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ThreePillars
03-08-2004, 07:38 PM
Schism appears to refer to human consciousness. It seems apparent to me by the multiple references made throught the song...

By the pieces that once fit together, they refer to the human race as being one whole, and then falling apart due to egotism and selfishness. It seems clear to me that Tool understands that no "individual" differes from any other. That we are all of one existence, one consciousness, transitioning from one moment to the next - together.

When stated that the pieces fall mildewed and smoldering, they are stating that human life has been roaming this earth for a very long time now, but yet we still seperate ourself in such egotism, that brothers and lovers kill each other off for selfishness of power and greed.

When Tool brings up communication, they are blatently stating that when one loses grasp of the big picture, that this experience that we call life crumbles and wilts to something that can not be used. Something that turns into personal drama... We get so caught up in our personal lives that we lose grip of why we are here. We "cripple our comunication" by closing ourselves from what is important, from consciousness itself.

When we point the finger and try to say that there are some more innocent, and some more righteous than those that are our brothers as well as ourselves. Which mearly adds to the point that we are still nothing more than the pieces of something greater. Something more spiritually connected, lead astray by lack of a better knowledge and a better communication.

- Trygved
Thank you for your time everyone.

Thrakandor
03-08-2004, 11:02 PM
It seems clear to me that Tool understands that no "individual" differes from any other.
Then Tool has a lot of biological substantiation to do.

reedc33
03-09-2004, 05:35 AM
Then Tool has a lot of biological substantiation to do.


Is that your sense of humor? Because he goes on to talk about Universal Consiousness in the next sentence. It was a very hawkish reading of English though, because that sentence could be understood exactly the way you interpreted it.

Thrakandor, do you think it's a paradox that we could be One and yet many at the same time Thrak? The Indian philosophies/religions looove paradox. You should read a bit of Hinduism, just to understand the philosophy of it. Reality is illusion if viewed through the glasses of ignorance, which is a result of immoral action(karma). The true reality is that you are the One Consciousness, experiencing reality in order to 'know thyself'. You learn yourself by experiencing billions of opposite expriences, until it's all balanced out and you are ready to know the truth. I know you probably know the basics, but just to understand it as a valid philosophy. I know that you would argue that none of it could be proved, but then again, you'll never know until you die, or you(.......)...Anyways, I'd also recommend to you Meher Baba's God Speaks. I'm the last person to tell you you should believe in any of this. As you may know, I respect greatly those who take nothing on blind faith. In fact, I myself do the same: I rely upon my own experiences. Still, I think it would be an interesting exercise for you to read a bit about Hinduism.

ThreePillars
03-09-2004, 06:14 PM
Then Tool has a lot of biological substantiation to do.

Anyone can take a line or a sentence out of context and make a case of it, but in order to raise a legitimate argument, you need to read the surrounding text.

AllforUnity
03-09-2004, 11:21 PM
l think Maynard is exploring his more feminine side with APC.

ThreePillars
03-10-2004, 06:31 PM
I see where your coming from... Maynard isn't the same angry person he use to be, and more patience with a less agressive approach gives him that sort of sensitivity a female would carry... I am much more a Tool person, but I feel that Maynards soothing outlook is a little more peaceful. This feminine feel is more beautiful than it is inspirational, but that is just me... It just seems Tool had a stronger reason to perform.

paraflux
03-11-2004, 07:10 AM
Is that your sense of humor? Because he goes on to talk about Universal Consiousness in the next sentence. It was a very hawkish reading of English though, because that sentence could be understood exactly the way you interpreted it.

Thrakandor, do you think it's a paradox that we could be One and yet many at the same time Thrak? The Indian philosophies/religions looove paradox. You should read a bit of Hinduism, just to understand the philosophy of it. Reality is illusion if viewed through the glasses of ignorance, which is a result of immoral action(karma). The true reality is that you are the One Consciousness, experiencing reality in order to 'know thyself'. You learn yourself by experiencing billions of opposite expriences, until it's all balanced out and you are ready to know the truth. I know you probably know the basics, but just to understand it as a valid philosophy. I know that you would argue that none of it could be proved, but then again, you'll never know until you die, or you(.......)...Anyways, I'd also recommend to you Meher Baba's God Speaks. I'm the last person to tell you you should believe in any of this. As you may know, I respect greatly those who take nothing on blind faith. In fact, I myself do the same: I rely upon my own experiences. Still, I think it would be an interesting exercise for you to read a bit about Hinduism.

How exactly is ignorance the result of immoral action? I would just like you to extend your view a little further so I can see where it comes from. Also, the difference between individual Thrak and all-encompassing Oneness is the ego. We developed our ego because we needed it to filter out all the universal information we didnt need in order to develop our minds and beings (not saying this is the ONLY reason, but a main one for sure). When we understand this, usually by experiencing something outside the realm of the ego (i.e. acid trip, meditation, etc.), we can understand why we want to crucify it. We can keep all of the knowledge we have acquired through the use of the ego, yet drop that filter part that keeps us from the light.

Keep in mind I used the word "experience." There is no substitute for experience, not belief, not faith, not imagination. All of these can be powerful tools on our way to experience, but experience should always be the goal and we should drop the things that got us there (belief) when we do finally experience what we seek. Sometimes we dont always know what we are seeking until we have found it, and therein lies the fucking beauty of experience.

reedc33
03-12-2004, 05:04 AM
How exactly is ignorance the result of immoral action? I would just like you to extend your view a little further so I can see where it comes from.


I was just giving a short summary of the Hindu religion. It's not necessarily MY view. But, to extend the thought, we are ignorant because of past actions. That's the idea of karma and what they call sanskaras, which are impressions made upon the mind by actions and thoughts. These sankaras, which bulid up over countless lives, are strengthened by any unenlightended actions, including good actions and altruistic ones aimed at fluffing your own ego and confidence. Sanskaras are what separate one from knowledge of God. So, me saying ignorace is a result of immoral action was a overly simple way of saying how the Hindus think of cause and effect, karma. In truth, the action needn't be "immoral", but motivated by ego. Ego being the conviction that you are separate from the Whole, when in truth, as they say: you are, have always been, and always will be God/Buddha, etc...

Again, these aren't necessarily my beliefs. It doesn't matter if they are or not. I was merely suggesting that Thrak, who apparently was just joking and has no interest in this thread anymore(?...:(...), read about the Hindu philosophy.

AllforUnity
03-12-2004, 09:15 AM
They believe in Darma too.

reedc33
03-12-2004, 01:22 PM
They believe in Darma too.


*shrugs* Yes. I'm not trying to give a complete history or explanation of the Hindu religion. I'm sorry if I left things out...

sacredgeometry
03-14-2004, 10:09 PM
l think Maynard is exploring his more feminine side with APC.


oh rory, my words coming out of your mouth dont sound right

Junkie07
05-05-2004, 11:49 AM
I think the whole laterlus cd is based on our consciousness. It is proof in itself that it is all connected....it's all one... I just hasn't realized it...we haven't realized it, that we are all connected...and we are "all one mind".