Rock is Dead?

[BoogerTheStick]

How do you people feel when, Rock Mags and such always say "Rock is Back" and blah blah blah.....Everyone says over the past couple years "Rock is dead" and blah blah blah.

Now before someone jumps down my throte about how Rolling Stone and Spin are just Courprate Puppets and crap. I already know the speech.....I enjoy reading them...So Sue me.

But anyways......Has rock been dead? Is it still dead?

Personally I think there has been quality rock over the past few years....Until this year when the critics decided that rock was back in.

Like Tool of Course!
Rage Against The Machine
Deftones
System of a Down(I'm not ashamed to say I like them)
Radiohead
Incubus
A Perfect Circle

and yea......out of the new "In" groups in rock right now.....I'm really starting to dig The Strokes and The White Stripes....both are an aquired taste, but they do know how to rock. I'm glad the whole Lo-Fi thing is comming into style, that's how rock was meaun't to be......

But yea....I was just curious what you people though.

[abefrohmn]

Cool subject matter,

Anyhow, I think the whole glam-rap/pop music explosion pushing the rock genre into the periphery has been good for it. It's caused those in it to have to work harder and come original. I remember some stupid Kurt Loder comment (I know that thought was redundent) about how rock was dead just because Mechanical Animals was number one on the charts one week and gone the next that it was the nails in the coffin for rock-n-roll.

As much as I hate to contradict the all-knowing wisdom of coporate-shills, sorry, I meant sages like that, I'll give you the scoop to help put the industry into perspective in the last few years and in general.

What is rock if not rebellion set to music? Rock was created by our society's most disaffected and down-trodden at the time of it's inception, rural southern and mid-western blacks. Jimmi was the last original face left out of the group before it devolved into Elvis and his clones in America the RnB, and the beetles shite over here in the jolly old UK.

The baby boomers picked up the ball and irrevocably altered it and made it what it is today. The Woodstock era of "make love not war" begat punk-rock and progressive which begat our favorite era of rock, "glam rock". During this era, rebellion however found a new face in an old haunt- with blacks now in urban centers. Turn-tables and mixing boards replaced guitars and drums. Everyone from the Beastie Boys to Dr. Dre help cultivate this new voice of rebellion. Sure, it was different faces from different places rebelling against different things, but rebellion is still rebellion. And all kids, regardless of background, can relate to that inherent aspect, even if pimpin' hoes, pourin out liqour for the hommes, and what not wasn't exactly anything they could relate to otherwise. As rock-n-roll and the theocracy in America began to bury their axes, the new-lightening rod emmerged and drew the attention of a new generation living in the post-materialist west-rap. From TwoLive Crew, to Too-Short to, 2 Pac "sex and drugs" had a new way to end the old cliche. Given this angle to approach the thing from, it's not hard to understand why rap emmerged. It was just punk-rock all over again.

Now, why has it taken so little time for rap to go to crap? Sadly, market-research and analysis. Music industry types learned the lessons from watching rock's leaps and tumbles on the charts and went on to make rap the next golden-goose in the music industry. Rap is just an accelerated, minute-rice version of punk rock's plight. Rock and pop both had by the mid-nineties lost it's hunger. It'd been king for a long time, while rap was still lickin it's chops, wanting more. But the pharisees in our culture thought they'd figured out the forumala in rap of something that can never be replicated (rebellion, being real), and thus you have a legion of snarling, goofy looking guys and girls who have to mispell everything to give them an "edge". All the cookie- monster grunting and rented cars and jewlery and threats on CDs can't hide the fact they're fake as fuck. The Music Industry pharisees knew this, and decided to pre-empt it's collapse by creating the current disgusting revival of bubble-gum pop and over-playing the current crop of "I hate mommy " rockers, in order to recapture a disaffected white audiance.

So anybody saying Rock is dead is in for a bad supprise, it'll never die. Muddy Waters and Adam Jones on guitars may not seem like the same thing, they're both tapping into the same vein: rebellion. And not the mindless, faux-rebellion MTV, Ralph Nader, and KISS FM would like you to subcribe to, but mindful rebellion. Because it's the mindless-rebellion that keeps the masses in check, and mindful rebellion that keeps them moving forward. As soon as this priniciple is embraced and disseminated among the masses, then' we'll really begin to evolve and get the fuck off this planet, to borrow from the late prophet Bill Hicks.

Jesus was the first rock-star and the best one ever. Beneath the theocracy and pharisees of today telling you what he is, there was a rabbi from bum-fuck egypt (literally) who did what was right, not was written down for him to do. He called the establishment on this and the rest of the bullshit they purpetrated on the masses (much like the cultural muckity-mucks do to us now) Everyone else since, from Muhamed to Martin Luther are variations on this theme. Ever since John Locke and Thomas Jefferson made people begin to realize it was ok to believe different things and agree to disagree, it's been a matter of culture and not relgion for the most part. Last century, it was Lenny Bruce and Henry Miller jerking cultural-Joy stick out of our grand-parents hands, only to have it fumbled into the hands of maoschistic baby-boomers whose sins are being visited upon our heads.

That discourse in history asside, Rock, that is to say, rebellion and life, will never die. So long as there is bullshit and those who think they can know and plan-it-all under whose yoke the young must toil under as individuals and societies, there'll always be that one-in-ten who thinks a little different, see's a kind of another way, who'll pull us all forward and out of darkness.

[BoogerTheStick]

Originally posted by abefrohmn
Cool subject matter,

Anyhow, I think the whole glam-rap/pop music explosion pushing the rock genre into the periphery has been good for it. It's caused those in it to have to work harder and come original. I remember some stupid Kurt Loder comment (I know that thought was redundent) about how rock was dead just because Mechanical Animals was number one on the charts one week and gone the next that it was the nails in the coffin for rock-n-roll.

As much as I hate to contradict the all-knowing wisdom of coporate-shills, sorry, I meant sages like that, I'll give you the scoop to help put the industry into perspective in the last few years and in general.

What is rock if not rebellion set to music? Rock was created by our society's most disaffected and down-trodden at the time of it's inception, rural southern and mid-western blacks. Jimmi was the last original face left out of the group before it devolved into Elvis and his clones in America the RnB, and the beetles shite over here in the jolly old UK.

The baby boomers picked up the ball and irrevocably altered it and made it what it is today. The Woodstock era of "make love not war" begat punk-rock and progressive which begat our favorite era of rock, "glam rock". During this era, rebellion however found a new face in an old haunt- with blacks now in urban centers. Turn-tables and mixing boards replaced guitars and drums. Everyone from the Beastie Boys to Dr. Dre help cultivate this new voice of rebellion. Sure, it was different faces from different places rebelling against different things, but rebellion is still rebellion. And all kids, regardless of background, can relate to that inherent aspect, even if pimpin' hoes, pourin out liqour for the hommes, and what not wasn't exactly anything they could relate to otherwise. As rock-n-roll and the theocracy in America began to bury their axes, the new-lightening rod emmerged and drew the attention of a new generation living in the post-materialist west-rap. From TwoLive Crew, to Too-Short to, 2 Pac "sex and drugs" had a new way to end the old cliche. Given this angle to approach the thing from, it's not hard to understand why rap emmerged. It was just punk-rock all over again.

Now, why has it taken so little time for rap to go to crap? Sadly, market-research and analysis. Music industry types learned the lessons from watching rock's leaps and tumbles on the charts and went on to make rap the next golden-goose in the music industry. Rap is just an accelerated, minute-rice version of punk rock's plight. Rock and pop both had by the mid-nineties lost it's hunger. It'd been king for a long time, while rap was still lickin it's chops, wanting more. But the pharisees in our culture thought they'd figured out the forumala in rap of something that can never be replicated (rebellion, being real), and thus you have a legion of snarling, goofy looking guys and girls who have to mispell everything to give them an "edge". All the cookie- monster grunting and rented cars and jewlery and threats on CDs can't hide the fact they're fake as fuck. The Music Industry pharisees knew this, and decided to pre-empt it's collapse by creating the current disgusting revival of bubble-gum pop and over-playing the current crop of "I hate mommy " rockers, in order to recapture a disaffected white audiance.

So anybody saying Rock is dead is in for a bad supprise, it'll never die. Muddy Waters and Adam Jones on guitars may not seem like the same thing, they're both tapping into the same vein: rebellion. And not the mindless, faux-rebellion MTV, Ralph Nader, and KISS FM would like you to subcribe to, but mindful rebellion. Because it's the mindless-rebellion that keeps the masses in check, and mindful rebellion that keeps them moving forward. As soon as this priniciple is embraced and disseminated among the masses, then' we'll really begin to evolve and get the fuck off this planet, to borrow from the late prophet Bill Hicks.

Jesus was the first rock-star and the best one ever. Beneath the theocracy and pharisees of today telling you what he is, there was a rabbi from bum-fuck egypt (literally) who did what was right, not was written down for him to do. He called the establishment on this and the rest of the bullshit they purpetrated on the masses (much like the cultural muckity-mucks do to us now) Everyone else since, from Muhamed to Martin Luther are variations on this theme. Ever since John Locke and Thomas Jefferson made people begin to realize it was ok to believe different things and agree to disagree, it's been a matter of culture and not relgion for the most part. Last century, it was Lenny Bruce and Henry Miller jerking cultural-Joy stick out of our grand-parents hands, only to have it fumbled into the hands of maoschistic baby-boomers whose sins are being visited upon our heads.

That discourse in history asside, Rock, that is to say, rebellion and life, will never die. So long as there is bullshit and those who think they can know and plan-it-all under whose yoke the young must toil under as individuals and societies, there'll always be that one-in-ten who thinks a little different, see's a kind of another way, who'll pull us all forward and out of darkness.

Dude that was a very intresting and thought provoking.

I've tried to get into rap some.....I've listened to a lot of the popular stuff and it's so Fucking lame.......just abunch of black guys singing about "Big Pimpin" and how much money they have and crap........

speaking of rap, does anyone acutlly know any worth while rappers? I've heard Blackalicous is good.......oh well, i'm probally asking the wrong crowd.

[J1516]

Is Rock dead? No, especially not now. If this board came up a couple years ago I would've said yes, rock is dead and spinning in it's grave. Back then Thom Yorke even said "Rock is dead." But now we've got that rock revivalist movement going on, so rock is definitely not dead and as previously stated, will never die. It will keep reinventing itself when you think it's down and it'll come back again no matter how many times executive labels try and pump everything out of it, or how many pop stars become too trendy for rock.

Worthwile rappers:
Kool Keith- his Dr. Octagon side project especially. The lyrics on that album are great. It's got a very dark outlook on life appearantly but it can be really funny or juvenile at times. His lyrics have metaphores wraped in metaphores. Don't take the name to mean that he's trying to be cool, or kool.

Del Tha Funkee Homosapien- Not as serious as Kool Keith, he's definitely wackier than Kool. He's got the beats and sounds down and really doesn't need anything more. Deltron 3030's my favorite of his.

Blackalicious- the name is Blackaliciouss

Dan The Automator- Worked with Kool Keith and Del Tha Funkee Homosapien and is currently producing Becks new album.

Public Enemy- eh, I like them

[Big_D]

I believe that Rock is a genre that will never die. Of course the more commercial (read: crappy) rock is more accessible by the radio and MTV, but in the end, it is the more original and less commercially-oriented bands that will survive to become memorable and recieve long-term admiration. I believe that 20 years from now, we'll still be hearing about Tool and other such artists. However, Britney Spears and all these other pop stars will fade into dust and kicked like excrement from a boot.

[a_divine_martyr]

Rock will never die. I mean fuck, doo-wop is still around... not showing signs of life... but still there.

Todays semi-popular rock will be forever there. TooL, System of a Down, Mudvayne, Radiohead, et cetera, will be around until the band breaks up. Why? Because they do it because they love it, without the need of selling out.

To sell out is to die out... FAST.

[Choke]

"Rock is dead" - Jim Morrison

[Matter Specter]

the only place i have ever seen 'rock is dead' is M Manson saying it , but he says . "ROCK IS DEADER THAN DEATH" hes not saying rock isnt "IN" hes saying rock is past death , he is dead , and that rockstars for the mostpart are dead .

hop ethi smakes sense

[abefrohmn]

Given all the negativity my other magnum orihpus of a post "Tool the movie- why not?" has drawn. I was expecting this rant I posted to you to have me chuckling. But I was suprised to see you or anyone appreciated it. Anyhow, as far as Jim Morrison and Marylin Manson both uttering "Rock is Dead" just goes to show Kurt Vonnegut's tenet "All there is always was and all there ever was shall always be" holds true.

Anyhow, as far as good rappers (that is to say, lyricists) go. There are a quite a few, it just depends on what you want for your money. Here are some of my favs and a quick soundbyte about what they bring

2 Short- almost every rap cliche, he coined first. He's definitely an entertainer. Most of his music is about, well, fucking. A little like Eazy-E without all the "I'll blast your azz". Which is why I like him, because he pretty much keeps it realistic and non-violent. Plus, there's usually some interesting points made about society hidden in there. The best album of his is the "retirement" album "gettin it". The next two are decent and I haven't heard the newest one, but "chase the cat " licked ass. Most of his previous albums are brilliant.

OutKast
Out Kast is to rap what Alice in Chains was to metal in a very good way. Very cerebral (they're in with the Roots) but also have great beats. Don't judge them by "Bombs over Bahgdad" that song just licks balls. I seriously suggest you pick up their greatest hits CD, "Dre and Big Boy Present"

RasKas
I may be mispelling his name. But he's definitely the most deep rapper I've ever heard. Cannabis has a few songs on this level (esp. the one about the Elohim), but RasKas has a great one with the Devil and God and another about the evils of white people (hey, he's calling me a white devil and I gotta give him credit for making a strong arguement. He's that good). If you see his album with his lime-green shoes, I think that's the one with those songs.

Eightball & MJG
Eightball & MJG by and far my favorite rappers. Their flow is incredible. They kind provide the best blend of all the elements of the above. My favorite albums of theirs are "Outside Looking In" and "In our Lifetime" and "No More Glory". These albums are kind of rarities, so if you see any of them and I've piqued your interest at all, I highly suggest you grab them when you have the chance.

[Skate_03]

I think a big problem with music in general nowadays is music corporations trying to make the biggest buck they can. To do this they can't put out the most artsy, intense, and "different" bands out there. They have to promote bands that will sell. Unfortunately, the majority of people in the country are fine with it that way.

Just listen to any two pop or rock station on the radio. I bet that at *least* 5 times a day, they'll be playing the same song. Why should this ever happen? There are plenty of different types of music and different bands to play, right? The reason is that local band in your state isn't gonna sell commercial time or sponsors.

This is really too bad, because there is SO much music out there for people to hear, but it'll never happen, and the cycle of mainstream/cookie-cutter rap, rock, and pop music will continue to work its way around.

***BTW, there are some stations on the radio who are trying to get new music out there. A favorite of mine is "Sound Opinions" on WTKS Real Radio 104.1. If your in the central florida area, check out this show on Saturdays 7-10(11?). One of the hosts actually plays music, and the other two people are just as fed up with the industry as we are, so they decided to do something.

[euthanasia]

Rock, as a style of music, does not have the propierty to be alive or dead. It only exist.

Now, if I thought of rock as a person, i would say it has been dead for quite a long time, since, 4 british guys from Liverpool grab a shotgun and comited homicide.

Seguro que no muchos de ustedes odian a los beatles, no?

[Cronos]

Abe did well.

I think rock may come back, it just needs a leader.

I wasn't actually into rock because it wasn't really promoted well, and I only heard whatever was on the radio, but back then Nirvanna, Pearl Jam, Smashing Pumpkins, and other Alt Metal/ Grunge bands were very popular.

Tool actually got thrown into the Grunge mess with Nirvanna and other labels when Opiate came out.

Billy Corgan has a new band now, and they have a new album on the way or already out, Mary Star of the Sea, from his band Zwan.

He's the vocalist, and guitarist again, there's 2 other guitarists, not to familiar, the heroin addict drummer that Billy kicked out of his old band Smashing Pumpkins is back, Jimmy Chamberlain, and Paz Lenchantin from APC does Bass for the band.

If Zwan is anything like Smashing Pumpkins it'll have success, it already get's radio play because of Billy Corgan's previous success and established fame. APC sounds a lot like Smashing Pumpkins, and that's a popular sound. APC is MTV friendly, and radio friendly unlike Tool. But not to big on the media.

Smashing Pumpkins had tons of success. And they took the success well. So, if that's any indication at all, Zwan should do well, Billy Corgan is a good artist, and has a great sound, so I think if things fall into place right there will be something decent coming back.

Incubus is a good band, although tennyboppers raped it of what it really is, and turned it into something ugly. I still like the music though, but I probably wouldn't go to a concert.

[J1516]

Originally posted by Skate_03
I think a big problem with music in general nowadays is music corporations trying to make the biggest buck they can.

When did they not? Just because there were ever good bands that were popular, and just because there are big bands that are popular now, doesn't mean that the record execs aren't total dicks. It's almost as though they've started a company to make money.... oh wait.

[abefrohmn]

Originally posted by Cronos
Abe did well.

I think rock may come back, it just needs a leader.

I wasn't actually into rock because it wasn't really promoted well, and I only heard whatever was on the radio, but back then Nirvanna, Pearl Jam, Smashing Pumpkins, and other Alt Metal/ Grunge bands were very popular.

Tool actually got thrown into the Grunge mess with Nirvanna and other labels when Opiate came out.

Billy Corgan has a new band now, and they have a new album on the way or already out, Mary Star of the Sea, from his band Zwan.

He's the vocalist, and guitarist again, there's 2 other guitarists, not to familiar, the heroin addict drummer that Billy kicked out of his old band Smashing Pumpkins is back, Jimmy Chamberlain, and Paz Lenchantin from APC does Bass for the band.

If Zwan is anything like Smashing Pumpkins it'll have success, it already get's radio play because of Billy Corgan's previous success and established fame. APC sounds a lot like Smashing Pumpkins, and that's a popular sound. APC is MTV friendly, and radio friendly unlike Tool. But not to big on the media.

Smashing Pumpkins had tons of success. And they took the success well. So, if that's any indication at all, Zwan should do well, Billy Corgan is a good artist, and has a great sound, so I think if things fall into place right there will be something decent coming back.

Incubus is a good band, although tennyboppers raped it of what it really is, and turned it into something ugly. I still like the music though, but I probably wouldn't go to a concert.

Thanks Cronos,

My favorite Pumkins has to be adore. I never have had a chance to really listen to much of their music. Adore seemed to be a stumbling stone for them. Think that was the case?

[Cronos]

I think Billy Corgan broke the band up. He stated that if ever one of his records don't do well, and his band seems to be going downhill or what have you he'd break the band up, but this probably isn't the case.

He had problems with that band from the get go. James, and D'Arcy were dating, then they broke up, and there was conflict, the drummer Jimmy was a heroin addict, and almost overdosed and died, he didn't stop, he got kicked out, I think D'Arcy was on crack, blah blah blah...

Zwan has Jimmy back with Billy for drums, don't know why. He kicked him out of the old band...

Zwan sounds just like Smashing Pumpkins or close to, I mean Billy Corgan is the frontman of the band like with Smashing Pumpkins, his sound is still the same as what he wanted for Adore.

Adore was him trying to break away from his old sound. He wanted to embrace what he called, "Just really beautiful music." a more electric sound for the electric age he foresaw. He even promised Adore would not sound like his previous works.

So...Zwan will probably be familiar to the Adore sound. Whatever, it will be good because Billy Corgan is talented. Hopefully.

[(R)]

well, Jimmy actually got back with the pumpkins afterwards.... right just before they broke up.

the pumpkins were a great band. Adore is a very underated album. Everyone says it's such a crap album because it wasn't siamese dream or it wasn't mellon collie. It's a very dark album, but beautiful at the same time. their time between 96 and 98 led up to what was adore. corgan's mom died of cancer, which the song For Martha is for. chamberlain was kicked out for his excessive drug use, plus their keyboard player died of drug use. that album was bound to happen.

it was around that time that some declared rock to be dead, which is bullshit actually. though pumpkins took a different turn, and soundgarden broke up, and bands like alice in chains were nowhere to be found, rock wasn't dead. it was only dead for those who don't have a goddamn clue how to turn off the TV or radio.
i don't rely on the media to discover new bands. now i use the internet. but before then, I relied on my friends. I'd ask, "Hey, what's some good stuff," and he'd be like "I think you'll dig this shit."
That is how I got into TOOL and other bands like Rage and Radiohead. Word of mouth.

[Cronos]

I just get it from word of mouth and give it a chance. I've been told that Mudvayne and Mushroomhead are very enlightening bands. Marylon Manson is also good someone told me. His lyrics are about how God is in the TV, or something. How we all watch TV, and get everything from the TV or something. I don't know, just making fun of the morons who watch TV constantly. People just don't give him a chance based on his reputation. Plus, all the goths are crazy over him because of his darker images he shows us, and outlook on things. But it's the media that really makes him look bad. He's just an instigater, and wants the attention. But if Tool had that kind of negative popularity a lot of you may not give them the chance of day even though they got great lyrics and music.

I also heard that Faith No More is great, I've downloaded some songs, like singles, that are from various CD's, but the voice does not at all sound like Patton or whatever his name is. I got Epic, and one other song, the voice sounds similiar, while this other songs are like not FNM. But, I don't want to go out and buy some cd's without knowing if I really will like that stuff. Plus I have no money.

[Big_D]

Originally posted by Cronos
I just get it from word of mouth and give it a chance. I've been told that Mudvayne and Mushroomhead are very enlightening bands. Marylon Manson is also good someone told me.

I don't know much about Marilyn Manson or Mudvayne, but I would recommend that anyone who likes REAL music to avoid Mushroomhead. I heard their piece of crap CD at a friend's house and all it was was some guy growling and yelling along with some women screaming in agony.

<sarcasm>wow, what deep, meaningful music</sarcasm>

[Cronos]

Solataire Unraveling is a good song.

They have two singers, a growler/screamer, and a melodic singer.

I only have 3 Mushroomhead songs, and I like them. My favorite being Solataire Unraveling.

I've heard that they have good lyrics. From what I hear their lyrics are better than that of most of the crap out now. But, it's hard to understand everything they are saying.

I just heard Mushroomhead, Mudvayne, and MM have good messages behind their music.

I'm way to into Tool and Deftones right now to get into other bands, but I'm trying little by little.

This band definately sounds like Faith No More with their use of the keyboard, and other aspects, because the singers kind of do the Mike Patton thing, only they have too, since not one has the vocal range of Mike Patton.

If you like FNM download Solataire Unraveling

I have two other songs, and if you like heavy loud shit, Before I Die is good. Their music has an eerie sound with the keyboards, but I like it.

The Wrist is cool too, I like the keyboard intro. The rest sounds great too, I like the singer in the beginning, and the growler coming in after that.

From what I've heard from this band, the two singers compliment off each other greatly.

Any other opinions on them after downloading these songs would be welcome. Just want to know what someone else thinks.

[a_divine_martyr]

I like Mudvayne.

I like their lyrics. Not the deepest ever but it's not stupid petty goth shit you tend to hear alot.

I like Cold too. I dunno.

[rage]

you people.
petty mainstream shit sucks. it always will. thats just how it goes. the general population leeches onto whatever is popularized by the media and they run with it by buying the bands propaganda. tee-shirts, patches, whatever. the spread the word that this band makes you cool or whatever. most of the bands here i dont listen to and never will just because i dont like them. out of the ones listed, the only 2 bands i listen to is tool and marilyn manson. dont think thats all i listen to because it probably doesnt count for 2% of all that i listen to. marilyn manson is so popular because he has this image that either makes people like him or hate him. personally, image is nothing to me. but, being a shock-rocker, i guess the image is a needed thing. the music is actually very decent. anywho, back to other music. some good music to check out: Godspeed You! Black Emperor, Einsturzende Neubauten, ...And you will know us by the Trail of Dead, Prick, 12 Rounds, Portishead, Low, Autechre, Cog, Commander Venus, Das Ich, Dalek, Dredg, Failure, Funker Vogt, Wumpscut, Feindflug, Hocico, Joy Division, KMFDM, Kyuss, MC5, Melvins, Megaherz, Mogwai, Slint, Smiths, My Life with the Thrill Kill Kult, My Bloody Valentine, Ride, Pig, Razed in Black, Xiu Xiu, Yeah yeah yeahs. that should suffice for awhile. those bands are different in many ways and most likely may not appeal to you right now or may not if ever.

[Dub]

Shit rage, you seem to possess some amazing attribute that allows you to enjoy those bands that these other people don't!!!! What could it be??? meh, it's only a pair of ears and a will to seek out music.

It is a sad fact that many people just dont' get to hear all the great music that is out there. It doesn't bother me, I don't listen to the radio or watch tv, I usually find out about bands from my friends (who all have widely ranging tastes) and online... where getting exposure is pretty easy for a band, and it's more of an even playing field.

I listen to 75% of the bands you listed and have heard of all of them, people aren't as close minded or ignorant as you suggest, I've introduced my friends to bands they would have never heard of by themselves, and they have done the same to me. I listen to stuff that's way out of the mainstream, but I can also appreciate something that hits number one. I can share my music.

Sometimes I'll be having a musical discussion with someone and I'll start ranting about bands, when they'll start to ask me "who?" "wtf?" People want to hear great music, they just don't go out and look for it themselves, I think those that are obsessed with music (like myself... ahah) WILL go looking, and sometimes we have to show the way for other people. But you can't disregard things just because they are popular, commercial success is as much about timing as it is about accessability.

When Jim Morrison said "rock is dead", he was reffering to how rock n roll had become a spectacle. That people came to his concerts not for the music but for some sort of experience, they wanted to see what he would do, if he would perform something obscene or fall off the stage drunk. The Doors were very much a band with a stylistic vision, but Jim lamented the victory of style over substance.

I'm not sure, it might have been Mick Jagger who said that "pop music tells you everything is alright with the world, where as rock music tells you what is wrong with it."

I know a lot of people dislike this stooges garage rock revival thing that's going on at themoment, but I think it's great, it'll get people back into rock. Kids will go back and discover the bands that influenced this wave of music and a whole generation will pick up guitars once again, and this time they won't whine, like the numetal kiddies raised on grunge. They'll sing their hearts out and write meaningful songs about reall human experience and emotions.

Maybe.

ahahah

[Cronos]

I doubt it, anyone who's inspired by The White Stripes or The Hives, The Strokes, The whatever, will probably without a doubt blow hard.

Now that rock is even more popular it will be even harder to find decent musicians, because the majority will just be out there to cash in on the trend.

It's hard to find good metal because most of it is cashing in on the trend.

But, I could be over exaggerating. People could actually be inspired by...The White Stripes, to be musicians, and could actually write good lyrics as opposed to the Stripes, and could have other decent musicians backing them, and have a hell of a band. But sound nothing like the crap ass Stripes.

Here's to hoping!

[ignore-reality]

I think one of the best aspects of Tool is the fact that they can sell millions of records and go on world tours yet there still not exactly considered mainstream (I suppose you could disagree with the wide radio play and magazine hype) but they are certainly not mainstream like most other large rock acts who seem to crave the attention. So, in a way, who gives a shit what people say about rock music in general when it relates to Tool. They don't desire just to be a pop act so their popularity at the time isn't neccesarily going to effect the genre either way. Maybe you weren't relating to Tool though.....if that's the case then I don't know..

[Dub]

I don't have anything against the White Stripes. But if you can blame a great band like Faith No More for a lot of nu metal, who knows what the future will bring. How many crappy bands are influenced by tool? But the current wave of "rock" has influences of it's own, and those that feel this music rings true to them will go back and find out about the Stooges, the Velvet Underground and the other bands that have led to *this*.

It isn't hard to find good metal, all it takes is a will, I think that was the point of my last post. There is always great music and art being created, regardless of what is played on radio and television.

I alwasys hear people complaining about the state of the music *today*... but none of them can be bothred to go looking for what they want.

That's why it's important to go looking! ...and support local bands.

[Cronos]

Tool has inspired Creed, a little or a lot, I know I heard Creed talk good about them. Someone of Limp Bizkit, not Durst spoke good of Tool, and I think Staind has Tool influences.

Most likely System of a Down does.

[Dub]

Interview with mtv (ages ago)

FRED ...Tool's probably the best band I think on the planet.
WES: Yeah they're on a different level.
FRED: I can't even put them in the field there's something wrong with those guys. They're too good. They're...
DJ LETHAL: They just know something.
FRED: They know something that the rest of the world doesn't know. I mean they did it, they do it they do it.
WES: They're human, but not human at the same time.
FRED: There's something severely intense about that band. You can't get better. You can't think of one way you would have done something different. Their ride they take you on is Tool. You know, it's insane. That band, I can't even be in a category with that band. You know that band is on the highest pedestal for me.


Maynard, when asked what he thought about Fred Durst being such a fan of Tool: "if the lunch-lady in high school hits on you, you appreciate the compliment, but you're not really gonna start dating the lunch-lady, are ya?"

You've probably all heard that before...

But anyway. Good bands can come from crappy influences and bad bands can come from the best influences. I know guys younger than me who got into heavier music through bands like Limp Bizkit, the same way I got into heavier stuff from Metallica... sometimes you have to jam a crowbar into someone's third eye before they can see the light.

[abefrohmn]

Originally posted by Cronos
I think Billy Corgan broke the band up. He stated that if ever one of his records don't do well, and his band seems to be going downhill or what have you he'd break the band up, but this probably isn't the case.

He had problems with that band from the get go. James, and D'Arcy were dating, then they broke up, and there was conflict, the drummer Jimmy was a heroin addict, and almost overdosed and died, he didn't stop, he got kicked out, I think D'Arcy was on crack, blah blah blah...

Zwan has Jimmy back with Billy for drums, don't know why. He kicked him out of the old band...

Zwan sounds just like Smashing Pumpkins or close to, I mean Billy Corgan is the frontman of the band like with Smashing Pumpkins, his sound is still the same as what he wanted for Adore.

Adore was him trying to break away from his old sound. He wanted to embrace what he called, "Just really beautiful music." a more electric sound for the electric age he foresaw. He even promised Adore would not sound like his previous works.

So...Zwan will probably be familiar to the Adore sound. Whatever, it will be good because Billy Corgan is talented. Hopefully.


Hey thanks for peeping me up on Zwan. The pre-adore stuff wasn't really my cup of tea all and all (I'm not knocking, just because I don't really dig an album, I don't necessarily say it or a band inherently suck) But the songs on Adore really spoke to me. Crestfallen and Apples and oranges makes me want to cry.

I'm over here in Scotland and the radio here is atrocious to the average rock-lover. I don't see how these kids know dick from donuts about rock like they do. More power to the undergound, I guess. In God's ever lasting quest to teach me to stop bitching, he shown me things can alwayas be just a teeny-tiny worse than they are, and stripped me of even the crappy alt rock sop in Boston (even what thou hast, it shall be taken away from thee) So I've been fiending for some new tunes, and have been liery to toss 10, 15 pounds ($16- 25 bucks US) on anything for fear of getting stuck with a cleverly packaged "I hate mommy rock" album.

So I'm definitely checking it out, thanks Cronos,

MAtt

[Cronos]

No problem, but you should download some Zwan first, Honestly, being their single. I honestly don't like it, no pun intended. I mean I didn't hate it the first listen or so, but I just can't listen to it over and over like something from Tool, or APC.

A lot of their stuff seems to have to do with Love, Love is in Ruins, Honestly mentions love, love seems to be a big thing. I don't know that the hell Billy Corgan's problem is. I'm definately going to have someone burn me their original copy, because I won't put money on that just now, Honestly wasn't good enough to merit a sure fire hit, and the other song I downloaded I didn't like that much.

Basically don't buy and come back calling me a cock sucker.

[xifeelphreex]

Check out Jurassic 5, they've got kind of a 311 type vibe to them. Also The Roots are awesome if you want some more serious thought provoking shit. Neither of these groups talk about hoes, jewelry, or cars... exept for one Jurassic 5 song where dude says "Fuck your Lexus"

[rickiep00h]

Hells yes. Support your local groups. Every good major band started out as a local band, and if your local band is doing something new and different and you like it, chances are other people will too, and you can be one of those people that say "I knew them when..."

Of course, sometimes it will be so different that NO ONE will get it, in which case, you might like it more. :)