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View Full Version : Think before you speak


Ahnijson_films
01-08-2003, 11:05 PM
Have you personally ever been angry at someone or something? Have you ever been treated unfairly and you just get so angry and upset all you want to do is cry and hit things? We've all been there. Have you ever then, in that time of pain, frustration, loneliness, been told that you're being stupid? That you're being immature, that you need to stop bitching. How did that make you feel? I doubt better. What about if you're told this by a person that supposedly loves you and cares about your emotions?
Now, what if you're in this state of anger, and so you decide to create something that represents that anger. You paint a painting, write a poem, compose a symphony, whatever. This piece of art represents all of your anger and fear and et cetera. Now, that person that loves you, they tell you that your piece of art is stupid, immature, wrong. That you are too old to be like this, that you've grown too intelligent to feel feelings like that. How does that make you feel? Even angrier, lonely, sad, betrayed. No matter how "stupid" or "immature" your problem is, if it is something you needed to express yourself about, it obviously not "stupid".
So many of you have been quick to "love" James Keenan and think he is so awesome and a genius when he creates lyrics you understand or agree with... but as soon as he does something you disagree with or don't understand you lash out with such negative and hurtful things. What if someone said your expression of anger "Sucked"? How much would that hurt your feelings?
Now, hopefully, James doesn't take offense to these rude posts and knows that these people have no clue what sadness or pain he suffered during the writing of this song and therefore have no basis for judgment of its level of maturity or importance.
I understand this is an opinion section, but downright insulting the person and people you "love" so much in other songs is just wrong.
Whether or not you like the song is one thing, respecting it is another. Hopefully next time you will think before you just go off on something like this in such a negative and destructive manner.
Thanks.

animantra
01-09-2003, 08:40 AM
Well said. I was shocked to find so many people spouting anti-T&L sentiments here. As you said, we can only imagine what maynard was feeling when he wrote this song and it is unfair, not to mention downright insulting, to dismiss his vision as "sucking" or not fitting in with the rest of the album, without his insight. No one seems to have a problem with the grudge, yet T&L absorbs a barrage of negativity. In order to let a grudge go, even even have one in the first place, you have to be angry. Anger can be a significant aspect of life, and it obviously it was when tool wrote Ticks and Leeches. Everyone needs to realize this and hopefully they will be able to embrace this song for what it is - a desperate cry of frustration and blind hatred.

SmileyGladhands
01-13-2003, 01:49 PM
Maynard has an awesome sense of humor. It's twisted. I know the song is directed at me. And I love it. Most bands are too afraid and insecure that they might lose a couple of million dollars in sales by putting a song like this on the album. That's what makes the song even better because the fact that so many people got pissed off gave him the exact reaction I know he was looking for. And even if it did cause a decrease in sales, which I doubt, they probably wouldn't even give a shit. And that is why I love it. Take your best shot Maynard. :)

Cronos
01-13-2003, 06:37 PM
Well if I was James Keenan, and God willing, someday I will be. I'd be pissed at all you little bastards disrespecting something I made for you! You ungrateful little bastards!

But Maynard cares not about his fans, the band makes music for them, because it's there passion, and it's what they want to do. He could care a less about making something to please the fans, he just wants to be happy for himself. So if you guys don't like he stuff, then you don't have to buy it. Also Ticks & Leeches goes with Lateralus perfectly. There's nothing that doesn't belong, even the final filler went in there. The one thing you could argue that didn't really need to be there was mantra. MAYBE. He appreciates his fans, but doesn't write for them.

Also you're giving yourself to much credit. The song isn't about you, or the over obsessed fans, most likely. No one really knows what it's about. Oh, and if he wanted to take a shot at you he'd use some of the martial arts he knows. Because, supposedly he does know some, then again, it could be a bald lie. Since there is so much salt to sift through about the band.

But the song in general could be just about anything, including a person...or the person that go under Maynards skin, or the person you had the relationship with and The Grudge with, whatever it is, it's up to the listener to interpret for himself because he bought it, and it's his choice what he wants to think. So if you think Maynard's taking a shot at you, more power to you.

SmileyGladhands
01-13-2003, 06:43 PM
The song to me is about the fans. Like you, I would be pissed off as well if I were him. I agree with everything you said. If i were him, I'd write it.

SmileyGladhands
01-14-2003, 05:27 AM
Originally posted by Cronos
But the song in general could be just about anything, including a person...or the person that go under Maynards skin, or the person you had the relationship with and The Grudge with, whatever it is, it's up to the listener to interpret for himself because he bought it, and it's his choice what he wants to think. So if you think Maynard's taking a shot at you, more power to you.

Cronos, I thought about your post a little more and wanted to reply again. I hope you stop by to see it......

To me the song was before you responded to me, pretty much cut and dry about who it was directed at. You could be right, maybe he wrote it for a completely different reason. And you know what, you probably are. I know they leave it open for interpretation, and that is the conclusion I came to. Is it really so wrong that i think that way? If it makes me happy while listening to it, then I'm sure, or I'd hope rather, that Maynard wouldn't have such a problem with it.

As far as what you think about him and the rest of the band, yes I completely agree with you that they write the music for themselves and not to please anyone. But I'd like to believe that a small percentage of what the band does is for the fans. For instance, making an album. Going on tour. It can't be entirely about making money. Those guys are just as much music fans as we are. We want albums and tours, they know that. So there it is. If they really cared 0% about what the fans want, then they'd sit in their basements and jam and we'd never have another album or tour to see again. Don't misunderstand me, I know he writes for himself, I know that fact. But there comes a point where you have to say, we are getting something, even if it's .005% interest from him.

You put a little doubt in my mind about the song with the way you worded your post. Which is fine, i'm always up for new ways to look at a song. I don't claim to know everything, in fact, I probably know 2% of what the rest of the fans on this board know, and I apologize for making that assumption. But then again, I read that Maynard browses the message boards on various sites, I'm sure for shits and giggles he may join and post. I know his sense of humor and he would probably write something just like you did. And if that is the case, then you did what I wanted and took another shot and slammed me personally. Thanks! :) I doubt that is true, but just in case.......