Dreams and the Archetype

[Tantobourne]

Here's a brief passage from a book I'm reading through

Memories, Dreams, Reflections. p 173-174; Vintage Books

...The first thing that came to the surface was a childhood memory from perhaps my tenth or eleventh year. At that time I had had a spell of playing passionately with building blocks. I distinctly recalled how I had built little houses and castles, using bottles to form the sides of gates and vaults. Somewhat later I had used ordinary stones, with mud for mortar. These structures had fascinated me for a long time. To my astonishment, this memory was accompanied by a good deal of emotion. "Aha," I said to myself, "There is still life in these things. The small boy is still around, and possesses a creative life which I lack. But how can I make my way with it?" For as a grown man it seemed impossible to me that I should be able to bridge the distance from the present back to my eleventh year. Yet if I wanted to re-establish contact with that period, I had no choice but to return to it and take up once more that child's life with his childish games. This moment was a turning point in my fate, but I gave in only after endless resistances and with a sense of resignation...

Perhaps an homage?

[Thrakandor]

Here's a brief passage from a book I'm reading through



Perhaps an homage?
I've long thought that jimmy was about reunification.

Thank you for posting this, Tant - it made me smile.

Wanna see if we can rebuild the temple?

[AllforUnity]

So are you saying you believe this song is about bringing out the child within?

[Tantobourne]

Wanna see if we can rebuild the temple?Hmmm...is there actual -work- involved? ; )

So are you saying you believe this song is about bringing out the child within?

Nope. I'm not saying that. I was just posting an interesting paragraph that had some key words and ideas in it that led me to think of this song. I can't say that Keenan has read Jung's memoirs and this specific quote but I'm interested in the similarities. Hell be 'damned, I wish I could pick the man's fricking brain about his choice of lyrics.

[crow011]

nice passage . . .

i often regard myself at different ages as not myself at all, but completely different people . . . isnt that strange . . .

[Tantobourne]

nice passage . . .

i often regard myself at different ages as not myself at all, but completely different people . . . isnt that strange . . .
I wanted to quote more but it wouldn't be realistic. The first part of the book is slow but it's picked up and he starts talking about how his research 'theories' started to evolve into a coherent whole. I think the book will prove to be a good foundation for dipping into his professional writings.

He touches on the concept of how we deal with the passage of time and how we are always anchored in the stream by the perspective of ourself at a certain point and age. He goes on to talk about how he had noticed a 'blockage' in himself and figured that the best place to look for the cause was in his past. By concentrating on certain key elements, such as how he was at the age of 11, he tends to 'knead' the memory and make more associations that he hadn't made before. At this point of the book he's talking about how he's learning to work his past by working with his patients to uncover their hidden 'blockages'.

I definately associate my past in this manner and always look back to myself as I was and use that to cast out into other dark realms of my psyche and past. It's not always fruitful but the mere effort of doing so brings about a broader base of one's selft-establishment.

So to me, and influenced by other feedback about the lyrics, Jung's recollection comes across as an apt symbol to tie to Keenan's words. It's going towards those points in one's past and uniting them into the present which in turns moves into the future. "Till one and one are one" It might sound too linear but it's just a mote in a sea of associations that we seek to unite where refusal to do so manifests as that 'blockage'. The more complex the blockage, the more arrested a person's development. Perhaps the process of union at it's basest form is linear but ones it's achieved that union in turn unites with the next one, ad infinitum.

So...I suppose to me the song is all about 'moving on'.

[crow011]

i couldnt agree with you more . . . thanks for sharing your thoughts . . .

my point was that i think of my past age-selves as completely different people . . . thats because, up until i was about 18, my life had been far from fun . . . so, when i look back now, and think of the 13 year old boy who was homeless, i cant even relate to him, because thats so very far away from where i am now . . .

its weird, too, because i dont feel like ive missed anything . . . these kids and people that are myself at different ages are simply comfortable strangers . . .

i guess blocking out aspects of my life is part of the way i cope with emotional trauma . . . i can totally see how "reconnecting" to these long-lost strangers would be beneficial to the adult crow011 . . .

and, im guessing from the lyrics, the mjk may perhaps view himself at 11 as a different person completely as well . . . by admitting that these younger people are strangers, but indeed himself, he is in effect reconnecting to himself, healing and moving on . . .

this song has been my absolute favourite TOOL song forever, and i dont think that will ever change . . .

thanks, tant . . .

[Thrakandor]

So are you saying you believe this song is about bringing out the child within?
Perhaps. Not necessarily so specific, however - I think that it's more in line with digging down and back through yourself, which seems to be one of the three recurring themes in Ænima. [The others being the cleansing of troubles and the change that results, more or less.]

From Stinkfist -

"I'll keep digging
'til I feel something..."


Forty-Six & 2

"I'm down
Diggin' through
My old muscles, lookin'
For a clue..."


Third Eye

"I stick my hand into the shadow;
Pull the pieces from the sand
Which I attempt to reassemble
To see just who I might have been..."


There are more examples out there. I think jimmy generally is about reconnecting with who you were, and using that to realise with greater clarity who you actually are. For your 'self' necessarily includes the past and future facets of your life; it requires consideration of both before and after.

[AllforUnity]

l agree in a way. l think jimmy is a song about down-grading so you can upgrade later in life. Like, to upgrade something you have to first rid yourself of something. l think this song is about finding out who you were, reconnecting with it, and learning from yourself. This entire album is about finding yourself and change. lt's about evolving into a better person.

[Tantobourne]

lt's about evolving into a better person.

*laughs* and of course the end result of becoming a 'better person' would be this (http://toolshed.down.net/opinion/forum/showthread.php?t=18381).

; )

[neo_taboolie]

Thanks for that, Tant...
He touches on the concept of how we deal with the passage of time and how we are always anchored in the stream by the perspective of ourself at a certain point and age. He goes on to talk about how he had noticed a 'blockage' in himself and figured that the best place to look for the cause was in his past.
I like what you quoted and what you said about jimmy and Jung...

Particuarly that one bit... I connected it with the emptiness of jimmy...
So are you saying you believe this song is about bringing out the child within?
It appears to symbolise his moment of child reflection... Using his childhood momories to find himself as a person, create an understanding between what is now and what was then and move on...

That's just my opinion, but don't be afreaid to give your opinion Tantobourne... Give it a shot, I'd like to hear what conclusion you draw from the article and jimmy and whether the two correlate in any way to each other...

[AllforUnity]

*laughs* and of course the end result of becoming a 'better person' would be this (http://toolshed.down.net/opinion/forum/showthread.php?t=18381).

; )



Maynard might be an asshole...but that's not the better type person l'm talking about. Finding yourself, finding truth, finding the collective unconscious doesn't make yourself a better person for everyone else, it makes you a better person for you.

[AllforUnity]

Yeah, l agree. There are 4 members of TOOL, and every one of them contributes in an entire way, not just "there's Adam, yeah he plays guitar" or anything, he plays apart of TOOL, and the syncronization of the band. As you said, Maynard is playing his role for APC. Right now he's probably listening to what Danny, Adam, and Justin have come up with for the new TOOL album and he's writing lyrics on the way to APC shows. Once he gets through with APC and exploring his more feminine side, he'll be back playing his role with TOOL.