounded to me.
Every song from tool has elements of the band's sound within it. They have never really reinvented themselves -- they've only evolved from one sound to another. Undertow had elements of Opiate; and Aenima had elements of Undertow and Opiate; and Lateralus had elements of Aenima, Undertow and Opiate -- the band is just expanding it's palette.

Based on what I've heard so far -- which granted isn't much -- the thing 10,000 days will bring to the table is a new emphasis on telling it like it is. I think tool has done all they could do with mysteriousness and metaphors and is going to hit us in the face with bluntness on this one. I might be speaking for myself, but at this point if anything on the new album was thematically too close to anything that came before it, I would have thought it redundant.

Besides, lets all keep in mind that this is only one song off the new record. For me, there isn't one tool song that makes complete sense outside of the album's context.
Damn good post

[mjk3131]

First of all, no piece of music by tool has really ever knocked my socks off at first listen. I usually can respect the level of musicianship and thought put into the song and over the course of the song realize how much that piece of music could only come from this band. It is only over time that the structure really begins to make sense and the real craftsmanship behind the song is revealed.


I very much agree. Always has been the case with Tool songs for me. I listen between 2-5 times and all I can think of is 'I can't even comprehend what this is."

After I first heard Schism It was beyond anything I have ever heard and didnt truly appreciate it until about 10x listening.

[guitarpete987]

I very much agree. Always has been the case with Tool songs for me. I listen between 2-5 times and all I can think of is 'I can't even comprehend what this is."

After I first heard Schism It was beyond anything I have ever heard and didnt truly appreciate it until about 10x listening.

You know, one of the funny things I've noticed about the music I like is that songs that really wow me initially are the ones that I will usually tire of more quickly. It's like they do all they can to grab your full attention at first and then wear out their welcome because there was never really anything that deep there to begin with.

Most of the music that I only think is at best good-to-great but not really life-changing are the tunes that usually end up changing my life.

[MentalSanityOff]

I used to think that Third Eye was meandering and disorganized, but I then saw the brilliance in the juxtaposition of the different parts and how what at first didn't seem to go together actually did work quite well in the context of what came before and after.
Third eye is a masterpiece

[godhenry]

THANK YOU, guitarpete987. You've said it like it is! finally some OGTs who know what they're talking about. Like you, I'm a fan since before Undertow. And this album, and Vicarious, makes total sense.

you need to post more ;-)

[Squishy]

Every song from tool has elements of the band's sound within it. They have never really reinvented themselves -- they've only evolved from one sound to another. Undertow had elements of Opiate; and Aenima had elements of Undertow and Opiate; and Lateralus had elements of Aenima, Undertow and Opiate -- the band is just expanding it's palette.

Very correct. I think this is what most people claiming 'Vicarious s0x0rz because it sounds like old Tool'' don't realize. They always had this distinctive toolish sound to all their albums, yet always evolved it to make something new and interesting with it. I don't think it's their goal to 'out-progress' everybody else with every new release.

All the other points in your post are excellent too, by the way.

[guitarpete987]

godhenry,

you know, I hadn't been here in a while and when I came on a couple of days ago, I was shocked.

Now, nothing against some of the newer fans, cause I love that tool has become so huge because they deserve it, but it seems that a lot of these newer fans are so quick to talk. It's as if they hear the new song a few times and decide right away they don't like it and run online to tell the world how tool has let everyone down.

I'm glad there are still plenty of other OGTs here, and I'm sure most of these quick detractors will come to their senses once they hear the entire album.

It just bothers me that some people are so quick to judge and want to make a spectacle of themselves.

Good to hear from you, and yeah, I would like to post here more often. I plan on it.

[Exoskeletal]

I completely support this thread.

[zee deveel 17]

i like how you said that tool is not regressive but has merely expanded its "palette" over the years. i think that's an excellent way to phrase it. you can definitely pinpoint certain areas of "vicarious" and designate them to any one of their previous albums. in my opinion, that is what makes this song so excellent.

[dancingflame]

i love this fucking song! i just like the dynamic in their sound and how they take each other further...i think as adam said in the interview "its no fun to make a tool song" or something like that...if you play in a band you`ll probably know that its sometimes not easy to find a way to make it sound as it "should" sound...and tool are hard working masters in working things out....so i have almost no doubt that the new output will as aenima or lateralus be the extracts of a looong jam...but with no little coincidence in it..worked out VERY well...
you know i like the mars volta as well but they sometimes seem to play around a little too much (especially the live-tracks i`ve heard so far)...lots of filler-sounds on frances the mute...somtimes just seemingly pointless noise...i like the world of tool because they`re real artists...and neo-space-psycedelic-punk-rock-metal-prog whatever...they combine their music so nicely with some sort of philosophy...still its left to yourself what to make of it....blabla
by the way: i think that tool-songs make most sense in the album-context but each song also stands pretty much for itself....

[Vassup]

Well put. I too can appreciate each album having it's own signature but maintaining a familiarity that is only achieved through truly opening new doors and not revolving ones.
Not every song is going to be Lateralus, or any before it. Why the hell would you want to repeat yourself as a musician? I understand people's point of view that this is almost too familiar, but can you honestly say they got where they are through repeating themselves?
I read a post where someone said..." if this is any indication of the album, I'm not gonna buy it."
And people wonder why the band views the relationship between fans as a weird dynamic. Most simpletons tend to be fickle when it comes to their loyalty and appreciations. Can you imagine what the band would sound like if they took everyones opinions but their own? I know how that movie ends.

[MacFoley]

im all for vicarious. ok i am new to this forum, but i have been waiting like plenty of others here to hear new tool material, and from the moment i heard the song, i had a smirk on my face knowing that tool are back for the better.

maynard sounds fresh and compliments the music more so than he ever done before. there is still the emotion, the power but at the same time its subtle, in your face but distant, not overpowering and fits well in the music.

as abba once said, THANKYOU FOR THE MUSIC!

by the way great thread.

[godhenry]

godhenry,

you know, I hadn't been here in a while and when I came on a couple of days ago, I was shocked.

Now, nothing against some of the newer fans, cause I love that tool has become so huge because they deserve it, but it seems that a lot of these newer fans are so quick to talk. It's as if they hear the new song a few times and decide right away they don't like it and run online to tell the world how tool has let everyone down.

I'm glad there are still plenty of other OGTs here, and I'm sure most of these quick detractors will come to their senses once they hear the entire album.

It just bothers me that some people are so quick to judge and want to make a spectacle of themselves.

Good to hear from you, and yeah, I would like to post here more often. I plan on it.

Totally agree. But I'm sure these newer fans will mature over time to become more open minded and so actually listen to the music instead of just hearing it. But then in a way OGTs are part of a generation who is trully blessed with the kind of music that we had; i mean from '89 to '93 when most of us were in college or shortly before/after college, shits were coming out like crazy. but these days, i can't even stand the radio any more. my point is because new and inventive music with soul and passion were being thrown at us left to right, so we're proabaly more "prepared" to give anything a try instead like some people these days who are so quick to judge.

Good to hear from you too! Definitely would like to listen to more what you will have to say about this new album as it evolves.

p.s. and it's kinda funny how most OGTs here have low post counts...

[Tyro]

Teamsters for Godhenry!

[Fulcan]

p.s. and it's kinda funny how most OGTs here have low post counts...

Its because the real OGTs are listening to Tool and learning from it while the rest (NGTs?) are off running a muck on these boards talking down about change. To alot of people, they didnt go through each change with each new album so they cant appreciate a new style or evolution of style. They think having a squillion posts makes them an expert.

[paper_head]

Third eye is a masterpieceThat's an understatement.

[megaspanker]

Happened to me, too... Some new Tool tracks seem weak at first, but then they start iceball-growing...

Everybody knows the new album took them zillions rehearsal sessions to create... This is not easy, light music to hear, complexity is what tool music is made of.

I liked Vicarious since the first time i listened to it, but i know that it'll take many times more to truly get in...

[DonCarlito]

Wow, my very first post :) or something like that, I really can't remember my last post.

I'm not exactly a OGT (too young, only 26 years old) and I discovered Tool with Aenima. I remember that I had to buy the album two times beacause I played the first copy (a casette) to death. I used to listen to Aenima at least 2 times a day for a whole year. I say this just to express how much I like and respect this band. In more than a way, their music changed my life and my point of view on life; being 16 years old is really a bitch sometimes.

I read some of the posts about the new single here and there and frankly, I was wondering why some people said that they would'nt buy the new album if it was like the single. Now, that's their opinion, and I really don't want to spend time trying to change their mind. At this point, I did not listen to Vicarious, so I was a little afraid of it.

But after listening to it, I did the same exact thing that I did five years ago when I first heard Schism: I cried my heart out. Why? Because I was so happy to hear that Tool still had it, even after all these years. I just love the new single and everything in it: the vocals, the guitar, everything. Their music is better than everything I've heard since... well... Lateralus.

I just can't wait to get my hands on the new album so that the 16 years old that is still in me can live on a little while longer... new album that I'll buy two times :)

Peace and love everyone :)

[odie]

so true awsome post

[FortySix&Two]

This thread is filled with truth. Awesome first post, pete.

[dracomordag]

i agree

and srsly, tool's always used drop d (with emphasis on the 7th) and 10/8. if you weren't complaining up until now...

[godhenry]

how come a brilliant and insightful thread like this never lasts? it doesn't even get to be 2-pager while the top of this board is filled with opinions that are not well thought out. People really should read the OP cuz we all can learn and re-learn a lot from it.