What shows?

[abrack29]

Does anyone know what show(s) or date(s) the songs on Salival were recorded? Especially Pushit, Third Eye, or No Quarter?

[hushypushy]

Some say (http://www.collectiveunconscious.org/98denver0813redrox.html) "Part of Me" was taken from 8/13/98 @ Red Rocks.

Pushit is definitely a sewn together version of several shows. The opening commentary by Maynard might've even been recorded in studio.

Third Eye, I have no idea.

No Quarter isn't a live recording, it was recorded in the studio during the Ænima sessions.

[abrack29]

Huh, for some reason I thought it said "No Quater [Live]", just checked, it definitely does not.

That's disappointing, I wanted to read the reviews of those shows, to see what people were saying, about Pushit especially. How can you tell it's a sewn together version? How is that even possible, it sounds so seamless.

[Rolo]

The [Live]-tracks are the only good thing Salival brought us, imo

[Hodge]

no quarter and maynard's dick are good

[Rolo]

Live tracks are good, Maynard's Dick was funny, No Quarter.... i dunno..... it gets me bored.

Not to mention HM2 and LAMC X(

[hushypushy]

That's disappointing, I wanted to read the reviews of those shows, to see what people were saying, about Pushit especially. How can you tell it's a sewn together version? How is that even possible, it sounds so seamless.

How is it possible? Digital editing techniques have come a long way :) I wouldn't be surprised if they dubbed extra guitars and stuff in there too.

The reason I say it's edited is because no one knows where that performance is from. Aloke Dutta didn't play many times with them, so that would be a dead giveaway. But none of those match up with the Maynard speech at the beginning.

[hushypushy]

Not to mention HM2 and LAMC X(

No one likes LAMC eh? I love that track. Kinda noisy, and it always makes me laugh.

To be honest I'm not too hot on the Live tracks, probably because I've listened to so many bootlegs. I'd rather listen to the 7/15/98 soundboard version of Pushit because it's actually real...the emotional impact is much greater.

[elusivEuphoria]

The supporting vocals by Justin on You Lied is one of the biggest highlights of Salival imo.

[SpiralOut34]

Uhm, in the liner notes on the last page of Salival..."Live Songs Recorded At: Salt Lake City, UT / Portland, OR / San Diego, CA / Denver, CO" in the left column. I am guessing it could be narrowed down by looking at their tour dates in those cities around the time Salival was released and the years before...just thought that might help.

[hushypushy]

Yeah, the shows are pretty well known.

"Salt Lake City" is probably the West Valley, UT show on 8/15/98 (the only time they played in Utah on the '98 tour). Unfortunately this show does not have any known recordings.

Part of Me
Eulogy
Stinkfist
You Lied
Forty-Six & 2
Merkaba
Sober
Pushit (alt)
No Quarter
Ænema
Opiate
Flood

Portland, OR 8/21/98

Part Of Me
Eulogy
Stinkfist
You Lied
Swamp Song
Forty Six & 2
Pushit (alt)
Merkaba
Sober
Ænema
Opiate
Flood

San Diego 3/29/98

Forty-Six & 2
Cold and Ugly
Swamp Song
Part of Me
Sober
Stranglehold
Demon Cleaner
Pushit (alt)
Third Eye
Ænema
Jerk-off

"Denver" -- actually Morrison, CO (Red Rocks) 8/13/98

Part of Me
Eulogy
Stinkfist
You Lied
Merkaba
Sober
Pushit (alt)
No Quarter
Ænema
Opiate
Flood

So...interesting then. On CU.org it lists 'Part of Me' as coming from Red Rocks. I trust Galen on that one.

One of the main problems for me is that I've never heard the Utah show, and I'm pretty sure I've never heard the Portland show either. So it's a little hard (read: impossible) to compare the CD to a bootleg.

Something I just noticed: out of these, Third Eye was only played in San Diego. That means it's "the one." Wonder why I never caught onto that before.

Beyond that, it's kind of a crapshoot. Pushit was played at all four shows. I've never heard that super polished Maynard speech but it may have been at one of the two shows I haven't heard. In San Diego, Vince was on keyboard for Pushit (as well as Third Eye). But on Salival, Aloke Dutta plays tabla for this track. I looked through all four shows' reviews on the Toolshed tour reviews as well as cu.org and I can't find any mention of Aloke being there!

You Lied was played three times. I wonder how edited the performance is. It had to be a night with a guest, so San Diego is a good bet because Buzz was there.

Merkaba was also played three times, but as a Sober intro, and usually a lot shorter than the 10 minute rendition on the CD. So they obviously edited in an ending for it. In fact I've never heard one even close to what the Salival one is like. The Red Rocks version in particular is quite different, musically and the sampled speech. Yet---I can hear some elements of the Salival version in there. Since a lot of the samples (e.g. "our body is light, we are eternal") I can't remember hearing at any live show, I'm guessing Merkaba is the most mashed up/tweaked version, not a direct live representation.


by the way, take a step back and think for a moment. Look at the four shows above. Those full shows are archived in perfect quality multitrack recordings. My mouth is watering just thinking of it....soundboard Demon Cleaner!?!?

[elusivEuphoria]

You Lied was played three times. I wonder how edited the performance is. It had to be a night with a guest, so San Diego is a good bet because Buzz was there.


I always just assumed it was Buzz. It sounds like him playing.

[hushypushy]

Sorry, that's not too clear. It says in the Salival booklet that Buzz is the guitarist on that song, but I assumed you knew that when I wrote the post.

[TOD]

I always thought Pushit was for real! I don't like this doubt. It makes me sad.

[hushypushy]

Well it's not like they used computers to simulate someone playing...it's just that they edited pieces together. The overwhelming majority of bands who release live stuff edit out the "bad" stuff anyway (guitar flubs and the like). Tool is a band of perfectionists, so I'm sure they did that. At the beginning of Third Eye, Maynard shouts "Vince on keyboards!" which they edited out of Salival.

Like I said earlier, Aloke wasn't at any of the four shows they listed. If he was, not a single person mentioned it in a review. That's what kinda weirds me out.

I wonder why, of all the stuff they could've added, they put a standard version of Part of Me. I still can't figure out what's so special about Part of Me, other than it's one of their classics. They could've used Demon Cleaner, extended Jerk-Off with the alternate lyrics, Stranglehold, or extended Stinkfist.

[Hodge]

ya part of me is a lame ass song

i want salival II

[mcnadd]

that song has personal meaning to maynard, in my view letting people he has cared about in his past go. its a long, tool epic, note the clapping by what i take as the band after the song is done. they are proud they pulled it off, and its one of those songs for me that i dont listen to often, but when i do it blows me away, maybe they had that in mind conceptually while making this different rendition

[elusivEuphoria]

The clapping came after the Pushit, not Part of Me which is not really that long and epic only in a subjective manor.

Also, what song by Tool doesn't have some level of personal meaning to Maynard? All of the songs have meaning to them in some way. Kind of a null point you made there. I find it much more likely that it was included for 1 of 2 reasons (or possibly both). 1. They felt they wouldn't be playing the song live for very much longer and wanted to release a quality version of it. 2. Without it, Salival may have been too much of a weird, experimental output from Tool that would have steered older fans of Tool away and... they are business men after all.

Also I'll apologize in advance if this post comes across as slightly harsh, not in the best of moods right now and slightly intoxicated so... thats not helping matters. It's just making me more of a prick.

[hushypushy]

I think your #1 point is a good one, eE. They never played Part of Me again after the 1998 tour, and it's likely they never will.

[ProfoundHaytred]

Ive been all over this topic for a while now and can say that Ive come to the following conclusions:


Third Eye was recorded 3/29/1998 in San Diego, CA

Part of Me was recorded 8/13/1998 in Morrison, CO

Pushit seems to be a mash-up/matrix of a few different takes. Unless it was recorded in Utah, for which there are still to this day no audio recordings.
I can definitively say that it is not recorded at Red Rocks, Portland or San Diego

You Lied was recorded 8/21/1998 in Portland, OR

Mer Ka Ba, like Pushit, does not appear to be any one performance, rather a matrix of several performances.

[creativenameisnotava]

Agreed, but with studio dubbing/editing to Merkaba.

I always wondered why they weren't one of those bands that would release a couple legitimate live albums, while they're still good live. They have soundboard recordings obviously of all 4 shows, but they don't release any of it really.

[hushypushy]

They probably have soundboard recordings of most, if not all their shows. They were recording them in 1993, and a lot of them leaked.

[creativenameisnotava]

There was the Undertow import that had the live side to it as well didn't it?

Edit: Yes, it was Aug 06, 1993: Lollapalooza - Irwindale, CA show.

[ProfoundHaytred]

goddamn we need a source for that utah show!

[ProfoundHaytred]

and for the love of god, a soundboard Demon Cleaner does exist.. when Tool get to be in their 70's I suspect we will all be in for some real good releases.