View Full Version : Disposition/rReflection/Triad are not one song
pork chops
03-10-2006, 08:02 AM
I have noticed a scarey trend going on here that i feel i need to address. Disposition/Reflection/Triad are not one song. They are 3 seperate songs that just happen to work into the fabric of the album together. It's not like Pink Floyd who on numerous occasions had a song with say 4 different chapters(A Sauceful of Secrets, Adam's Psychedelic Breakfast, and Atom Heart Mother to name a few). This is not really of importance but I feel like I had to get it off of my chest. Thank you all for your patience and understanding on this issue.
As far as the new album goes, I can not wait to hear it. I have no doubt that it will blow my mind. I will probably get a nice bottle of wine, possibly an Amarone, and enjoy the experience of hearing the album for the first time with my wife. I can't wait.
MrMcPheezy
03-10-2006, 08:09 AM
d/r/t was originally one track called "resolution".
Staticfactory
03-10-2006, 08:17 AM
I have noticed a scarey trend going on here that i feel i need to address. Disposition/Reflection/Triad are not one song. They are 3 seperate songs that just happen to work into the fabric of the album together.
As far as I know, the band wanted to release D/R/T as one continuous track but their label suggested against the idea, considering it would be close to 24 minutes in length. I'm not sure where I read that, though (or it's validity.)
Chris_Brightwell
03-10-2006, 08:21 AM
I have noticed a scarey trend going on here that i feel i need to address. Disposition/Reflection/Triad are not one song. They are 3 seperate songs that just happen to work into the fabric of the album together. Disposition and Reflection were recorded together and cut apart for whatever reason.
Triad was reworked to fit onto the end of Reflection.
paraflux
03-10-2006, 10:06 AM
I have noticed a scarey trend going on here that i feel i need to address. Disposition/Reflection/Triad are not one song. They are 3 seperate songs that just happen to work into the fabric of the album together. It's not like Pink Floyd who on numerous occasions had a song with say 4 different chapters(A Sauceful of Secrets, Adam's Psychedelic Breakfast, and Atom Heart Mother to name a few). This is not really of importance but I feel like I had to get it off of my chest. Thank you all for your patience and understanding on this issue.
Well, sorry if you think you need to get that off your chest, but perhaps it should be put back on. Take a look at the slipcover. The list of songs, has those three connected in a way that no other songs on the list are connected. Plus there is the quote saying that the original name for the one song that ended up being 3 is "resolution." Plus there is the fact that if you take all of the songs minus Faaip de Oiad, and count D/R/T as one, the total track number equals ten, which matches the number of spots on the Tree of Sephiroth. I think there are possible many more reasons, but perhaps that is enough.
pork chops
03-10-2006, 11:00 AM
well thank you all for bringing this to my attention. i will humbly admit i was wrong.
cantkeepmeaway
03-12-2006, 04:09 PM
^^^haha owned man i mean seriously the fact that they flow together shouldve made you stop mid paragraph of this dumb post and said wait im a fucking fool....SCAREY TREND..haha
InertUniformity
03-12-2006, 04:39 PM
^^^haha owned man i mean seriously the fact that they flow together shouldve made you stop mid paragraph of this dumb post and said wait im a fucking fool....SCAREY TREND..haha
no reason to be a jerk about it.
Yeah they were all concieved as one song - a lot of people know that, but stil he has a point in thatl i would never say that my favorite tool song is D/R/T - rather I would have to say that i like Reflection best, followed by Disposition, and lastly Triad.
On a side note it will be interesting to hear the song on the new record titled "Intension". From reading the Andy King review it appears that this song may be some what of a sequel to D/R/T.
pork chops
03-13-2006, 12:36 PM
^^^haha owned man i mean seriously the fact that they flow together shouldve made you stop mid paragraph of this dumb post and said wait im a fucking fool....SCAREY TREND..haha
who cares if they all flow together, they are still not one song. i find it funny how people are so mean to eachother on this fourm. i hope you have a better day today my friend. smile, life is good and being rude is just a waste of energy
MrMcPheezy
03-13-2006, 12:44 PM
they are still not one song.
Have you not been paying attention?
pork chops
03-13-2006, 01:10 PM
Have you not been paying attention?
i have been paying attention. but just because you and a few other people tell me that originally they were ment to be one track, i'm going by what i see. i am not doubting that the do not flow together and seem to be one song, i am just stating how i feel. now that may not be how you feel and it may not be your opinion or others opinion but i don't care. i agree with what the person a few post up said that while the 3 songs mesh well and flow togther i would not list all 3 as one. i would say reflection is the best of all 3 and that they indeed are seperate. it's just my opinion, take it or leave it. you aren't going to change my mind so we should just leave it at that.
Anomaly
03-14-2006, 04:45 PM
you'd think that it would make more sense to be
Disposition / Reflection / Resolution
combined they make Triad
could have been that way at one point...
not saying it is.
...wonder triplets power activate.
The Official Fiction
03-15-2006, 04:22 AM
DRT is one song in three parts.
FACT.
MrMcPheezy
03-15-2006, 05:57 AM
i have been paying attention. but just because you and a few other people tell me that originally they were ment to be one track, i'm going by what i see. i am not doubting that the do not flow together and seem to be one song, i am just stating how i feel. now that may not be how you feel and it may not be your opinion or others opinion but i don't care. i agree with what the person a few post up said that while the 3 songs mesh well and flow togther i would not list all 3 as one. i would say reflection is the best of all 3 and that they indeed are seperate. it's just my opinion, take it or leave it. you aren't going to change my mind so we should just leave it at that.
But this isn't a matter of opinion. Danny and others have said in interviews that they were composed as one song, and broken into three mostly because the label wanted it that way. Unless you're going to argue with Danny about it, stfu.
martyrinexile86
03-15-2006, 01:51 PM
d/r/t was originally one track called "resolution".
Really? Didn't know that, what was your source on this? Cause from what I read it was originally one piece that they broke into three separate songs for lack of a name for the collective whole.
cantkeepmeaway
03-15-2006, 02:01 PM
pointless
NMCF22
03-22-2006, 08:20 AM
Just curious. Who believes Reflection to be the best song on Lateralus, quite possibly the best song tool has ever done. The music combined with maynards lyrics are quite astonishing...Brilliant.
cantkeepmeaway
03-22-2006, 08:48 AM
all 3 are brilliant.
lifefeedsonlife
03-27-2006, 10:43 PM
Disp and Ref I can see as a continuation, but Triad...to me it has absolutely no connectivity with the other two. If you think it does, plz describe why because I am at a loss.
cantkeepmeaway
03-28-2006, 11:06 AM
^^^haha....dxm...watch the weather change.
Scrunzset
04-03-2006, 10:21 PM
I don't think they've ever (nor will they ever) play those songs seperated/out of order when they play live. I saw them 6 times on the Lateralus tour and they've always played those songs (except for Berkeley 8/10-11/01, that was part of the mini tour, which they left out Triad... my guess is that they didn't work out the bugs yet).
Chris_Brightwell
04-04-2006, 01:40 AM
I don't think they've ever (nor will they ever) play those songs seperated/out of order when they play live. Check your facts. They didn't add Triad to the setlist until the Fall 2001 tour.
woonyunkim
04-17-2006, 09:41 AM
Obviously I can hear the presence of transition between reflection and triad but I dont think its great musically. This makes the two songs "patchy" relative to each other. Disposition to Reflection is great tho.
justify_denials
04-30-2006, 11:14 PM
Disp and Ref I can see as a continuation, but Triad...to me it has absolutely no connectivity with the other two. If you think it does, plz describe why because I am at a loss.
I think the track name has more relevance than the actual song.........
Rezbit
05-01-2006, 12:27 AM
Interesting...
tangent
05-02-2006, 07:54 AM
I still think playing the album in a different way which means splitting up these three songs works better for me... And if somebody else thinks that they are not really the one song (even though I am also not doubting that they work just as well together for some) then that is his/her opinion. You can't really say it IS one song just because of the way they are connected on the album cover, that is also just an opinion. I don't see why people always accept the proof and never allow for both sides...
MrMcPheezy
05-02-2006, 08:06 AM
I don't see why people always accept the proof and never allow for both sides...
lol.
HateSolstice
05-12-2006, 01:41 PM
Whether or not they were intended and recorded as one song means very little when it is broken down into 3 seperate songs, no matter the cause. So really, this seems like a silly argument, sense in an essence both sides are effectively correct.
HateSolstice
05-12-2006, 01:42 PM
Oh, and has anyone else noticed that the track titles D/R/T sort of sound like "dirt" when sound aloud? Just a thought...
mike09
05-13-2006, 05:19 AM
If the band says they are one song, they are one song. Personally, I don't hear any type of musical connection between Triad and the other two. Disposition and Reflection do have musical connections that make them feel together. I accept the three as one song because the band says themselves they are one song.
civdis24
05-15-2006, 12:29 PM
on the back of the lateralus album, on the track listing, all three songs are connected by a bracket. personally i think lateralus and these three could pretty much be one song, they just flow well together and are all generally about the same type of thing, as far as i can gather
They seem to be a collective whole. But it's not like a composition, because the transitions are patchy and it feels more like a new songs starting than a new part.
Luosdasa
05-28-2006, 12:03 AM
While the three are definetly one track, or can be listened to as one track, or whateva... for some reason, i dont like em as one. I do not like dispostion and reflecion as one song. I find that the smooth transition or whatever is not enough to bridge em together. l tend to put a song in between em actually when i listen.
Though this is porbably because im some kind of eccentric, or retard or something...
And i positively get bored shitless by the end of disposition. So pork chops, i can see where u r comeing from... or i think i do. meh
one_reflection
05-28-2006, 12:34 AM
I am in love with reflection. In response to whoever asked if it was the best song. I dont know...i cant pick one 'best' but it is definately one of my favs.
waffel
06-17-2006, 04:14 PM
Disposition and Reflection were recorded together and cut apart for whatever reason.
Triad was reworked to fit onto the end of Reflection.
Do you know if they ever played the original D/R/T with the old triad during any concerts?
BlanketEffect
06-22-2006, 09:30 PM
Well, when I saw them in Memphis in Oct, 2001 they played Disposition and Reflection... then Adam played the guitar outro of Reflection for about 15 minutes straight (thought it was NEVER going to end) while the rest of the band took a break. When they came back on stage they broke into Triad. I don't know if this is the 'old' Triad.
As far as it being one song? Sure. One song, three tracks. And if it isn't, who's to say?
duncang
07-12-2006, 09:27 AM
I think that Dispostion and Reflection are one song, but Triad isn't part of it. It doesn't fit with the rest of the piece at all.
MrMcPheezy
07-13-2006, 11:01 AM
But this isn't a matter of opinion. Danny and others have said in interviews that they were composed as one song, and broken into three mostly because the label wanted it that way. Unless you're going to argue with Danny about it, stfu.
Why is this so confusing to you people?
BlanketEffect
07-13-2006, 09:40 PM
You know, in the long run, I'm glad it got broken up. The whole thing together is a masterpiece but sometimes I just want to listen to one of them.
Theheroeshavedied
07-13-2006, 10:08 PM
who cares if they all flow together, they are still not one song. i find it funny how people are so mean to eachother on this fourm. i hope you have a better day today my friend. smile, life is good and being rude is just a waste of energy
-take example all ye, that this do hear or see- -Chaucer-
truly, well said. you have my support. even if the guy is wrong, there's no need to jump all over him like a hungry animal, he apologized! Love thy brother human!
anyway i have always thought of the three as one, however just musically.
Live long and prosper!
duncang
07-16-2006, 07:33 AM
You know, in the long run, I'm glad it got broken up. The whole thing together is a masterpiece but sometimes I just want to listen to one of them.
I agree totally, I barely ever listen to Triad, so a lot of the time I just listen to Disflection.
BlanketEffect
07-16-2006, 07:09 PM
Well, I really dig Triad, but it's not always what I wanna hear. But more importantly, I'm glad they got broken apart because although I love Disposition sometimes I just want to listen to Reflection without the segue song. I'd hate to have to scan through it to get to it. That would be annoying.
mosquitokillah
07-22-2006, 07:57 AM
No, never thought that these 3 tracks are one. Maybe there was a studio version which contained those 3 tracks.
perhaps the reason for the difference in sound has something to do with the final meaning of the songs as a whole. in 'reflection' the choice has been made to change the way of life - to indeed change the weather of the life. 'triad' has a different sound, because the place that you are in on the journey - from 'the grudge' to 'parabola', 'lateralus', 'disposition', and 'reflection' has led to this final change.
and whether pork chop is 'right' or 'wrong', if you tear him apart like that, you obviously have not listened to and understood this album.
BlanketEffect
08-02-2006, 06:22 AM
It's not a matter of opinion. The band said it was one song split up after the fact.
Lie Cheat And Steal
08-11-2006, 12:28 AM
The thing about tool is that they are very progressive with their music, both in the songs themselves and within their albums. Just because songs flow together on an album doesn't necessarily mean they were meant to be one song. If you look at pink floyd's dark side of the moon or the wall, there are many songs that flow together. that doesn't make them all one song. I'm not saying that these are one song or not, but you can't categorize them as one song just because of the progression.
A good example of a band that made two seperate songs and radio and fans have fused them into one song is Queen's We will rock you and We are the champions. Queen recorded these as two seperate songs, but over time people have come to accept them as one song because of the way they are played on the radio.
BlanketEffect
08-11-2006, 10:02 AM
It's not a matter of opinion. The band said it was one song split up after the fact.
*sigh*
Elbowdeep
08-11-2006, 02:13 PM
WHoa I never knew it was intended to be one track, even as 3 tracks I knew these songs went together, when i make mix cds i always have these songs together. Kinda cool.
Faltering
08-30-2006, 10:01 PM
*sigh*
Lol gotta' understand this guy's frustration, when, despite the fact that multiple posters have stated that this song was intended to be one track, you still have people ranting about how they don't "agree" with such a concept, and that "in their opinion" it's not meant to be one song...lol...
"*sigh*" is right...
parables in the world
09-15-2006, 10:37 PM
its funny how they don't see it as one song. listen to it again the mood of each song stays the same, the bass at the end of disposition is the bass riff for reflection just an octave higher. Reflection flows into triad which is quite obvious. DO as the song says and crucify your ego. They are trying to give you an insight of life through their eyes, you don't have to agree its just that you understand what they say is all that matters which is why tehy are dissappointed at most fans cause they don't understand, you have your meaning and then you have Tools meaning which no one knows, for now. The meaning comes from lyrics, the way he presents them to you. Which is why i believe 10,000 days is the way it is.
eternalnuisance.com
09-21-2006, 01:23 PM
It's like the Holy Trinity. Three seperate elements, coming together to form one.
*sigh*
*i don't like other people's opinions so I'll be all high and mighty without explaining my reasons or rationality.*
BlanketEffect
09-23-2006, 09:21 PM
It's not a matter of opinion. The band said it was one song split up after the fact.
(We) don't know... (and we) won't know...
nuraman00
09-24-2006, 09:36 PM
Disp and Ref I can see as a continuation, but Triad...to me it has absolutely no connectivity with the other two. If you think it does, plz describe why because I am at a loss.
If the band says they are one song, they are one song. Personally, I don't hear any type of musical connection between Triad and the other two. Disposition and Reflection do have musical connections that make them feel together. I accept the three as one song because the band says themselves they are one song.
I think that Dispostion and Reflection are one song, but Triad isn't part of it. It doesn't fit with the rest of the piece at all.
I agree with lifefeedsonlife, mike09, and duncang. I personally don't hear the connection from Reflection to Triad, musically. I'm not questioning whether the band meant it as one song. The quotes and articles suggest so. It's just that I don't hear it. Then again, I've only had Lateralus for about 2 months. Maybe it will take some more time for me to hear the connection.
In response to the other poster (InertUniformity) who said "Reflection" might be the best song, I was thinking the same thing a few weeks ago. Something about the instrumental beginning, the chanting, the echo-y singing, thoughtful lyrics. It feels like this is what a Tool song is about.
BlanketEffect
09-25-2006, 07:23 PM
Edited to post below.
BlanketEffect
09-25-2006, 07:25 PM
Another thing that can be drawn to imply the songs were one... or meant as one, or whatever, is the fact that the entire album leading up to Disp/Ref/Triad is in the key of D minor. Disp/Ref/Triad are all in the key of E minor.
As far as Disposition and Reflection having similarities or sounding 'together' let's take for instance the guitar "solo" during Disposition; now compare to the guitar 'solo' in Reflection. They're the exact same notes and melody.
NewUser
09-30-2006, 02:26 PM
^ yeah what he said.
Just go to the FAQ and it talks about hiow they where all 1 song to begin with.
base metal
10-04-2006, 01:48 PM
I believe these songs all fit together and take you off into a trance like state. Its like part 1,2,3.
PS I agree that Reflection is the bomb.
Forever In Debt
10-17-2006, 03:26 PM
Tool probaby did want to make it one song. But that would be far to big of a song for me to want to listen to it. I think that Triad is a bit different than the other songs, but I believe that Tool wanted the three to be one. Thats why one the album they re shown that way. (the little thing that "half circles" them... sorry don't know what it's called.)
BlanketEffect
10-18-2006, 07:48 AM
So here's a question then. Does 'Triad', the title, imply that there are three songs in the whole; that there are three members of the band playing throughout it; or that the song is in 3/4 time?
Or all three? Coincidence? I think not.
mjkajdcjc
11-08-2006, 08:27 PM
So here's a question then. Does 'Triad', the title, imply that there are three songs in the whole; that there are three members of the band playing throughout it; or that the song is in 3/4 time?
Or all three? Coincidence? I think not.
Nice find. It does seem a little too coincidental, doesn't it? Then again, Tool's music is filled with "coincidences", so I wouldn't be surprised...
BlanketEffect
11-09-2006, 01:20 PM
Perhaps the name came after the creation. It would make sense. One does not name a creation before one sees what it's going to be. The name reflects the art, I would think. So intention or coincidence? I'd say a bit of both.
lizbiz
11-10-2006, 09:44 AM
They are one song, they're connected on the track listing and they have ALWAYS played them together live.
Forever In Debt
11-21-2006, 04:53 PM
Yup... It doesn't matter that much though. It is what it is we can't change it.
Khastra_KSC
12-04-2006, 06:44 PM
D/R/T fits into the end of the album perfectly if you understand what the album is really about. It doesn't matter what the names of the freaking songs are... just listen to the end of the album and be like "wow... awesome..."
its like a painting.
Metta Synth
12-10-2006, 11:45 AM
I have noticed a scarey trend going on here that i feel i need to address. Disposition/Reflection/Triad are not one song. They are 3 seperate songs that just happen to work into the fabric of the album together. It's not like Pink Floyd who on numerous occasions had a song with say 4 different chapters(A Sauceful of Secrets, Adam's Psychedelic Breakfast, and Atom Heart Mother to name a few). This is not really of importance but I feel like I had to get it off of my chest. Thank you all for your patience and understanding on this issue.
As far as the new album goes, I can not wait to hear it. I have no doubt that it will blow my mind. I will probably get a nice bottle of wine, possibly an Amarone, and enjoy the experience of hearing the album for the first time with my wife. I can't wait.
Alan's Psychedelic Breakfast
Right-In-46-&-2
01-03-2007, 03:47 PM
On a side note it will be interesting to hear the song on the new record titled "Intension". From reading the Andy King review it appears that this song may be some what of a sequel to D/R/T.
What do you think about this? I don't really think there's a connection or that its a sequel. Lets hear your thoughts.
BlanketEffect
01-03-2007, 10:35 PM
Hmmm... nope. No connection. Other than a connection on some buddhist or quantum field theory level of shit... But no, no connection.
parables in the world
01-04-2007, 05:11 PM
Intension sounds like Disposition but its not part of it. anyways just listen to the damn album without your mind. Crucify your ego while listening to music, and you will see what music sucks and what doesn't
orcaloverbri9
01-18-2007, 10:23 AM
I think it is utterly hilarious how people will go on and on about different people having different opinions in regards to something that is either true or false. You can't have an opinion about whether they form one song together; they just do. It's like saying "I think that ball is red" and calling it an opinion. It's not! An opinion is a belief that is neither true nor false due to subjectivity. You might be right that the ball is red, you might be wrong. It doesn't matter, it's still not an opinion. You can have an opinion on how well the songs flow or how sensical it is for them to be one song or whatever, but you can't have an opinion on whether or not that make one song because it is known to be true that they do.
LEJend
03-18-2008, 08:43 AM
Once I pondered the three songs as if they were meant to be connected they all made much more sense to me. Individually they're awesome songs but if you listen to the three as a thematic whole it's a mind-blowing trip, and kudos to the boys for pulling it off.
Personally, I link Triad to the other two songs by considering it as a soundscape of the Journey the protagonist undertakes after his quiet Disposition led to an intense Reflection who's light unveiled a new path for him to choose. I think I get the impression of Triad as a journey or some sort of travel due to the very beginning, where it sort of sounds like trains running down a track before it slowly becomes recognizable as guitar/drum/bass. As Triad progresses and the song warps and bends and segues I just imagine sitting on a train or car seat heading off to an exciting destination and watching mesmerized as new and exotic scenes pass by my window. And the way Triad ends reminds me of that last final lurch a car or train makes at the very end of a long journey... motion stops, everyone sitting still, taking looks around... time to get your feet back on the ground...
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