what bottom means to me

[Brett]

I think the song bottom is about how you are trapped at the "bottom" of life when you are consumed by things like hate and anger. To experence true and happy life you most free yourself from aspects that keep you at the "bottom" like hate, and anger.

Oh, and I'm new here and I have not read alot of Threads, so if this is not a new thought sorry.

But then again I don't know if any thoughts are completely new.

[chaosad]

i see it a bit differently. i think its about when you are pushed to the edge, and youve got nothing left, the only thing left to live on is all the shit that has added up. your hatred keeps you alive, keeps you fighting. guilt fed, hatred fed....it all fed the fire that is burning within you. and now its time to kick some ass. i dont think they could have chosen anyone better than henry rollins to do the spoken part.

[HolyHandgrenade]

This song has a different and special meaning to me as well. I dont know if this is what He was thinking, but this is what it means to me. "Shit adds up at the Bottom" means that when you are at your worst, feeling really low, things just seem to pile up, one bad thing after another. "It makes me feel ugly."
He is feeling like shit, and on top of that, he doesn't think he deserves to, has no real reason to be. But he still cannot help the way he feels, even if he doesnt want to. "Hatred, weakness, happiness, guilt, keep me alive at the Bottom." Now he is suicidal, let me try to explain. Hatred: He hates the way he feels, hates whats in his head, and doesnt want that to kill him. Guilt: HE WON'T let that kill him, he is not going to give in to what he thinks are petty reasons for depression in the first place. This may also be guilt he would feel for leaving those who care about him. Happiness: There is still hope, he is holding on to that last thread of hope, maybe things will change, if he could just attain some 'peace of mind.' Weakness: when it comes down to it, he just cant seem to go through with it.

Well, that my interpretation anyway, i came pretty close to ending it all recently, and this is kinda what i felt.

[astralpersona]

i found this song kind of empowering, during a time in my life, when i felt my life was going to shit, feeling like my insides had rotted and things couldn't get any worse, one thing about being at the bottom, the only way to go is up, and that was an underlying mesage to me in this song, and since that time, things have gotten much better and i found a brighter outlook on life..

[Flojob]

holyhandgrenade:

i agree with you in a lot of ways, but dont you think when you're feeling guilty you feel like you deserve to feel like shit.





P.S. THE APES RULE

[conawaje]

I think bottom is about being betrayed (cheated on) by someone who you love - specifically your significant other. If you have never had this happen to you, I envy your ignorance. The emotion of this song is exactly how I felt when it happened to me.

Much of the lyrics seem to indicate that he feels this way because of the actions of another e.g. "I have swallowed the poison you feed me..." which to me means "I have accepted your BS excuse for your actions."

"I must arm myself to fight you by making weapons out of my imperfections, it's all I have left." - After being betrayed you try to blame it on yourself - because you loved the other person so much it is hard to see how they could be at fault.

"I have no choice but to confront you, to engage you, to erase you." - the most difficult part of healing from something like this. Basically, you are still in love with the person, but you accept that you must sever him/her from you, because that is the only way the pain will stop.

But what do you get after you have severed this person? Nothing. Dead inside. For a while at least...

That's my take on it.

[AllforUnity]

l agree with you completely on the way you express how you felt when you've lost someone you've loved. And the way it feels...it does make you feel dead inside...and your hate and anger keeps you alive.

When something like that, and other things in live happen to you, it makes you feel like you're "at the bottom", so to speak. The bottom of yourself...and the only reason you're alive is because you're keeping yourself alive on regret, pain, envy, ect. You just tell you're self you're not going to die from this. You're going to survive on it...you're going to survive on the poison that life feeds you.

[J_U_D_I_T_H]

i found this song kind of empowering, during a time in my life, when i felt my life was going to shit, feeling like my insides had rotted and things couldn't get any worse, one thing about being at the bottom, the only way to go is up, and that was an underlying mesage to me in this song, and since that time, things have gotten much better and i found a brighter outlook on life..

I don't mean to be rude and ignorant of the fact that you were feeling low, happens to me all the time, I'm just going to use this to express something that is worse and that really scares the fuck out of me and anyone else that really gets the picture. Over the edge = nothingness. We age so quickly in comparison to our existence in time. We are born, we live an life of attempted meaning and we die - into nothingess. there is no longer anything, we just don't exist, we don't even see nothing because we cannot. We die. Even if people wished for re-incarnation thinking it would be a cure to this problem, it wouldn't. We would not know we are re-living. It is simply taking the character out of someone and implanting it into someone else. So when people say they are not afraid of feath, they do not think enough. Death is probably the most frightening and depressing thought of any, how limited we are, what use are we if we are just to die and not know we ever existed simply because we would not exist to know that we had ever existed. We are just a milky stain on a time-line, nothing more. nothing comes of us, no point, we just live ignoring this and thinking we are "Having the time of our life". What life? The one that is so meaningless and about to end the minute it begins?

[AllforUnity]

Alot of us seem to belive that life is meaningless...l disagree...l think we're here for SOME reason, of course, we just don't know what it is yet. l think that's the message TOOL is trying to give in the Lateralus album. That no matter what happens, you should wait things out, and have more of a possitive outlook...possitive like "pain is an illusion."

[StinkfistJEff]

i see it a bit differently. i think its about when you are pushed to the edge, and youve got nothing left, the only thing left to live on is all the shit that has added up. your hatred keeps you alive, keeps you fighting. guilt fed, hatred fed....it all fed the fire that is burning within you. and now its time to kick some ass. i dont think they could have chosen anyone better than henry rollins to do the spoken part.

Actually they did...and it was Zach De La Rocha, his version is wayyy better than henry's IMO.

[AllforUnity]

l don't think it really would have mattered who said it...it's part of the song, it's great no matter.

[Cylith]

i found this song kind of empowering, during a time in my life, when i felt my life was going to shit, feeling like my insides had rotted and things couldn't get any worse, one thing about being at the bottom, the only way to go is up, and that was an underlying mesage to me in this song, and since that time, things have gotten much better and i found a brighter outlook on life..


I would have so say that I agree with you. It seems to me that the song is about being "beaten down" by life...and then you turn it around and let it make you strong. That's a pretty cool message, in my opinion.

[Cylith]

I think bottom is about being betrayed (cheated on) by someone who you love - specifically your significant other. If you have never had this happen to you, I envy your ignorance. The emotion of this song is exactly how I felt when it happened to me.

Much of the lyrics seem to indicate that he feels this way because of the actions of another e.g. "I have swallowed the poison you feed me..." which to me means "I have accepted your BS excuse for your actions."

"I must arm myself to fight you by making weapons out of my imperfections, it's all I have left." - After being betrayed you try to blame it on yourself - because you loved the other person so much it is hard to see how they could be at fault.

"I have no choice but to confront you, to engage you, to erase you." - the most difficult part of healing from something like this. Basically, you are still in love with the person, but you accept that you must sever him/her from you, because that is the only way the pain will stop.

But what do you get after you have severed this person? Nothing. Dead inside. For a while at least...

That's my take on it.


Although I don't really think that is what the song is about, I definitly know how you feel...I've felt some VERY similar feeling when listening to this song and thinking about my girlfriend at the time.

In Addition:
I've said this (or something very similar) in several other threads, and I'll probably say it again a few hundred more times: Every song can be interpreted in many ways...it's almost impossible to tell what the true meaning behind the song is...even if the writer of a song explains the meaning, it can still mean something different for YOU. I say, make these songs yours.

[Cylith]

I don't mean to be rude and ignorant of the fact that you were feeling low, happens to me all the time, I'm just going to use this to express something that is worse and that really scares the fuck out of me and anyone else that really gets the picture. Over the edge = nothingness. We age so quickly in comparison to our existence in time. We are born, we live an life of attempted meaning and we die - into nothingess. there is no longer anything, we just don't exist, we don't even see nothing because we cannot. We die. Even if people wished for re-incarnation thinking it would be a cure to this problem, it wouldn't. We would not know we are re-living. It is simply taking the character out of someone and implanting it into someone else. So when people say they are not afraid of feath, they do not think enough. Death is probably the most frightening and depressing thought of any, how limited we are, what use are we if we are just to die and not know we ever existed simply because we would not exist to know that we had ever existed. We are just a milky stain on a time-line, nothing more. nothing comes of us, no point, we just live ignoring this and thinking we are "Having the time of our life". What life? The one that is so meaningless and about to end the minute it begins?

...I'm sorry that's the way you feel...but I'd like to say two very important things:

1. There IS an afterlife...whether you believe it or not. You can disagree with me and we can have a grand 'ol time arguing about it...won't change what is true though.

2. Let's assume you're right for a moment...that there is no afterlife and you simply cease to exist when you die. Why is that so frightening and depressing...REALLY THINK ABOUT IT! It's not like you're going to care...you're not going to exist "enough" to care...you won't exist at all. And as far as life being pointless if there is no afterlife...you MIGHT be right...but once again, once you're dead and non-existant, you're not gonna care.

(By the way...life is not pointless even if there is no afterlife. We are meant to exist, we are meant to have these experiences even if they all fade to nothing when we die...there will always be people living who were and are effected by the fact that you existed. Next time you are laying in bed with your lover and about to fall asleep in his/her arms, think about this...and know the beauty of life.)

[ledCODAzep]

I've always looked at it like this.

he is at the bottom because he unhappy, weak, guilt, hateful.

during the poem, he makes weapons of his imperfections weakness guilt etc. He does this by confronting himself ie. personal demons.

What happens after this, I don't know.

Dead inside? Maybe by making weapons of his imperfections he has somehow had to crucify his feelings, because feelings are a part of what makes us human.

just my 2 cents.

[torth]

Although you do make a good point, I don't believe he has to crucify his feelings. If anything, the speaker embraces what he has to make himself stronger. Who or whatever the portrayed enemy is has put the speaker in a mental shithole. A person can only take so much before flipping out, hence the disgruntled postal workers and columbines of our time.

"I have swallowed the poison you feed me...but I survive on it." The speaker's compassion, will, and desire have all deteriorated because of this one person/thing, whose abuse he now thrives on.

I love how Tool wrote this song. You can divide the song in two from weak- powerful. He is very passive and helpless in the first, but in the second, he confronts this enemy and uses stronger verbs and sternness. He's been pushed "too much, too far, too late to lie down now." I believe him being dead inside is that he has become so numb to pain that he doesn't feel the hurt anymore. He has almost depersonalized himself to keep himself sane and alive. "I'm shameless, nameless, nothing, noone now." Not that he is transcending his old state, because the last line implies he still at the bottom, but now he has "rebuilt what's broken" and embraces his flaws to now use against his enemies.

As with the unevitability of people flipping out when pushed too far, there's also the idea that the most powerful people are those with nothing left to lose. The speaker is now naked and fearless because he's so far down at the bottom, he can't go any further. "It's all I have left, there's no other choice."

[AllforUnity]

True.

[Skinshifter01]

Everything that you all have said so far, I can relate to, but there's one little detail that I'd like to add.

I think I read or heard somewhere that MJK's step father died soon before...or maybe after...yeah, deffinately after this song was produced. Now, I've heard that MJK and this step father didn't get along...I.e. the s.f. used to abuse MJK. Maybe MJK's actually singing to this guy. I mean...if you look at Prison Sex, there are a lot of references to child abuse, we all can see it regardless of whether we buy it or not.

Now, I read in an interview...or the summary of one - that MJK didn't go to his step father's funeral and then he later came out and said it's because the man used to sodomize him...now whether this is true or not, I think that perhaps MJK is just lashing out at Mr. Step. Maybe he's showing this bastard that MJK's been pushed beyond too far and it's this guy's turn...just a thought.

[AllforUnity]

Hmmm...l don't know about that. l've never heard referrence to this interview you speak of before. Or anything to do with Maynard being anally raped as a young boy. Do me a favor, IM me on AIM if you have it, my screen name is AllforUnity...if you could, give me a link, or something, to let me read more about this matter myself.




Thanks.

[g-bay-be]

I think bottom is about being betrayed (cheated on) by someone who you love - specifically your significant other. If you have never had this happen to you, I envy your ignorance. The emotion of this song is exactly how I felt when it happened to me.

Much of the lyrics seem to indicate that he feels this way because of the actions of another e.g. "I have swallowed the poison you feed me..." which to me means "I have accepted your BS excuse for your actions."

"I must arm myself to fight you by making weapons out of my imperfections, it's all I have left." - After being betrayed you try to blame it on yourself - because you loved the other person so much it is hard to see how they could be at fault.

"I have no choice but to confront you, to engage you, to erase you." - the most difficult part of healing from something like this. Basically, you are still in love with the person, but you accept that you must sever him/her from you, because that is the only way the pain will stop.

But what do you get after you have severed this person? Nothing. Dead inside. For a while at least...

That's my take on it.


You're are 100% correct in my eyes. I was cheated on one week ago. and i had nothing left. and there is alot of poison put out and we have to eat all thier drunken stories. ARGH! pain

[AllforUnity]

Hey...my girlfriend broke up with me before she cheated on me...l think l would have rather her just done it and kept it from me. :-/

[g-bay-be]

Hey...my girlfriend broke up with me before she cheated on me...l think l would have rather her just done it and kept it from me. :-/

No you dont... cause once you find out that you gave her your heart mind body and soul just for her to throw it away and keep it from you. you will die a thousand times over on the inside. I cried for days. My volleyball coach gave me so many hugs!

[AllforUnity]

Yeah...but now l have to go through the pain of being broken up, and that sucks more than it would to live a lie.

[reflection_jimmy]

i think this song is about haveinig troubles in your life and u feel like your at the bottom of a hole and haveing the feeling like theres nothiing left but "shit adds up at the bottom" and eventually that shit will turn into a mound and the mound will turn into a hill then a mountain and youll be able to climb that mountain right out of the hole. so basically saying dont give in or give up on anything

[AllforUnity]

Yeah. That's been said a whole lot about this song. You should go read up on old threads before you start another discussion about something already discussed.

[Luna Galapogos]

If this song had anything to do with MJK being anally raped, it truly would be "The Bottom" now wouldn't it. In fact, a lof of things seem to go to the anus. Popping mushrooms through the anus, an enima (Ænima), getting annal fisted, and there are others that I have read that I can't remember. Perhaps MJK has something with the ass, I don't know, everyone's interpretations tend to lean toward the ass.

I have been at the bottom before. I felt hate, loss, death, detachment, hated. My reason for living was feeding off of my hate, loss, death, detachment, and the feeling of being hated. I was homicidal and suicidal. I plotted many ways to kill the man I felt responsible for my loss (g/f), and I plotted my own death. However, no way seemed suitable for a quick and painless death that was in my realm of grasping.

I got her back. Here I am. I survived the bottom.

[AllforUnity]

l really don't think Maynard intended any of this to be about his, or anyone elses anus. l think people are just weird sometimes and want to make up ideas of their own.

[Luna Galapogos]

l really don't think Maynard intended any of this to be about his, or anyone elses anus. l think people are just weird sometimes and want to make up ideas of their own.

I don't know about that, a lot of people seem to base their interpretation songs on the idea of it being about the anus. Stinkfist, this song, 4o, Ænima as an soul cleanse through the anus, blah blah blah. Maybe Maynard has a fascination with that part of the human anatomy. teehee, that would be funny

[AllforUnity]

l really won't believe that until Maynard tells me.

[Luna Galapogos]

l really won't believe that until Maynard tells me.

When you listen to the lyrics, he's telling you.