PDA

View Full Version : dextromethorphan, ketamine, etc.


dissociation
11-21-2002, 12:18 PM
oddly enough, this is the most perfect album, next to "ænima," to listen to while dissociated. in reply to a reply i received early, it sure as hell is a headphone album. and i really wish i had an hdcd player, so i'd be able to experience it in much richer sound quality, the way it was made. but back to the topic... try dissociatives and listen to lateralus (not just the song, the album itself). it is one motherfucking profound experience. the very weird thing is that "ænima" was meant for dissociatives, but lateralus works much better. if you have any experiences, please reply. and if you need some more info on dissociatives, check out erowid.org (dxm and ketamine).

CCD
11-22-2002, 06:33 PM
Thanks for posting that. I have recenlty become a big DXM fan, though I have not yet listened to Lateralus on DXM. I usually prefer soft, droney, ambient music for my inner excursions.

shamus
11-22-2002, 10:57 PM
me and my friend and my friend just hopped on the dxm shuttle and thought it was kinda cool that you happened to post the stuff that you posted. so.......we put the damn cd in. we about missed the patient, and we're really missing it again this time, but don't worry. we'll catch up sometime. tomorrow. maybe. we'll keep in touch if we do.

bye

dissociation
11-23-2002, 10:09 PM
good to see some people doing dxm. lateralus is quite possibly the best cd to listen to on it. the best thing to do is if you're alone, put headphones on, a cold towel over your head, and just experience the intensity.... more hallucinations then you'll ever know. with a friend, put it on a stereo, but still lay down with the cold towels. it's one mind-expanding experience.

seeyouauntie
11-23-2002, 11:38 PM
forgive my ignorance but what is DXM?

ragna16
11-24-2002, 10:51 AM
DXM = dextromethorphan

A dissociative hallucinagen, which is different than say LSD which doesn't dissociate you.

Metatron's Cube
11-27-2002, 02:17 AM
Wow a DXM string, I thought me and the few people who I introduced to DXM tripping were the only ones in the world weird enough to do it...

Here is a question for everyone:

The alien landscape you traverse through while on dxm... an alternate, perfectly-real dimension, or is it all in your head??

Once on Lateralus fueled ketamine trip, I remember during the apex of Schism seeing a giant black hole that encompassed my entire 360 degree field of vision, drawn out of a deeper shade of blackness. I was right on the edge of it. Geometric black shapes were being sucked into it from the gravity, and right when I thought I was going to be the next thing sucked in.... it all ended as the song ended. It was cool beyond description.

Oh btw, for anyone interested in one of these trips who hasn't, its only possible in the complete darkness. Read William White's faq too for safety,ect.
www.erowid.org/chemicals/dxm/faq/dxm_faq.shtml

dissociation
11-28-2002, 04:52 PM
oh man, that's scary, because it sounds awfully familiar to my experience. i put lateralus on while i was in the middle of second plateau. once my eyes were closed, there was no turning back. the grudge was full of wonderous sights. a lot of roman structures were present, as was a huge spinning platform that was made of stone. toward the end, i saw a massive spinning spiral that encompassed everything. the strange thing about all these experiences is that my body AND mind felt and experienced them. i felt wind rushing over my entire body as i was sucked into the black hole. i became so small (much like the dissociative spiral wonder that is on erowid.org). everything peaked during parabola, so it seems. that song made me feel good about everything, even though my stomach was in pain. the structure of the song is so similar to that of a real parabola that i felt like i was on one the whole time. many more experiences... ticks & leeches was awesome, but in lateralus i must've blacked out for a bit, sadly :(

mne pohuy
11-28-2002, 05:46 PM
First of all, I'd like to suggest that people stop using drugs like DXM to attain a higher level of understanding. DXM literally kills your brain, it's pretty bad for you. And ketamine (Special K), they put cats to sleep with that stuff, do you want to use it? You can disassociate your mind and body with pure meditation. You can break outside the box and watch it shatter, you can rip the envelope. I've tried shrooms and stuff like that, but meditation is much better. For one thing, you actively must devote time and concentration into it, making it more personal and deeper. It's not nearly as easy dropping some acid or going shrooming. You will know yourself better after some good hard, drug free meditation,it's a panacea for the soul. You can try listening to Tool while you meditate, it might work for you, I choose to listen to things in nature ie wind, storms.. But after I'm done, I'm ready for a good dose of some Tool, and even though I'm not meditating on Tool, listening to it after meditation is pretty damn good. So next time you want to trip and you don't have any drugs, try meditation... it's cheaper and you might like it more.

paper_head
11-28-2002, 07:59 PM
I might just try that whole meditation dealy. I've heard so many people say that the best way to listen to Tool is when you high out of your mind. Now drugs aren't really my cup of tea, so meditating sounds like something I might look into in the future.

verisimilitude
11-28-2002, 08:32 PM
meditation feeds off what you consciously want to experience. you can't unlock unknown parts of your brain with nothing but conscious thougts.

dissociation
11-28-2002, 08:38 PM
"...and so i buy the cd and it is spelled 'lateralis' and not 'lateralus' like it was on the website!"

"dude... maybe this is a premonition of some kind... maybe they're trying to connect with the internal workings of your psyche.. all your expectations of their new album and all... and now you've been mind fucked!"

"***."

fibonacci
11-29-2002, 01:14 PM
noone seemed to mention PCP

EmbraceTdOxOmL
12-02-2002, 05:09 AM
After many many amazing, mind opening, life changing experiences listening to this album on very large doses of Dextromethorphan Hydrobromide, I have reached every little dark crevis within my mind and developed dozens of ideas and theories (some good, some bad), not about what the band members were expressing through the album, but what the album itself is expressing. (Even though that music came fom within four individual minds, and a part of them is in the music (and vise versa), it has taken on a life of its own. What has been and will forever be done purely inspired by the music is completely out of those same four individuals hands. And the same goes for all of their music.)

I have read the lyrics countless times, digging for clues about what its all about. After i got to a certain point, i began to observe myself. Watching myself try to understand, reaching my hand out soooo far just for that piece of mind. That is when reality struck me. THATS IT!! I narrowed it down to only two words, Psychoactive Disassociation. This state of mind encouraged me to "overthink" and "overanylize" and at the same time, enabled me to observe my own thoughts and reactions ("separating the body from the mind") to the dugs as well as te music. In a really basic sense, an explanation of a trip. Coming to gripps with a "sub-reality" that a drug generates. This album is the entire prossess both in the lyrics and in the music itself. The song "Lateralus" is the stage of realization, understanding, and the accepting of the "sub-reality".

Be aware that this in not what i believe they wrote this song and this album about. its merely the reflection of the song/album shining off of me.

(I made this same post on a different part of this forum, but after readind this i thought it was appropriate to post it here too.)

akinoyugure
12-04-2002, 02:43 PM
("separating the body from the mind") to the dugs as well as te music. In a really basic sense, an explanation of a trip. Coming to gripps with a "sub-reality" that a drug generates. This album is the entire prossess both in the lyrics and in the music itself. The song "Lateralus" is the stage of realization, understanding, and the accepting of the "sub-reality".

Be aware that this in not what i believe they wrote this song and this album about. its merely the reflection of the song/album shining off of me. [/B][/QUOTE]
-----------
I also posted this once in another thread. I feel compelled to respond to it here as well.

You are right that this is just the song "shining off of" you.

While personally identifying with the lyrics is important, I think there is more to interpretation than just saying "and that is what it means to me". For example - the song Die Eier von Satan. I could say that this song "shining off of me" is promoting Nazis. That can't be argued. However, we both know that Die Eier Von Satan is quite simply not intended that way. The same can be said for the song Lateralus. Lateralus is promoting the expansion of the mind, and the feeling of the moment. I think that is a key point to the song that can't be argued. In fact, I think all Tool songs have a key point, a message, that is there for all to see. There is a message to understand, not one you have to necessarily agree with, but one that should be at least identified and considered. Seeing the message doesn't require drugs. After all, the lyrics are intelligent, not just the ramblings of some drugged moron.

How one applies that message to their life, or what one believes to be the exact event the writer experienced in order to write those lyrics, is the interpetation.

In my opinion, there is something to be learned from this song that goes far beyond some crazy trip. Also, your idea of a "sub-reality" i think goes directly against the idea of "spiral out...keep going". It seems to me you are saying "spiral in", which is the complete opposite. Also, consider my post under the thread "Seperating the body from the mind". Seperating the body from the mind is not a good thing.

That being said however, I can identify with the problem of "overanalyzing"/thinking too much. Here is a drug reference to make it interesting for some -- After smoking pot I have sometimes been able to overcome my overthinking, and in a sense feel more normal. However, when the drug is gone, so is the feeling. Meditating is much more effective, as you are actually learning a skill, not inserting a foreign substance that the body will become reliant upon in order to produce those feelings. Also the substance becomes associated with the feelings, which is not good either.

I believe it was in Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas that it was said "you can't buy your piece of mind for $3 a hit".

dissociation
12-04-2002, 05:09 PM
i'm not quite clear on the argument currently going on. i was pretty much spacing out while reading most of it. however, the sub-reality thing is somewhat impressive.

while induced with dissociatives, one feels the experiencing of being "reset." my friend described it this way, and i came to think of it, and it's true. with heavy amounts of dxm in your system, it's practically a complete destruction of patterns internally. you forget your own identity and those who you identify with. this has happened every time i have experienced a dxm trip.

with this new fact in mind, music is something impressive. it's not exactly the feeling of hearing the song for the first time ever, but it's like being reprogrammed with what the music is about. that's precisely why i listened to tool. strangely enough, lateralus fits perfectly with this concept.

i am not saying it's their intentions in any way, but it's quite amazing. ænima has dissociatives written all over it - literally. i do know that maynard has done many psychoactives in his time - from ketamine to mushrooms - but i am not saying that this album is strictly about drugs. but while dissociated, you tend to believe it is. you just have to experience it for yourself.

another strange thing is that when you try to walk while heavily dissociated, your back is arched and knees are bent a lot. does this seem familiar? (the way maynard acts on stage, and the way the characters walk in the stinkfist video) now THAT is fucking strange.

dissociation
12-04-2002, 05:14 PM
Originally posted by mne pohuy
First of all, I'd like to suggest that people stop using drugs like DXM to attain a higher level of understanding. DXM literally kills your brain, it's pretty bad for you. And ketamine (Special K), they put cats to sleep with that stuff, do you want to use it?


by the way, if you do dxm over once a month or so, a build-up will occur and damage will be done. that's why i do it at most, once a few months. there is nothing wrong with using drugs. using them improperly is obviously a problem, and only fucking idiots do that.

and, KETAMINE DOESN'T PUT CATS TO SLEEP. my mother works at a vet, i think i would know. it's used to sedate dogs for surgery. jesus. read up on the drug before you make ignorant claims about it.

akinoyugure
12-04-2002, 06:53 PM
"i do know that maynard has done many psychoactives in his time - from ketamine to mushrooms"

Where did you read this? Other than the references on the inside of aenima. Just curious. I remember reading recently that he had to be careful when playing the videogame Quake because after playing it too long it started to affect his ability to communicate, or something to that effect. I imagine those drugs would have a far more profound effect.

neonkat
12-05-2002, 11:44 AM
This thread actually made me become a registered user as opposed to just a reader...

I bought a book that goes into the debate over which is the better way to open the mind - drugs or straight meditation? It is called Zig Zag Zen and it is edited by THE Alex Grey (he also has quite a bit of his artwork in there too) It is definitely a good read as it doesn't actually take sides and get preachy it just presents a forum for people on both sides of the issue to state their experiences.

dissociation
12-06-2002, 12:06 AM
maynard plays quake? the first one, with trent reznor's soundtrack? hahaha, just the thought is amusing.

i don't remember what interview it was that i read about the whole maynard doing drugs thing, but it was on a much music special on artists and drugs. so, we know he does do drugs. not sure which ones aside from ketamine. we know danny does dmt from toolband.com. haha...

sorry i can't help as to which interview it came from, but it's not bullshit or a rumor :)

EmbraceTdOxOmL
12-06-2002, 01:07 AM
Originally posted by akinoyugure
I remember reading recently that he had to be careful when playing the videogame Quake because after playing it too long it started to affect his ability to communicate, or something to that effect. I imagine those drugs would have a far more profound effect.

Ha Ha Ha... I just think its funny that you are so quick to believe a rumor like that and its so hard to believe (with LOTS of convicing references and evidence) that he does or even has done drugs. I would try being more open minded and less gullable.

*note* im not sure how to spell "gullable"... maybee its a result of exploring my mind through drugs rather than meditation. Or maybee ive just been playing too much fukin Quake!!

akinoyugure
12-07-2002, 12:35 PM
Sorry, I can't explain why you can't spell the word "gullible". Maybe the problem it is unrelated.

I said I read the quake reference in an interview somewhere. I didn't say it was a rumor. Here is the link.

To be honest, from what you wrote I can't tell what your point is. I will tell you what my point in this thread is. My point is that there is more to enlightenment than paying $3 a hit. I'm frustrated by anyone who thinks they have reached some higher state because they discovered how to take drugs. I don't know whether it takes you to some "higher plane" or whether it just blocks receptors in your brain, but I do know that taking them isn't necessarily doing anything beneficial for you. Someone who is closed-minded and unintelligent on drugs is still closed-minded and unintelligent - except now they are on drugs. Do you agree?

Maybe you read my previous post incorrectly. I was simply asking a question as to what drugs Maynard has taken, and what evidence there is of it. I don't doubt that he has taken drugs. Can you provide me with an article which references this? If so, Thanks.


http://www.cdicarlo.com/paper_04maynard.htm
MK: "When we're on the tour bus travelling from city to city, we have a Play Station 2. When I play [a game called] Quake 3 for a few days, I find it impedes with my ability to relate to people.

megadan
12-09-2002, 09:38 AM
meditation always needs to be consider a better, safer, truer experiance than drugs. It's just a lot harder to do.

but.... 'Drugs have done good things'...

But my rule of thumb is, if i can't honestly say 'i love myself, i love my life', before doing any drug, i won't do it. If the day comes that i can't say that, i'll stop using them.

and Ketamine is indeed used to put animals to sleep (as seen in the notes including with aenima), see my post here for thoughts on accidental drugs: http://toolshed.down.net/opinion/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=607

dissociation
12-09-2002, 12:39 PM
it's an anesthetic, not an animal killer.


http://www.erowid.org

Metatron's Cube
12-14-2002, 03:51 AM
I agree, meditation can take you the same places as drugs do, and beyond. On the other hand, I dont regret my drug experiences, in fact many times some have changed me in very positive ways.

And if anyone read that they use ketamine to euthanize cats. I would straight up say its false. Ketamine is a controlled substance for one, making it relatively expensive due all the problems with monitoring and such that go along with that. It only causes general anesthesia or death in very high doses (and still relatively so for cats). Ketamine has used as a general anesthetic in small animals, (and very rarely in human medicine) but many clinics are shying away from it due to obvious problems. A vet friend of mine said ketamine is very rare today in US clinics.

holy reality
12-14-2002, 05:51 PM
I have to say I'm very interested in these trips you people describe, so interested that I even decided to register so I can post this.

I find tool's music to be mind-blowingly-amazing, and there have been a few rare times that their music has taken me to a "higher level", but it just isn't high enough. I feel there is so much more waiting to be unlocked, yet I can't reach it.

I have never taken drugs before in my life, but the prospects of these trips really are tempting. I have tried meditation and it just doesn't seem to work, maybe I'm not doing something right; I don't know.

I'm interested in this "ketamine" and I'm wondering how I would go about obtaining some. I know someone who runs a dog kennel type thing, maybe she could get some for me.....

I don't know; I just really feel like I'm missing out on something,.....

great deceiver
12-16-2002, 02:58 AM
im not too big on the idea of dxm or ketamine or any other disassociatives. they sound interesting, but im not too quick to trust a drug that cant be grown in my backyard. im sure that i'll experiment with them sooner or later, but id like to stick more with the idea of mushrooms. even though you dont really listen to music on those..

holy reality, if youre really considering trying anything, i reccomend that you read up and get as much info as you can beforehand. be knowledgeable and be prepared. there are loads of sites on the net that offer some really good info on all sorts of drugs.

i havent done anything yet, but i plan to sometime soon. probably just mushrooms, but the idea of listening to music whilst in a state of altered consciousness is really intriguing. im not sure what to use when going about that though. plus, the availability of these things is an issue, as i dont know where i would get it. oh well.

i think that hallucinogenic drugs and disassociatives can be helpful in ones spiritual path, but never to the point where the only way you can reach higher states of consciousness is through them. i like to think of these drugs as being a sort of catalyst for ones own development.

a bit off topic, but has anyone ever tried dmt? ive read a bunch of stuff terence mckenna wrote about it, and it sounds very... interesting.

its amazing the things that a small amount of a chemical inside of our brains can do to our perception of reality. really makes you wonder what reality really is.

holy reality
12-17-2002, 02:58 PM
Originally posted by great deceiver
.

holy reality, if youre really considering trying anything, i reccomend that you read up and get as much info as you can beforehand. be knowledgeable and be prepared. there are loads of sites on the net that offer some really good info on all sorts of drugs.

i

yeah, I don't know where to research though, if I search for sites about it, my parents could find out. They could find out by reading these boards too, but I'm new here and using a different name, so chances are they won't.

adz
12-18-2002, 12:48 AM
for *truthful* information on drugs, try

http://www.erowid.org

should have prettymuch everything u ever wanted to know about any drug.

be safe

dissociation
01-13-2003, 12:38 AM
it looks like my thread is dying a slow and painful death :(

silent-bob
01-13-2003, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by akinoyugure
I don't know whether it takes you to some "higher plane" or whether it just blocks receptors in your brain ... but I do know that taking them isn't necessarily doing anything beneficial for you .... Someone who is closed-minded and unintelligent on drugs is still closed-minded and unintelligent


it does take you to some higher place and does something to your brain, but so does meditation. see it my way for a min.

you take dxm and in three hours you'll feel one with the world and open in every sence of the word.

or you meditate and in (how ever long it takes) you'll feel at one with the world and open.

you work for you open mindedness, we drink a bottle of cough syrup for ours.

also, to dissociation, maybe when they said, "put to sleep" maybe they ment to sedate and knock out.

paraflux
01-13-2003, 03:13 PM
Dissociation, I have a question for you in the Socialize section under "For Dissociation."